"Kramer's" Racist Tirade -- Caught on Tape

[PlayBoyWorld]

Article and video link included below. I've also kept TMZ's "warning" for anyone who might be sensitive to the racial slurs and profanity Mr. Richards employs in this video.

Nice, Kramer. Really classy.


WARNING: WHAT YOU ARE ABOUT TO SEE IS PROFANE AND RACIAL

Michael Richards exploded in anger as he performed at a famous L.A. comedy club last Friday, hurling racial epithets that left the crowd gasping, and TMZ has obtained exclusive video of the ugly incident.

Richards, who played the wacky Cosmo Kramer on the hit TV show "Seinfeld," appeared onstage at the Laugh Factory in West Hollywood. Kyle Doss, an African-American, told TMZ he and some friends were in the cheap seats and he was playfully heckling Richards when suddenly, the comedian lost it.

The camera started rolling just as Richards began his attack, screaming at one of the men, "Fifty years ago we'd have you upside down with a f***ing fork up your ass."

Richards continued, "You can talk, you can talk, you're brave now motherf**ker. Throw his ass out. He's a ******! He's a ******! He's a ******! A ******, look, there's a ******!"

The crowd is visibly and audibly confused and upset. Richards responds by saying, "They're going to arrest me for calling a black man a ******."

One of the men who was the object of Richard's tirade was outraged, shouting back "That's un-f***ing called for, ain't necessary."

After the three-minute tirade, it appears the majority of the audience members got up and left in disgust.

Attempts to reach Richards' reps were unsuccessful.

Link to article (http://www.tmz.com/2006/11/20/kramers-racist-tirade-caught-on-tape/)

Link to Video (http://us.video.aol.com/video.index.adp?mode=1&pmmsid=1772645)

[MikeD]

Read about this on MSNBC, haven't seen the video yet (no audio on this workstation at the job).

Judging by the article, he flat out lost it. Totally over the top. I know it says he made amends afterwards, but I don't see how. :2far:

[RIVERWIDOW]

What a racist moron. I hope he gets just as much flak as Mel did because to me this was way worse. He just kept repeating it.

[Cubsfan]

He's still alive?

[PlayBoyWorld]

I watched the video at work with little to no audio. TMZ added subtitles to help you understand some of the stuff that was being said. I don't know what this guy's deal is--did he think he was being funny? He really went way too far with this. Seriously. I'm glad people started walking out. I wonder if the club's management would've escorted him off the stage if he hadn't left on his own.

[InfiniteNothing]

Guy's luky he didn't take a beating.

[PlayBoyWorld]

Guy's luky he didn't take a beating.

No kidding. Bet he had someone escort him to his car.

[Daedalus]

I hope he's got a lot of money saved up cause he won't be getting any gigs from here on out. Un-freakin-believable. Wonder how they'll try to spin this one. Schizophrenia? Tourettes?

[MikeD]

Question: would this be as big a story if the race roles were reversed?

[PlayBoyWorld]

What I find amazing is that the Laugh Factory let him perform AGAIN the next night!!


Richards performed the next night at the Laugh Factory without incident.

And he said he made "amends"--what kind of amends??

[Memo]

Question: would this be as big a story if the race roles were reversed?

No, people would be laughing and thinking it was part of the routine. But then again, there isn't an equivalent for "******" when speaking about white people.

[PlayBoyWorld]

Question: would this be as big a story if the race roles were reversed?

MikeD, this reporter seems to ask the same question:


Defending Michael Richards (a.k.a. Kramer)

By DAVE McGURGAN
phillyBurbs.com

Michael Richards, who played Kramer in "Seinfeld," is feeling what it's like to be on the hot seat.

That's because of this video of Richards' performance at the Laugh Factory in L.A. from last Friday.

After a heckler interrupts his performance one too many times, Richards proceeds to rip the guy a new a-hole, repeatedly berating him and calling him "n*****."

At one point someone in the audience yells back at Richards, "That was uncalled for you f***ing cracker-ass motherf***er!"

Is anyone going to jump on THAT guy's case for HIS racist comments? Survey says ... no.

I can hear the knee-jerk reaction of the politically correct media coming a mile away on this one:

Michael Richards is a racist and should apologize for what he's said.

How much do you want to bet Jesse Jackson gets involved or even worse - sicks his posse on Richards over this?

Unfortunately Richards has already lost the battle.

