indecent exposure / maternity

[epoxi]

breast feeding in public? indecent exposure ? so as it stands in washington dc....ridiculous

[irwin]

I saw a lady breast feeding on a mall bench.

[ArkiStan]

cool

[ArkiStan]

dang..maybe I should stop drinking now.

oops wrong thread...

[Edited by ucbstan on 04-11-2001 at 07:22 PM]

[Memo]

depends on how good looking the mother is ;) ;)

[welfareloser]

what are you talking about - people are actually still getting in trouble for feeding babies? fabulous. women needed just one more thing to be ashamed of. i love this fucking country - the same country where complete strangers will walk up to you and tell you you're poisoning your kid if they see you engaging in the unforgivable sin of feeding them formula.

i read about a woman who was kicked out of a mall by a security guard for breast feeding her baby on a bench WITH EVERYTHING TOTALLY COVERED BY A PRIVACY BLANKET no less. so she makes a few phone calls and that weekend TWO HUNDRED mothers show up to sit in the food court and breast feed. that's just too cool.

[jmac87]

Is it just me or does anyone else find ucbstan's accidental post funny?

[coleslaw]

I think Jim Carrey handled this very issue quite well in Me, Myself and Irene. Wouldn't you agree? :D

[cruelpupet]

I see no need for women to breast feed in public. Besides being able to give it formula, they can always pump it and bottle it in the privacy of their own home.

[Memo]

Pump it in a bottle.....that's a lovely site. I too think that women don't need to breasfeed in public. Sure it's natural, but isn't pissing, shitting, puking and having sex natural too? Hopefully not all at the same time. Yea, you might throw a little blanket over it to cover, but if i laid down on a mall bench and had sex with a blanket over me, i'm still not doing something write. I know my comparison is a bit exagerated, but it's not that hard to walk to your car, or go home to feed the child.

[welfareloser]

Originally posted by cruelpupet
I see no need for women to breast feed in public. Besides being able to give it formula, they can always pump it and bottle it in the privacy of their own home.



wtf is wrong with you people?!?!? pumping and bottling is painful and inconvenient, not every woman is capable of releasing milk into a bottle, it is extremely difficult to get all of the fat out, since the last of the milk is higher in fat and the last of the milk is hard to get out mechanically (and the fat is really important stuff...), the nutrients, immunoglobulins, and other beneficial substances start to degrade the minute they leave the body, and you run the risk of spoilage, not to mention the fact that some babies can get confused by switching from bottle to nipple and start to eat poorly.

formula is not as good as breastmilk. period. there are substances in breastmilk that do important things that are not duplicated in formula. formula is the NEXT best thing, not the best thing.

it's not that hard to walk to your car or go home?!?!? how do you know? babies eat every 45 min - 3 hours. over the five-month period that i breast fed, i was chained to my baby, but i don't think i had any moral obligation to stay chained to my home. no, i don't think i should have to feed my baby in a public toilet or a car, for chrissake. there is no more "need" for a baby to eat in public than there is for YOU to eat in public. i go to the mall, my kid is hungry, i feed him. you go to the mall, you get hungry, you sit in the food court and eat. see the similarities? it is not pissing, or shitting, or puking, or farting, or ass-scratching, or nose-picking, or sex. it is eating. it involves a human nipple, which is structurally identical (yes, identical; histologically the same, with some key features simply undeveloped, not absent or different) to your damned nipple, which i am sure has seen the sunlight many a time. more socially enlightened countries are not frightened by the naked female breast in any context, let alone the context of feeding a friggin baby.

i don't exactly enjoy the sight of someone eating sloppily and noisily at mcd's, but i don't question their right to do it.

grow up. new mothers are bombarded with enough unfounded judgmental crap; they sure as shit don't need this nonsense on top of everything else.

[Edited by welfareloser on 04-12-2001 at 12:03 AM]

[gwilks98]

Did anyone see the Married W/ Children episode where Al confronts this?


It was hilarious.

He kicked a woman out of his store for breast feeding in there, so she calls up Marcey Darcey who does the stages a protest of breast feeders in his store.

So Al gets all of his beer buddies to start dancing shirtless in front of the mothers and after about five big hairy white bellies, the breast feeders retreated.



