Lets talk. Highlander or RX300?

[irwin]

Basically the same car...why is RX300 so much more...it's not fair.

[brain]

Hmm... In 4 words... The Highlander is UGLY! Also, a fully loaded Highlander (Approximately $33k) is not that far off in pricing from a Lexus RX300.

[Leon]

How's the Acura MDX?


http://image.genex.com/acura/00/spec/spec_1_mdx_car_con.jpg

[Ice-9]

All SUVs suck. That is all.

(Flame-retardant suit ready)

[pennypinch]

Face it, the MDX (while a great lookin' car), the highlander, the RX300...all the Japanese mid-size SUV's are basically roughed up minivans.

If you want an SUV, I'd suggest an American car. If you want a slightly more capable van for your resident soccer mom, get one of the above.

I test drove the RX and was not impressed, btw. Just too small for my tastes.

[helius]

Originally posted by Leon
How's the Acura MDX?


http://image.genex.com/acura/00/spec/spec_1_mdx_car_con.jpg

The front end looks a smidge odd to me. It's like the TL's got a slack-jawed sibbling or something. :P

[Blu]

Originally posted by Ice-9
All SUVs suck. That is all.

(Flame-retardant suit ready)

Well, I share your feelings..sorta. The whole SUV thing depends on what you're using it for. If you just want it to haul the kids around, get a wagon or a van. There is no more space in a Grand Cherokee than in a Caravan or a Passat Wagon. (Besides, wagons/vans are prettier and better on gas.) If you actually need 4 wheel drive, but really need the space for a family, go for it. A perfect example is a building contractor.

I drive a relatively small car, and am getting tired of dealing with slow SUV's in the left lane, and getting cut off by those GD Soccer Moms.

Blu

[kil45]

i think the rx300/ mdx/ highlander mini suv's arent that bad, especially if you want a higher view of the road while maintaining a more car/ wagon feel compared to the average suv. I drive a toyota 4runner, and when i drove my aunt's rx300 i found it to be a good mix of suv and wagon/sedan.

[hapoo]

Originally posted by Ice-9
All SUVs suck. That is all.

(Flame-retardant suit ready)


I agree, I never understood the whole SUV thing.

[jase71]

SUVs aren't so bad as long as you have a legit use for them.

My wife has a '96 Blazer, and I've got a '92 Tracker. Primary reason is the hill we live on. In Wisconsin,
in winter, it's nearly impossible to get up to our house
if it's snowing. The 4 wheel drive makes it a piece of cake. And both vehicles do some mild-offroading in summer to get to remote fishing/camping sites.

Now, the only time I have to back down the hill in winter is when the Buick in front of me can't make it up.

Keep in mind, not all SUVs are multi-ton behemoths like Navigators. Just the ones carrying 6 kids home from soccer practice!

[KoalaFD]

Agreed.

I who have been ran off the road many a time by soccer mom on cell phone in her car that weighs almost 3 times mine think that SUVs are ok in their place. Like in the woods, by a lake, and far from my RX-7.

Oh Koala, but what about the "urban jungle"? I need to have brush guards and headlight covers and a winch on my Land Cruiser since I drive 20 miles to work and who knows what the hell you could run across on the freeway!

Gimmie a break. If you camp, if you ski, if you drive on dirt roads and snow more than once a year (Wisconsin is freakin' cold, BTW), or if you just plain enjoy wasting gas, buy an SUV.

[speedracer120]

<rant>Please don't get me worked up. I hate the soccer moms with a passion. I mean literally I get flushed and ready to run them over. They have the worst condescending attitudes on the face of the earth. They act as if they owned the whole freking world. News Flash... You're just a dumb rich bitch without a clue!!!! </rant>

Anyways, I would want an SUV if I lived on a ranch. I do understand someone who would want to get an SUV or a truck (not Ranger but F-150 or so) to intimidate the drivers in front of them, but why speed in a car with a high center of gravity and roll over yourself?

[pennypinch]

Bah! You guys clearly don't know what it's like to be able to carry things home without strapping them to your little runabout's roof, do you? :)

Honestly, I find the room afforded by SUV's to be far more comfortable than trying to wedge myself into a hoopty. Moreover, I find that being able to haul some stuff from here to there, or pack 7 friends into a car is far better than making multiple trips.

It's not like lousy drivers are confined to SUV's. I can't count the number of Accord's and Eclipses I've almost had to lay the smack down on for either a) not yielding to faster moving traffic in the f'in left lane or b) "Ah, why bother looking into the next lane. I'm sure there's no-one there."

So save your vitriol for lousy drivers, not SUV's.

[OC]

If you have a legitimate need for an SUV, fine. Large family, work truck, whatever - that, I don't have a problem with. But when I see a person commuting in something like a Ford Expedition with no one else in the vehicle with him - I'm sorry, that's just irresponsible. Imagine paying 35-55 thousand dollars for the priveledge of getting 12-14 mpg! I'm not a tree-hugger by any means, but I do believe that we all have to do our part. Yes, I know, the exhaust of a large SUV my be clean, but it still uses huge amounts of fuel.