Which is a shame because it's impossible to logically draw the conclusion that he's a racist from the incomplete and edited piece of tape that only runs two-and-a-half minutes.
Click here

Sure, he says "n****" an awful lot, but without the entire context of the show, we don't know what factors led up to Richards' tirade against the heckler.

Was he responding to racist comments initiated by the heckler?

In Richards' defense, there are those hecklers (often under the influence of alcohol) who repeatedly interrupt performers, ruin the show for everyone and royally piss off the comedian. I've seen it happen more than once.

To brand Richards a racist based on this clip or the chatter flying around on the Internet and cable news channels would be stupid, naive and uninformed.

But then again, that would be America and its overly politically correct culture in action.

Link (http://www.phillyburbs.com/pb-dyn/news/83-11202006-744776.html)

[eSDee]

Damn that was a serious meltdown. Sounds like he's right on schedule for a visit to a mental facility. I don't think you can really defend it.

[InfiniteNothing]

And he said he made "amends"--what kind of amends??

It's going to take a whole lot of will power not to make a joke about KFC and Kool-aid

[Houdini]

Damn that was a serious meltdown. Sounds like he's right on schedule for a visit to a mental facility. I don't think you can really defend it.

Nah. Again, I'll withhold judgment until I have more information. I've never seen his act and have no idea what happened immediately before it, etc. That's just me. Maybe he lost his temper at some idiot who was interrupting the show. I've been to enough shows where the entertainers have had to do similar things, and I have performed in venues where nobody has any fun because of a couple of drunk/high/asshat people.

This isn't any mental illness, and it isn't a crime. Racial slurs aren't polite, but they aren't illegal or indicative of illness either.

[PlayBoyWorld]

Seinfeld was scheduled to appear on Letterman tonight. Apparently, Kramer will also make an appearance (via satellite) to apologize for what he said. Rumor has it he'll be "near tears" when he apologizes.

[zenbooty]

Racial slurs aren't polite, but they aren't illegal or indicative of illness either.
I don't know. I question the capacity of an individual who can't see that of all the invective he could have come up with in his imagination, the one he's chosen is probably the only one that will effectively destroy his career, at least for the near future. Such lack of self-preservation instinct may be indicative of a delusional or self-destructive mental state.

[DarkFury]

:2far: <--- nuff said.

[Prngr44]

I'm pretty sure the video is taken out of context because the whole premise is the hecklers heckling leading up to his meltdown...and we only get the meltdown.

The media will overreact again, Kramer will check into Anger Mgmt. or rehab or both and then everyone will move on to the next politically incorrect story that's been blown out of proportion.

[Houdini]

I don't know. I question the capacity of an individual who can't see that of all the invective he could have come up with in his imagination, the one he's chosen is probably the only one that will effectively destroy his career, at least for the near future. Such lack of self-preservation instinct may be indicative of a delusional or self-destructive mental state.

Nothing there is indicative of delusions or other symptoms of mental illnesses. I just see a stage performer who got really pissed at some hecklers who did something before the video starts and decided to be really shocking in his retort. I only say this because of his multiple accent changes during the tirade, etc. People were laughing first, and then stopped. He carried it too far and didn't have a good "out."

At any rate, there's no sign of mental illness, delusions, or anything else. He's a freakin' comedian and a stage performer who overreacted. I've seen many stage performers react badly to hecklers, and it really sucks to be heckled on stage. He blew up, overreacted, said some bad things, etc.

[mcs328]

I've seen the video where the guy demeans the women in his audience and they come up and punch him. Sometimes the audience loses it also.

[PlayBoyWorld]

Did anyone catch Kramer on Letterman last night? You'd think he would've at least prepared a statement or something. Dude seemed totally off his gourd, started bringing up Katrina and stuff.

Link (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=quhhj3dX0qU)

[bagel]

I was toasting in the oven when Michael Richards was speaking on Letterman. I think that he was more at a loss of words after apoligizing. It almost seemed like he didn't know what else to say, but Letterman was expecting more from him.

[Prngr44]

Did anyone catch Kramer on Letterman last night? You'd think he would've at least prepared a statement or something. Dude seemed totally off his gourd, started bringing up Katrina and stuff.

Link (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=quhhj3dX0qU)

I heard the interview on morning radio but I'll check the link when I get home.

I do agree though, it did seem odd the direction his apology went.

[ShawnLee]

Sucks with what happened. I saw the interview last night on Letterman. I'm more annoyed with the people in the audience who seemed to think the whole thing was a joke and were chuckling all over the place.