Okay people, I know breast feeding is natural, and I would much rather a mother breast feed than use formula. But I think it should be done in private, or discretely if in public. The last thing I want to see while I'm in the mall is a mom sitting in the middle of the walkway nursing her kid. It's no different than watching a couple make out. It's something that's a bit too personal for public display.

[revil]

Originally posted by welfareloser
so she makes a few phone calls and that weekend TWO HUNDRED mothers show up to sit in the food court and breast feed. that's just too cool.

How is that cool?! Their force feeding their babies! I can't believe they did such an atrocious thing and that you actually thought it was cool!







just kidding.

[ArkiStan]

Originally posted by welfareloser
... more socially enlightened countries are not frightened by the naked female breast in any context,...

I think we have a lot to learn from these other countries. I wanna see more breasts in public (breast-feeding or just bare) as well as on prime time TV. Yeah baby Yeah!!!

[cruelpupet]

Originally posted by ucbstan

Originally posted by welfareloser
... more socially enlightened countries are not frightened by the naked female breast in any context,...

I think we have a lot to learn from these other countries. I wanna see more breasts in public (breast-feeding or just bare) as well as on prime time TV. Yeah baby Yeah!!!

Im sure that there are many breasts you would NOT want to see.

[oblongmelon]

In almost every other country in this world-breastfeeding in public or otherwise is perfectly acceptable. Even in those "iffy" countries like the UK where they are oh so anal-it is perfectly fine so long as it is done with a bit of dignity. Blanket covering would be fine. The problem is that the US is run by pompous horses ass men who are either jealous of breastfeeding babies or so damn afraid they are gonna get off on it that they may sport a wood in the middle of the mall. Being a Former Neonatal nurse for many many years-I can tell you that there is a HUGE amount of women who long to breast feed their infants but can't due to no breast milk at all or due to having pre-mature infants who cant tolerate being out of isolets for more than a few minutes at a time to bond with their mothers, and get the benefits of breast feeding. The first few feedings is a substance called Colostrum which is not breastmilk but a clear substance that includes all the "goodies" that help infants build up immunities to ward off allergies,illness's etc. While breast pumping sounds so easy-it isn't, and can be down right painful if it's not done right,and since breast milk spoils at a rate so fast-if you pump breast milk and don't use it within 4 hours it must be frozen. Refridgeration isnt enough to keep it from spoiling as fast as it does. While baby formula is a quick and easy way to feed these babies-formula simply does not contain the nutrients that it takes to build up the immunities in these kids-and quite frankly 50% of all babies are intolerant of baby formula (hence all the spitting)-very few breast fed babies puke up sour smelling messes on their mothers shoulders-and while the occasional gob here and their is due to inconsistant burping,spitting up after formula is natures way of telling you, that your baby's system is just to delicate to hold this stuff in. Why would anyone think that breast feeding in indecent? It's so perfectly DECENT that they should make it a national holiday. I suggest that No one ever get into a spat with a member of the LE LECHE league-my god-they will devour you.

[cruelpupet]

Dignity....earlier in the thread it was mentoned that women were doing it in the middle of the mall on a bench, or having massive groups of women do it in the food court. They should at least make an effort to goto a more private area.

[LPMiller]

why? What is so personal and all fired private about lunch?

[apmiller]

What the heak I'm I hearing here? Why is there an argument? Bottom line...you don't want to see it then stop looking! Guys look because they WANT to see SKIN! But when they see what's attached to it and it's not them, that's when it becomes, "Yuck! You can do that here!" Most women know it's natural and better for the child. But then some gals are shy and see feeding in public, it makes them feel akward and they say NO WAY! That ain't happening here! Go do that in your CAR or at HOME.

Let's face the most important fact here, you don't have to LOOK! If I see a large guy stuffing his face with all the food he can, that grosses me out and I look away then suddenly life is better. If I notice a mother feeding her child, I just look away. None of my business. The kid needs to eat but I don't want to see it so I LOOK AWAY.

To kick someone out of a mall or someplace like that is nuts and wrong! Come on is this America or what?

[ironchef]

it's boobies! boobies as objects of utility rather than pleasure! that's sacrelige! milk!? ewwwwwww!

or, so i suspect that's the reasoning behind the reaction some stooges have to it.

jealousy or fear of a chubby? hehe, that's funny! good theory.

here's a tip for guys that are so in love with the nipple that they can't bear to have its image tainted by a child nursing from it:

1. go get yours pierced and leave it in for a good year or so
2. remove piercing - you now have your very own woman-sized nipple! woohoo!