Not only that, but it's just amazing how bad SUV drivers seem to be. Do these people have ANY idea how long it take to stop an SUV from 60 mph? Look at it this way - at 60 mph you are covering 88 feet per second. (60 miles in an hour = 316800 feet per hour. 3600 seconds in an hour, so 316800/3600=88 feet ser second.) If you're tailgating (for the sake of argument, three car lengths) you are, say, 45 feet behind the car in front of you. (and we all know that tailgaters follow closer than that, because we all see it every day). This means you are about 1/2 second behind the car in front of you. If the person in front of you has to slam on their brakes for some reason, there is very little chance that you won't collide with them.

And another thing - I drive a Geo Metro (and I'm very ready to get something faster. Rather frustrating). I am just amazed every day by how many people I pass! I have one of the slowest production vehicles around, and I routinely pass (quickly!) all kinds of "performance" cars. It's not that my car is fast, rather the opposite. Other drivers are just too slow, even when they own a quick car. I'm talking 944s, Integras, Camaros, etc. I do more passing than I get passed (forgive the grammar).

Oh, and as for "packing 7 friends in my car" - don't your friends have their own vehicles? Why should you have to put with the high cost of such low gas mileage just to avoid inconveniencing your friends? I wouldn't do it.

One last thing - you just can't have fun in the twisties in an SUV like you can in a real car. "Carlike SUV" - there's a contradiction in terms.

Ok, I'll stop now...

[pennypinch]

If the gas cost isn't a problem to you, why bitch? If I want to roll down to the bars with my friends, it's even more irresponsible to try and find 5 designated drivers, isn't it? And if I could collapse the car down, turn off four cylinders, and remove seats when I don't need them, wouldn't you think I would?

And what did I say about restricting "bad driver" labels to SUV drivers? Have you NEVER seen that happen with car drivers?

[OC]

Yes, of course I see the same bad driving in cars, not just SUVs. I wasn't trying to state otherwise. But if I'm being tailgated I'd rather it be by a car than an SUV. Much less weight, much lower chance of killing me.

Oh, and finding 5 designated drivers is irresponsible? Did I hear that right? Why not drink at home - MUCH cheaper, just as much fun with your friends.

-o

[Ice-9]

Originally posted by overclocked
Imagine paying 35-55 thousand dollars for the priveledge of getting 12-14 mpg!

Or you can pay about 5 times that much for a Ferrari 360 Modena F1, which gets about that gas mileage and carries many fewer people. But it carries them to where they're going a bit faster. Just a bit.



And another thing - I drive a Geo Metro (and I'm very ready to get something faster. Rather frustrating). I am just amazed every day by how many people I pass! I have one of the slowest production vehicles around, and I routinely pass (quickly!) all kinds of "performance" cars. It's not that my car is fast, rather the opposite. Other drivers are just too slow, even when they own a quick car. I'm talking 944s, Integras, Camaros, etc. I do more passing than I get passed (forgive the grammar).


Not my 944, ya don't. I have a medically diagnosed permanent condition called "leadfoot", which causes me to drive at speeds which some might consider mildly excessive, and by "some", I mean race car drivers. And I have real issues with being passed by anything less sporty than, say, a Corvette. So if I see you in your Geo, you better be ready to open that puny throttle wide open to stay with me. :D (Not that that'll help you much.)

[speedracer120]

Originally posted by overclocked
Yes, of course I see the same bad driving in cars, not just SUVs. I wasn't trying to state otherwise. But if I'm being tailgated I'd rather it be by a car than an SUV. Much less weight, much lower chance of killing me.


So true.

Pennypinch, I do see the appeal of driving in a huge car. But, if you have that much of a bigger vehicle don't you think it would behoove the driver to take more precaution by taking into consideration the fact that even though he/she (more likely she) may live, the person they are tailgating may not appreciate being crushed by an SUV with one careless cell-phone abusing, self-righteous bitch?

We don't see 18 wheelers tailgating tiny Civics. And if a Civic gets crushed by a big rig, it can be easily assumed that the driver in the Civic probably did something stupid like cut in front of the truck in heavy traffic.

If you see a Civic and say an Expedition get into an accident, couldn't be assumed that people would think that the Explorer was at fault?

I'm not trying to stereotype anybody as careless or thoughtless. But you gotta admit there are a lot of idiots that have both expensive and inexpensive cars that don't drive within their abilities. Come on, driving with one hand on your cell phone clearly inhibits ones ability to drive. Doing so in a much bigger car makes the situation even worse.

As for driving your friends around, minivans have more efficient seating arrangements than any SUV I've ridden in save for a Suburban. And for that reason, the only SUV I'd buy is a Suburban, also it looks better than anything that Ford has out.