When Jerry Seinfeld has to tell you to shutup and stop laughing cause it's not funny? Yeah. It's not funny. Maybe it's funny that there's irony that Jerry Seinfeld is telling you not to laugh , but generally no.

Sad. No good can come of this. It doesn't advance the national discourse that I can tell.

[PlayBoyWorld]

But see, you're assuming that everyone in the audience knew what happened with Kramer over the weekend. I think they were laughing because they felt a skit coming on. I mean, it was pretty weird for Kramer to make such a serious announcement on Letterman. It's not like he went on the Larry King show to do it, know what I mean?

[Houdini]

Sucks with what happened. I saw the interview last night on Letterman. I'm more annoyed with the people in the audience who seemed to think the whole thing was a joke and were chuckling all over the place.

When Jerry Seinfeld has to tell you to shutup and stop laughing cause it's not funny? Yeah. It's not funny. Maybe it's funny that there's irony that Jerry Seinfeld is telling you not to laugh , but generally no.

Sad. No good can come of this. It doesn't advance the national discourse that I can tell.

:stupid:

I felt bad for him during the sat interview. He really seemed at a loss for words. I think I would be too. What else can someone say in a situation like that. He apologized, asked for forgiveness, talked about how his actions were stupid, counter to advancing the national discourse on race, etc. The Katrina thing was a little bit of a non-sequitor, but he tried to make it relevant in discussing other victims, etc., I guess. He seemed really uncomfortable. I don't know how I would have handled it better myself.

[roboo7]

man that is so weird. i've always associated him with being funny kramer. his face is like a symbol of sillyness. hearing something corny like that come out of his face is almost odd. guess his personal life just isnt as charming as his tv persona. he looked pretty shattered in the interview with letterman. i hope he dosent kill him. i also hope he grows his kramer hair out. thatd be awesome.

[stufine]

he's an actor.. so he could look normal. apology? yeah i think he should. does making racist comments make him a racist? does making racist comments and also dating a black girl make you a racist? does a black girl saying n***** and never dating a white guy make her a racist?

[KIISQueen]

he's an actor.. so he could look normal. apology? yeah i think he should. does making racist comments make him a racist? does making racist comments and also dating a black girl make you a racist? does a black girl saying n***** and never dating a white guy make her a racist?

I don't think that makes him a racist. Okay so he lost his cool and said some nasty things. He tried to apologise and people still down him. He's human come on I'm sure there's people out there that had or even thought of some racist remark.

I don't see why they are making this such a big deal, White, Asians and Mexicans get picked on all the time, And it's not a big deal.

:cheers:

[DarkFury]

I don't think that makes him a racist. Okay so he lost his cool and said some nasty things. He tried to apologise and people still down him. He's human come on I'm sure there's people out there that had or even thought of some racist remark.

I don't see why they are making this such a big deal, White, Asians and Mexicans get picked on all the time, And it's not a big deal.

:cheers:
Honestly, I don't agree with your assessment...

And you wonder why there is still such a racial divide in this country. I guess folks who "keep it to themselves" are better than the ones who openly expose their racist views :shrug: Honestly, it's those kinds of feelings in one's heart that really tell the story to me.

As far as picking on other minorities (and Whites... go figure :shrug: ).... well dayuum. Other than dealing with illegal immigration issues, I very rarely hear much along those lines... Yet we've gone down this road before. Nobody seems to have a generic "racial slur" that seems to carry as much baggage as the N-bomb and of course when it comes out like in this situation it is gonna cause a stir.

Now please... stop defending his indefensible position. Yeah, he was wrong... and was his "apology" sincere? Well in that... we shall see. Either way, it is obvious to me that his concience didn't prevent him from spewing that garbage, so for now, let him stew in it. Maybe one day he'll really realize the err of his ways (then again... maybe not. Maybe he'll only learn to be more careful to not let his true personality slip out in public next time. Who knows....)

Personally, I never really cared for Seinfeld or "Kramer's" comedy before, and now I care even less for them. But that's just my own personal feelings on that. Pfffft!!!!

[dsuds]

Is Richards a racist? Who knows. From the video it's obvious that he is in "full rage" mode. When people are that angry they will say the most hurtful things that they can think of. The N-bomb definitely falls into that category. Am I trying to defend his actions? Absolutely NOT! What he did was deplorable under any circumstances.

I also think one thing we should consider is comedians are not the most mentally stable people. I've always wondered if there is something in their genius that makes them this way... kinda like an idiot savant. Just think about some of the best and remember what their problems are/were.