[Memo]

Screw it, feed your child some tit :)

[fakesurfers]

breasts=good

'nuff said!

[welfareloser]

Originally posted by cruelpupet
Dignity....earlier in the thread it was mentoned that women were doing it in the middle of the mall on a bench, or having massive groups of women do it in the food court. They should at least make an effort to goto a more private area.

there's nothing undignified about doing it with any level of exposure.

some guys are just wierded out by the sex object/maternal object dichotomy. if you are afraid you'll get a woodie with a baby in your field of vision, avert your eyes.

(but there's really nothing sinful about getting a woodie over breastfeeding.)

if you're embarrassed, whatever. but asking a woman to conceal herself during breastfeeding is what is undignified.

my kid, for one, refused to eat with a blanket over his head (wouldn't you?), so that was never even an option for me.

interesting that i've never heard a woman call nonchalant breastfeeding indecent. (and yes, i'm sure if you looked hard enough, you could find a couple, but not many... and they'd almost have to be republicans, wouldn't they?)

rev. evil - i know some babies are picky eaters, but i don't think it's even physically possible to force-feed a lot of kids... like my kid, who until recently looked like jabba the hut in a diaper... ;-)

[Jenny]

Especially breast-feeding. That is virtually inmpossible. It isn't like if a woman sticks the nipple in the babies mouth, the baby will automatically start sucking. The baby has to want to eat (or want to suckle...) and if they do, then they will latch on with their tongue and lips and then start to suck. If they don't latch on, they can't suck. If they aren't hungry or don't just want to suckle for comfort, they won't latch on. Pure and simple. :)

[apmiller]

Originally posted by Jenny
Especially breast-feeding. That is virtually inmpossible. It isn't like if a woman sticks the nipple in the babies mouth, the baby will automatically start sucking. The baby has to want to eat (or want to suckle...) and if they do, then they will latch on with their tongue and lips and then start to suck. If they don't latch on, they can't suck. If they aren't hungry or don't just want to suckle for comfort, they won't latch on. Pure and simple. :)


Umm...thanks for that lesson in...um...sucking.

[m0j0]

nuttin wrong with breast feeding in public. maybe an effort should be made to be more private, but if it's not possible, it should be no big deal. we're talkin about babies here. it's not like we're talking about some 5 year old kid or something. like apmiller says...look away if you don't like. in fact, look away if you do like (you pervs)

[bella]

[/B][/QUOTE]



i don't exactly enjoy the sight of someone eating sloppily and noisily at mcd's, but i don't question their right to do it.

grow up. new mothers are bombarded with enough unfounded judgmental crap; they sure as shit don't need this nonsense on top of everything else.

[Edited by welfareloser on 04-12-2001 at 12:03 AM] [/B][/QUOTE]



Very nicely said! I think there should be a law against people DIGGING in their noses! That is disgusting! There is nothing wrong with breastfeeding in public! I mean what is wrong with a little breast, they show that on TV all the time.... I don't see people complaining too much about that..

[ChIcKeN_HaWk]

Especially breast-feeding. That is virtually inmpossible. It isn't like if a woman sticks the nipple in the babies mouth, the baby will automatically start sucking. The baby has to want to eat (or want to suckle...) and if they do, then they will latch on with their tongue and lips and then start to suck. If they don't latch on, they can't suck. If they aren't hungry or don't just want to suckle for comfort, they won't latch on. Pure and simple.


I love to latch on, it's fun. LOL

[ProPain]

Maybe if more places had a "private" place for nursing, moms wouldn't have to nurse in front of people. I'm not talking about sitting on a filthy toilet in a stall barely big enough for one person either! JMHO. Pro

[hapoo]

:disa:


All i'm saying is that if she should choose to do that in public, she should at least share. :P

[Nanotech9]

i didn't read all of everyone's post, but I didn't really see anyone mention the religious side of it.... many religions consider the breasts to be a private part, and therefor take offense if they are shown in public, or even for that matter, if a females clothes are too tight, revealing the body too much.