[KoalaFD]

I think people should have special licenses.
Like

"Able to talk on cell phone and drive."
"Able to drive up to 100mph when conditions permit (i.e. no traffic, etc)."
"Able to negate `safe for conditions' clause"
"Can pack as many honeys as possible in a 2 seater car"

Stuff like that.
:)

[pennypinch]

Originally posted by speedracer120

Originally posted by overclocked
Yes, of course I see the same bad driving in cars, not just SUVs. I wasn't trying to state otherwise. But if I'm being tailgated I'd rather it be by a car than an SUV. Much less weight, much lower chance of killing me.


So true.

Pennypinch, I do see the appeal of driving in a huge car. But, if you have that much of a bigger vehicle don't you think it would behoove the driver to take more precaution by taking into consideration the fact that even though he/she (more likely she) may live, the person they are tailgating may not appreciate being crushed by an SUV with one careless cell-phone abusing, self-righteous bitch?

We don't see 18 wheelers tailgating tiny Civics. And if a Civic gets crushed by a big rig, it can be easily assumed that the driver in the Civic probably did something stupid like cut in front of the truck in heavy traffic.

If you see a Civic and say an Expedition get into an accident, couldn't be assumed that people would think that the Explorer was at fault?

I'm not trying to stereotype anybody as careless or thoughtless. But you gotta admit there are a lot of idiots that have both expensive and inexpensive cars that don't drive within their abilities. Come on, driving with one hand on your cell phone clearly inhibits ones ability to drive. Doing so in a much bigger car makes the situation even worse.

As for driving your friends around, minivans have more efficient seating arrangements than any SUV I've ridden in save for a Suburban. And for that reason, the only SUV I'd buy is a Suburban, also it looks better than anything that Ford has out.
That's the most nonsensical BS I've heard in a bit. If there's an accident, people assume the larger car is at fault? You've got to be fuckin' joking me! This is small-car-owner groupthink at its worst...

And I'll be damned if I'm going to be caught in a goddamn minivan. Would you want to drive a 1995 Hyundai?

[jase71]

I think the whole SUV issue is going to burn out in 3-5 years...

SUVs are trendy now. It's hip to have one to haul your kids to soccer practice. And it's a status symbol.

The people who seems to annoy most of us are the ones who drive SUVs because of these reasons, NOT because they have a legit use for them.

But things will change. First off, fads change. Minivans used to be the hot ticket. Now it's SUVs. Next, it'll be something else. Maybe we'll see the rebirth of the station wagon. SUVs are gradually evolving back to station wagons anyway, it seems.

But secondly, SUVs are 4 wheel drive vehicles. 4 wheel drive is inherently more expensive to maintain than 2 wheel drive. As these SUVs in the recent boom age, they're going to require expensive maintainence. Much more expensive.
And all these soccer moms are going to see what it costs to have that 4 wheel drive security that they've never used. And they'll think twice before buying it a second time.

Dollars and personal image may hit home where safety and environmental concerns never sink in with these people.

[Blu]

I think we're seeing the downfall of the fad right now. Sales of Ford SUVs, especially the big ones. But I think some of the "kiddie" SUVs are here to stay. The RX300, the RAV4, all those hybrid style cars.


Blu

[KoalaFD]

I hope you're right.

I hate the little SUVs only a bit less than their big brothers but at least they're not super dangerous on the road. And most of the luxo ones have integrated cell phones into their audio systems so mom doesn't have to hold the phone up to her head.

[pennypinch]

I still just don't understand where you're coming from. How many Civic's have I had to swerve to avoid because their drivers were driving with their knees while talking on the phone and drinking a coffee? How many Camry's have I had to pass on the right because someone told them it was their god given right to chill in the left lane going 50? How many Eclipses have I had to lean on the horn for because they got the crazy notion they could change lanes into a spot the size of my wheelwell?

THe notion that lousy drivers are somehow worsened by driving an SUV are laughable. HA HA! That's how laughable!

[KoalaFD]

How many times have you been hit by an SUV in your little Porsche?

How many times have you been hit by a Civic in your little Porsche?

You think one is worse than the other?

When I was in high school, I once rear-ended an MG in my Land Cruiser at about 5 mph. Guess what happened to the MG. I got a scratch on my bumper.

[speedracer120]

Let's reason here, would you want a lousy Asian 40+ years female driver to drive an SUV or a smaller car. That's all that I was trying to argue. Anyways I can't tell if my previous argument was crap cause I haven't read it again nor will I cause I was half asleep when I wrote it out. Anyways, I know I get pissed by lousy drivers. I just get angrier when they happen to driver a bigger car.

[kil45]

it seems to me that the people driving the suvs are generally worse drivers( especially soccer moms ), but the people driving civics and other sport sedans/coupes drive very agressively, which scares the bad suv drivers and is often the cause of many accidents. I myself drive a 4Runner and i cant count the number of times some freaking civic cuts me off and then slams on the brakes, causing a near accident. just keep in mind that next time u see a slow ass tahoe going 45 in the fast lane, dont cut them off otherwise you're gonna pay for it. just honk at them to get them off their cell phone. as for soccer moms, stick to minivans, you're givin the rest of us SUV drivers a bad name.