[Airencracken]

Is Richards a racist? Who knows. From the video it's obvious that he is in "full rage" mode. When people are that angry they will say the most hurtful things that they can think of. The N-bomb definitely falls into that category.

:stupid:

Extremely good point.

[DarkFury]

Is Richards a racist? Who knows. From the video it's obvious that he is in "full rage" mode. When people are that angry they will say the most hurtful things that they can think of. The N-bomb definitely falls into that category. Am I trying to defend his actions? Absolutely NOT! What he did was deplorable under any circumstances.

I also think one thing we should consider is comedians are not the most mentally stable people. I've always wondered if there is something in their genius that makes them this way... kinda like an idiot savant. Just think about some of the best and remember what their problems are/were.
I can understand that, but in the video, you can clearly see/hear that the person he was disparaging was trying to tell him... "That was uncalled for" yet he continued his tirade. I didn't hear that guy call Kramer any "racial epitets", yet Kramer went on and on with it.

I just wonder what he would have said to a "white" heckler? Would his language been as strong? Or would he have just resorted to calling that person a generic slur like "@sshole" or something of the sort?

[Up N Here]

...I didn't hear that guy call Kramer any "racial epitets", yet Kramer went on and on with it.

Although, I do agree with your position DarkFury, on the video that aired on TMZ.com, I did hear the guys that were being attacked eventually respond to Kramer with some derogatory comments. But the comments were clearly solicited based on the treatment they'd received from him. What a mess this whole thing has turned into. It's interesting to see what the pressure of fear and rejection manifests in an individual...:disa:

[dsuds]

DF,

From what I saw on the video, Richards was in a blind rage. A simple "that was uncalled for" would not be enough to snap him out of this. Near the end of the video there are a few responses of cracker and MF which, to me anyway, don't carry nearly the same weight as the n-bomb.

Would he have acted differently to a white heckler? I dunno. But even if he had gotten as mad, what would he have said? MF this, MF that, a-hole, son of a bitch. That wouldn't garner much of an emotional response. To do that you'd have to start attacking their ancestry, which he probably would have done. Even then it would not have gotten the media attention this has.

As a side note, I remember when MF used to carry a lot of weight and when used would shock the listener. Anymore, it just gets a shrug or a head shake. The n-word is one of the few words that still carries its shock value, but even that is changing with the common use of the slang word "nigga". What's interesting though is this is a "black only" word. A white guy can't say it at all, and an Asian gets a "wtf?" look when they use it.

[MikeD]

This is the standard reaction to this type of incident. It's only a big deal because the audience member was black, and Richards is white. If you change the race roles of any of the participants, it's not catching nearly as much attention.

And of course, Jesse is now involved. How convenient. I figured he would still be down at Duke, helping those lacrosse players clear their name. :thumb:

[PlayBoyWorld]

Richards HAS done this before, and his tirade was directed to a white guy...who happened to be Jewish.


Richards' Rant -- Not The First Time
Posted Nov 22nd 2006 2:10PM by TMZ Staff

Did Michael Richards attack the Jews? Two Los Angeles residents have come forward and said that's exactly what happened last Spring at L.A. comedy club, The Improv.

Carol Oschin and J.P. Fillet say they were at The Improv on April 22 when Richards took the stage. They say that in the middle of Richards' skit, a man in the audience said something to the comedian, when Richards allegedly launched into an anti-Semitic rant. According to Oschin, Richards screamed at the audience member, "You f***ing Jew. You people are the cause of Jesus dying."

Oschin says the rant continued and Richards stormed off the stage. Oschin and Fillet say that, at first, they thought Richards' tirade was part of his act, but claim that it quickly became apparent it was not.

Richards' publicist, Howard Rubenstein, confirmed to TMZ that Richards did make derogatory comments about Jews, but says it was part of his act. Rubenstein says Richards told him, "I'm not anti-Semitic. I was playing a role and poking fun at the rednecks." Link (http://www.tmz.com/2006/11/22/richards-rant-not-the-first-time/)

So apparently Kramer thinks this is funny, and a good "ice breaker," perhaps? I just don't think he's funny--definitely not as funny as he, apparently, thinks he is. I think he's probably a piss-poor standup comedian who is unable to deal with hecklers, and in his mind, he created this technique to "put them in their place."

It's true what KiisQueen said about other races being made fun of, comedians do it all the time. However, it's one thing to, for example, make a clever joke about Mexicans being lazy, and quite another to just stand there saying, "You f**kin wetbacks! F**k you, beaners!" That's not funny, that's just hateful. What's funny about that?