Now, another sidline... if breast feeding in public is ok, then why should women even need to wear bras/shirts in public? Why just not walk around topless? (damn, i don't eve walk around "topless" in public) The thing is, the breast is one of the most attractive parts of the female body to a man. I think doing this could have serious reprocussions (sp?) to womens safety and security.

[zenbooty]

Originally posted by Nanotech9
i didn't read all of everyone's post, but I didn't really see anyone mention the religious side of it.... many religions consider the breasts to be a private part, and therefor take offense if they are shown in public, or even for that matter, if a females clothes are too tight, revealing the body too much.

I say F*** those uptight religions that regard the human body as some kinda freaky taboo. I think that is really wierd and, frankly, betrays sexual repression in the church.


Now, another sidline... if breast feeding in public is ok, then why should women even need to wear bras/shirts in public? Why just not walk around topless? (damn, i don't eve walk around "topless" in public) The thing is, the breast is one of the most attractive parts of the female body to a man. I think doing this could have serious reprocussions (sp?) to womens safety and security.

There are nude beaches all over the Mediterranean and no one is assaulted (or at least not enough incidents for it to be considered an issue). The same goes for some nude beaches here in CA. Maybe breasts out in the open aren't the problem. Maybe its us and our uptight cultural attitude toward nudity and sexuality in general?

[welfareloser]

Originally posted by Nanotech9
i didn't read all of everyone's post, but I didn't really see anyone mention the religious side of it.... many religions consider the breasts to be a private part, and therefor take offense if they are shown in public, or even for that matter, if a females clothes are too tight, revealing the body too much.

Now, another sidline... if breast feeding in public is ok, then why should women even need to wear bras/shirts in public? Why just not walk around topless? (damn, i don't eve walk around "topless" in public) The thing is, the breast is one of the most attractive parts of the female body to a man. I think doing this could have serious reprocussions (sp?) to womens safety and security.

so women would be "asking for it?" i know you are not trying to be offensive, and yes, there would be repercussions, but "we shouldn't allow it because it would incite the menfolk" is a bad way to think - very oppressive.

and religion doesn't dictate what people do in this country, at least not ostensibly (yet - thank jeezus f. christ.)

[gwilks98]

I asked my dad about this tonight. He said it used to bother him until him and mom had kids. But he added that people shouldn't be displaying what many people find rude and detestful.


I have to agree. I wouldn't want some guy to walk around the mall without his shirt or shoes on. It's not about "opression". It's just common curtousy.

[welfareloser]

Originally posted by gwilks98
I asked my dad about this tonight. He said it used to bother him until him and mom had kids. But he added that people shouldn't be displaying what many people find rude and detestful.


I have to agree. I wouldn't want some guy to walk around the mall without his shirt or shoes on. It's not about "opression". It's just common curtousy.




common courtesy involves letting a hungry baby scream for fifteen minutes so that the mom can go hide herself like a good little woman? i'll remember that.

and you can't say it til you've been there. what i mean is, i always thought, yeah, if someone wants to breastfeed in public, fine, but i wouldn't want to be stared at and judged, so i would do it privately... and then it was me, and life is just friggin difficult when you have a baby, and i damned well breastfed in public several times, and anyone who had any judgements to deliver would have gotten a hell of a tongue-lashing.

"destestful?" very strong language.

yes, it is about oppression. it's about society deciding that this one stupid, little thing is so dangerously awful, that people are going to be so sickened and offended, that it should not be done in public, because nobody should ever have to see anything so awful. puh-leez. it's nothing. it's just a big fat nothing. it's only remarkable because it IS oppressed, and thus you are not used to seeing it.

[ironchef]

Originally posted by Nanotech9
i didn't read all of everyone's post, but I didn't really see anyone mention the religious side of it.... many religions consider the breasts to be a private part, and therefor take offense if they are shown in public, or even for that matter, if a females clothes are too tight, revealing the body too much.
These are the same religions that advocate the consumption of another man's body for sustenance and the subjegation of yourself to the whims and needs of a mob. Further, they're built on centuries of an overbearing and stifling patriarchical belief system. Of course they sneer at a woman's body - they're all misogynists.