[MikeD]

:rolleyes:

Exactly what I'm talking about. While not as much proof as in the current case (with video), it looks like he's done it before. Where was the outrage then?

It's only a big deal because of the races involved. For that, this whole thing gets a big whaaaatever. :thumbdown

[cheapie]

Honestly, I don't agree with your assessment......snipped


I dunno what to think about this. Is it always because they are a closet racist and this type of event/mental lapse just allows the crap in the closet to show its ugly face?

Or is it sometimes that when in a certain situation in which you have no control over your emotions your mind lashes out and reaches for whatever the worst thing you could say?

Do you think we all have a little bit of latent likes/dislikes of other races based on previous experiences with other races/cultures that, while we fully realize don’t justify labeling and entire race/culture as being inferior, still exist and stand out in our minds and sometimes overpower the reasonable and smart part of our brain when those parts take their leave while being outraged, drunk, or in a state of extreme duress? Could even non-racist people utter something, or act in a racial way based on things that have happened to them or situations they’ve been exposed to which have made a nest in their unconscious without them having much control over its existence?

I’ll talk about me for instance. I grew up in a predominantly white culture until I moved to Fort Wayne for 4-5 years in college. We moved into a virtually all-black neighborhood and I and my family were subject to some harassment, a severe and unprovoked beating of my brother and cousins, and countless thefts.

Now…I FULLY realize that my experience in now way represents how all black people act, are raised, and will treat me. BUT, if I was ever in an extremely tense and potentially violent situation, I’ll bet I’d be a little more fearful because of those memories. Probably the same way black men feel whenever a cop looks at them twice and grow nervous even though they likely have nothing to hide.

But I’m hoping that if I were in a fight with a black guy, or in a shouting match, there’s gotta be a switch in there somewhere that says, “nope….the “N” bomb is and never will be acceptable to use.”

[DarkFury]

DF,

From what I saw on the video, Richards was in a blind rage. A simple "that was uncalled for" would not be enough to snap him out of this. Near the end of the video there are a few responses of cracker and MF which, to me anyway, don't carry nearly the same weight as the n-bomb.
I bet if someone would have come out of the audience and "black boot stomped his @ss to sleep", that would've snapped him out of it really quick... But then, he would've become the "victim" in all of this. Hmmm... :hmm:


Overall, I'd say that he was a lucky man... or at least in a place where he wouldn't have gotten bum rushed for his actions.

C'mon Kramer... c'mon down to the APOLLO and start usin' the "N-Bomb"... and see who gets a fork stuck up their @ss. :heh:

[DarkFury]

I dunno what to think about this. Is it always because they are a closet racist and this type of event/mental lapse just allows the crap in the closet to show its ugly face?

Or is it sometimes that when in a certain situation in which you have no control over your emotions your mind lashes out and reaches for whatever the worst thing you could say?

Do you think we all have a little bit of latent likes/dislikes of other races based on previous experiences with other races/cultures that, while we fully realize don’t justify labeling and entire race/culture as being inferior, still exist and stand out in our minds and sometimes overpower the reasonable and smart part of our brain when those parts take their leave while being outraged, drunk, or in a state of extreme duress? Could even non-racist people utter something, or act in a racial way based on things that have happened to them or situations they’ve been exposed to which have made a nest in their unconscious without them having much control over its existence?

I’ll talk about me for instance. I grew up in a predominantly white culture until I moved to Fort Wayne for 4-5 years in college. We moved into a virtually all-black neighborhood and I and my family were subject to some harassment, a severe and unprovoked beating of my brother and cousins, and countless thefts.

Now…I FULLY realize that my experience in now way represents how all black people act, are raised, and will treat me. BUT, if I was ever in an extremely tense and potentially violent situation, I’ll bet I’d be a little more fearful because of those memories. Probably the same way black men feel whenever a cop looks at them twice and grow nervous even though they likely have nothing to hide.

But I’m hoping that if I were in a fight with a black guy, or in a shouting match, there’s gotta be a switch in there somewhere that says, “nope….the “N” bomb is and never will be acceptable to use.”
I'm inclined to believe that we all have some "control" of what we say...

And if you don't exercise that control... you suffer the consequences.

Obviously, Mr. Kramer doesn't exercise that control (as per his previous outburst with the Jews...)

[Airencracken]

Can everyone please stop calling him Kramer? It's starting to really get on my nerves.

His name is Micheal Richards, not Kramer. Kramer is a fictional character. Mr. Richards is a person.

M'kay? M'kay.

[DarkFury]

Can everyone please stop calling him Kramer? It's starting to really get on my nerves.

His name is Micheal Richards, not Kramer. Kramer is a fictional character. Mr. Richards is a person.

M'kay? M'kay.
In my head, he'll always be "Kramer"

Just like "Greg Brady"... that's just his name now.


Guess we'll just have to keep on getting on your nerves with this one. :D

[riskykougra]

In my head, he'll always be "Kramer"

Just like "Greg Brady"... that's just his name now.


Guess we'll just have to keep on getting on your nerves with this one. :D
Which is probably why he gets so insane. He must of finally realized that Seinfeld carried him all these years and without that show he would still be a no one. I wonder if Seinfeld knew about his attack of Jewish people and if he would of been standing behind him had he known about that. Its hard to comment on a thread like this because I find it so nauseating. My father and grandmother on his side are extremely racist to the point that you cant even watch TV without some ignorant comment. Had to put a stop on those REAL quick once I had children because I didnt want them to be fearful of people because of skin color like I remember being as a child. I can honestly say, thank god, that their smallminded, ignorant opinions have not lasted with me as an adult and my kids dont even seem to notice a difference in peoples skin color, which is the way it should be. Does Jessie Jackson standing behind him convince me he is sorry...nope...but it does show Jessie has more character than I do because I am white and would more than likely of given Richards a thumping for that tirade.

[cheapie]

I'm inclined to believe that we all have some "control" of what we say...

And if you don't exercise that control... you suffer the consequences.

Obviously, Mr. Kramer doesn't exercise that control (as per his previous outburst with the Jews...)


absolutely correct. my point is not that his lapse in control is excusable. but rather that if/when you do so, racist thoughts or language might slip in without you necessarily being a racist. i think.

just my $.02

[dsuds]

I bet if someone would have come out of the audience and "black boot stomped his @ss to sleep", that would've snapped him out of it really quick...
As would have been their right to do so. :)


c'mon down to the APOLLO and start usin' the "N-Bomb"... and see who gets a fork stuck up their @ss.
Funny, I was thinking the same thing. :fro:

I'm all for "personal responsibility" on this. If you screw up (and he did) then you admit it and pay the price, which it looks like he is doing. That much I give him credit for, but only if he is sincere about the apologies and not just doing damage control.

[DarkFury]

absolutely correct. my point is not that his lapse in control is excusable. but rather that if/when you do so, racist thoughts or language might slip in without you necessarily being a racist. i think.

just my $.02
The funny thing is... I can dislike you as a person (not that I am saying that here) and if I feel so inclined to speak out to disparage you... the first negative words out of my mouth wouldn't be anything towards your racial background.

I'd probably talk about yo Momma first... :heh: Skanky beeeyatch!!!! :heh:

But honestly, I feel that people who harbor those racist feelings can and do let them slip in moments of anger (i.e. your subconcious says something that your concious usually represses... which tattle tells on your real feelings on the subject.)

Meh... I guess we just have a difference of opinion here. :shrug: We can just agree to disagree and move on if that is the case.

[cheapie]

The funny thing is... I can dislike you as a person (not that I am saying that here) and if I feel so inclined to speak out to disparage you... the first negative words out of my mouth wouldn't be anything towards your racial background.

I'd probably talk about yo Momma first... :heh: Skanky beeeyatch!!!! :heh:

But honestly, I feel that people who harbor those racist feelings can and do let them slip in moments of anger (i.e. your subconcious says something that your concious usually represses... which tattle tells on your real feelings on the subject.)

Meh... I guess we just have a difference of opinion here. :shrug: We can just agree to disagree and move on if that is the case.

i pretty much agree. the bible basically says, "as a man thinks, so is he." it also says, "what's in the heart, comes out the mouth." or something like that.

what i'm saying is that in a moment of rage, a person's mind might be reaching around for the worst things to say and if he's got even a little bit of lingering anti-whatever, that might come out in such an event and make it look like that's how the person is.

if my kid does something absolutely assinine and i go ape and call him an idiot, i really don't think that normally. i just snapped and lashed out. i wouldn't really call it revealing "your real feelings" so much as revealing a dark piece of your personna which might only make up a tiny bit of it and not fairly represent what you are as a whole.

if it happens repeatedly, then it's imho apparent that it might indeed be a larger part of their persona than they would otherwise admit.

kinda like that dude on the weightlifting forum that did that one thing while drunk. :hihi:

[ShawnLee]

The funny thing is... I can dislike you as a person (not that I am saying that here) and if I feel so inclined to speak out to disparage you... the first negative words out of my mouth wouldn't be anything towards your racial background.

I'd probably talk about yo Momma first... :heh: Skanky beeeyatch!!!! :heh:

But honestly, I feel that people who harbor those racist feelings can and do let them slip in moments of anger (i.e. your subconcious says something that your concious usually represses... which tattle tells on your real feelings on the subject.)

Meh... I guess we just have a difference of opinion here. :shrug: We can just agree to disagree and move on if that is the case.I agree 100% with what you just wrote. That said, I don't think that those who harbor racist feelings even consciously know they're racist. Now, does this mean everyone is racist? Maybe. And I'm cool with that. I fully admit that I have a very slight racist side to me that I dislike and find disgusting, but can't always get rid of. The problem, I think, with racism is that there's such a fine line from where ethnic pride (which most will agree is good) ends and racism (where most will agree is bad) starts. But if everyone can keep it in check so that this built-in factor is culturally minimized? Eh, live and let live.

So, does Michael Richards (or Kramer for Airen ;)) have a racist side? Certainly, at the very least, he has a side which knows exactly which racist buttons to push when he's angry. Does this make him a despicable person? No more so than the average, I'd say. Just a stupid one.

[Napoleon54]

I'm amazed by how much weight the n-word still carries. Richards could've used just about any other word in the entire English language and his comments wouldn't have been deemed so outrageously offensive. Why is that?

While I don't condone Richards's statements, I do think it's high time that society moves on and decides to be less easily offended by some things. IMO the audience (and everyone else, really) is wrong for being so sensitive, and Richards is wrong for intentionally playing on that sensitivity.

There's something noble and mature about being able to let insults roll off of your back, rather than getting all riled up. It shows strength of character.

Just my 2 cents.

[Houdini]

Richards HAS done this before, and his tirade was directed to a white guy...who happened to be Jewish.

Link (http://www.tmz.com/2006/11/22/richards-rant-not-the-first-time/)

So apparently Kramer thinks this is funny, and a good "ice breaker," perhaps? I just don't think he's funny--definitely not as funny as he, apparently, thinks he is. I think he's probably a piss-poor standup comedian who is unable to deal with hecklers, and in his mind, he created this technique to "put them in their place."

It's true what KiisQueen said about other races being made fun of, comedians do it all the time. However, it's one thing to, for example, make a clever joke about Mexicans being lazy, and quite another to just stand there saying, "You f**kin wetbacks! F**k you, beaners!" That's not funny, that's just hateful. What's funny about that?

I've always heard that he used that with intentional irony as he himself is Jewish.

[Houdini]

I bet if someone would have come out of the audience and "black boot stomped his @ss to sleep", that would've snapped him out of it really quick... But then, he would've become the "victim" in all of this. Hmmm... :hmm:


Yeah, but beating the hell out of someone is a helluva lot worse than calling them any word out of the dictionary. Sticks and stones...

[Jeffbx]

I'm glad I'm not the only one who finds it amazing (and appalling) that people think a violent physical reaction is appropriate in response to the utterance of a single word.

[MikeD]

:stupid: Both of 'em.

Too bad it's too often the standard, though. :disa:

[DarkFury]

I'm amazed by how much weight the n-word still carries. Richards could've used just about any other word in the entire English language and his comments wouldn't have been deemed so outrageously offensive. Why is that?

Do you REALLY have to ask that? Isn't it painfully obvious?

Like EsDee said in another thread... I guess folks really are "desensitized".

People should be EMBARRASED just to even use those kinds of words, yet they aren't. No good can come from them, so why even go there.


Yeah, but beating the hell out of someone is a helluva lot worse than calling them any word out of the dictionary. Sticks and stones...
But that is what I was trying to point out... the guy he said that to DIDN'T respond that way, and he kept on going and going with it.

I BET he wouldn't have done that to a "primarily Black audience"... I'm sure the hairs on his neck woulda stood on end saying ... "I wouldn't do that if I were you..." :heh:



I'm glad I'm not the only one who finds it amazing (and appalling) that people think a violent physical reaction is appropriate in response to the utterance of a single word.
Honestly, them's is "fightin' words"... Just don't go in there with those in your aresenal unless you are prepared to defend yourself.

I've seen folks fight over less... Heck, words can provoke a physical reaction. Would it be better if someone had slapped the taste out of his mouth (one good hard slap) rather than a beatdown? Either way, that would definitely teach him a lesson (rather than the current media circus.)

Sad part is... back in the day, folks generally "knew better" than to go there, but today, people are gettin' REAL bold as to what they can say to others (without considering the consequences). Is the physical reaction wrong... most likely yes. Did the person who said it deserve the reaction? Once again... most likely... yes.

Just my own opinion.

[cheapie]

you seen to be saying that he should have the self-control to keep from saying idiotic things but it's okay to lack the self-control that would keep you from beating his a$$ for saying those idiotic things. hmmmm...

[MikeD]

This is getting to be either really sad, or really funny. Hell, maybe both.

[DarkFury]

you seen to be saying that he should have the self-control to keep from saying idiotic things but it's okay to lack the self-control that would keep you from beating his a$$ for saying those idiotic things. hmmmm...
No... the CONTROL is what KEEPS us from beating his @ss. (but in my mind, the anger that builds sure would feel good doing so. :angry: :heh: )

But then again, his lack of self control, could trigger someone else's lack of physical control I suppose.

Either way, cause and effect. It wasn't like he was slapped first and then called out the N-Bomb. :shrug:

[MikeD]

I guess white folks should rush the stage and beat the piss out of Chris Rock, or Paul Mooney, when they're doing their routine. :rolleyes:

:thumbdown

Again, this is only news because the audience members were black. Racial incidents happen all the time, but amazing how we only hear of select ones.

[cheapie]

well, to be fair, those guys don't scream racist things at the audience in anger. :heh:

and i don't remember them talking about placing a fork in a body cavity.

[DarkFury]

Maybe cheapie should quote what he said so that I can respond. :heh:

[MikeD]

LOL, you're funny big boy. We know what's up. Who's your daddy? :hehehmm:

[Napoleon54]

I'm amazed by how much weight the n-word still carries. Richards could've used just about any other word in the entire English language and his comments wouldn't have been deemed so outrageously offensive. Why is that?

Do you REALLY have to ask that? Isn't it painfully obvious?

I guess it isn't obvious to me, which is why I posed the question. Feel free to elaborate if you want, otherwise we can just let it pass.

[eSDee]

This is the standard reaction to this type of incident. It's only a big deal because the audience member was black, and Richards is white. If you change the race roles of any of the participants, it's not catching nearly as much attention.


Just to clarify, this is only an observation and not a defense of Michael Kramer's actions right?


I guess white folks should rush the stage and beat the piss out of Chris Rock, or Paul Mooney, when they're doing their routine. :rolleyes:

:thumbdown

Again, this is only news because the audience members were black. Racial incidents happen all the time, but amazing how we only hear of select ones.

Guess not. Seems your only defense is that is that Black people are too sensitive. :rolleyes:

[MikeD]

Just to clarify, this is only an observation and not a defense of Michael Kramer's actions right?

No doubt. Where's the attention over previous incidents?

For that matter, let me point out two other incidents that involved race but have either received little attention, or have fallen off the face of the media planet:

1. Duke lacrosse, as I mentioned before. What happened to this case? One of the dancer's stories blew up, and suddenly things just went quiet. Hmmm...

2. One that I only heard of as a Cowboys fans: the Michael Irvin / Tony Romo flap, where Irvin talked about Romo gaining his athletic ability due to one of his white ancestor's (I believe he said grandmother or great-grandmother) sleeping with a slave. Are you kidding me? How offensive is that?

Yet, you don't hear much about cases like that. Why? Because black folks weren't offended. Again, if the race roles were reveresed...much, much different story.

Desenseitized, as you put it. Wonder why?


Seems your only defense is that is that Black people are too sensitive

Defense of whom? Or what? Not sure what you're talking about.

Not only are black people to sensitive, but the media is too sensitive. By far, incidents involving blacks are whipped into a media frenzy more than with any other race.

[Napoleon54]

I think all I have to add at this point is this:

The word has power only because it gets a reaction. If people stopped reacting so strongly to it, it would lose it's power and wouldn't be offensive. Looking at it another way I guess, people won't get offended if they choose not to. :shrug:

[DarkFury]

I guess it isn't obvious to me, which is why I posed the question. Feel free to elaborate if you want, otherwise we can just let it pass.
At this point... I'd just rather let it pass.

But thanks for asking. :D