[apmiller]

Too many people start thinking, "If I can see it then it must be wrong!" What you have to realize is that we are talking about a babies right to feed here. Just because it's feeding off of mom compaired to the bottle doesn't make a difference. If a baby needs food, you feed it! If the only way to feed the child is to sit down on a bench somewhere in a public place and let the little sucker got to town then so be it! You don't tell the mother she's being rude or anything when her kid needs food to LIVE!

Let's see here, now when you get hungry do you get food and eat it wherever there is a McDonalds or such place? Sure you do. If you need food and bad, you go get it where ever you can and eat it where ever you want. If your a sloppy eater then someone might tell you your bothering them with your eatting habits, but then what do you do? You tell them to kiss off and go back to eatting!

Why do we eat the way we do? Over the years we as humans have taken up eating other kinds of food insted of latching on to mom. Why is that? It's not because we though we were being rude, it's because we learned there are other things to eat. In time we learned that in the begining stages of life we grow better if we start with mom then move to McDonalds. It didn't have to be this way. If no one bothered to try other foods we could have easily become a race where you only eat from mom.

There's no real argument here. Babies need to feed! They need mom to do it at first. Just because men regard women as a sex object doesn't change that fact. You don't like it then don't watch!


[Edited by apmiller on 04-13-2001 at 08:20 AM]

[welfareloser]

ahhh... a mature man with a brain...

[caddelma]

Originally posted by welfareloser
ahhh... a mature man with a brain...


Someone in the family had to turn out right. We know LPM certainly isn't the mature one in the family ;) and well the brain part...

Nothing personal LPM! Just couldn't resist

[m0j0]

this is sooooo not like a guy walking around the mall with his shirt off. because this whole deal serves a purpose....feeding the baby....it would be more akin to something that is done temporarily to serve a purpose. i mean, the women aren't parading around; they are sitting, hopefully discreetly, and performing a function. it may be more like a guy having to change his shirt because it is wet or he got too hot. he does his thing, and then he is done. it may not be pleasant to look at (unless it's me), but it's over in a reasonable amount of time.

and about the religion thing: there are religions that say that it's offensive for a woman to show her face or speak in public. does that mean that we need to practice these ideas, too? nope. it's silliness.

[welfareloser]

Originally posted by m0j0

and about the religion thing: there are religions that say that it's offensive for a woman to show her face or speak in public. does that mean that we need to practice these ideas, too? nope. it's silliness.

and even some of the countries that will have a woman beaten with a stick for having a lock of hair fall out of her veil (horrors!) have no problem with baring a breast and slappin a kid onto it. point being: many taboos are inherently arbitrary, and a taboo against public breastfeeding is especially inconvenient and silly.

[apmiller]

Originally posted by welfareloser
ahhh... a mature man with a brain...

What can I say, I grew up watching that sweet sweet TV. Is there nothing it can't teach? God I love TV! And Video Games, my WOMAN, the kids of course, all my action figures, movies, Italy, my mob conections, my porn collection...umm never mind that last part.

(damn my e-mail is going to fill up AGAIN with hate mail. Bad Drew! Bad!)

[hapoo]

Now if women just stayed in the kitchen like they're supposed to we wouldn't have this damn problem, would we???











j/k :P

[cruelpupet]

Hmm it seems that Hapoo has found the answer to this problem. Hapoo if we vote you into office, will you pass this as law?

[hapoo]

Sure will! Along with the "Dinner must be ready when i get home" law and the "Anti-I-Have-A-Headache-Right-Now-Honey" law.

[gwilks98]

Originally posted by welfareloser

Originally posted by gwilks98
I asked my dad about this tonight. He said it used to bother him until him and mom had kids. But he added that people shouldn't be displaying what many people find rude and detestful.


I have to agree. I wouldn't want some guy to walk around the mall without his shirt or shoes on. It's not about "opression". It's just common curtousy.




common courtesy involves letting a hungry baby scream for fifteen minutes so that the mom can go hide herself like a good little woman? i'll remember that.

and you can't say it til you've been there. what i mean is, i always thought, yeah, if someone wants to breastfeed in public, fine, but i wouldn't want to be stared at and judged, so i would do it privately... and then it was me, and life is just friggin difficult when you have a baby, and i damned well breastfed in public several times, and anyone who had any judgements to deliver would have gotten a hell of a tongue-lashing.

"destestful?" very strong language.

yes, it is about oppression. it's about society deciding that this one stupid, little thing is so dangerously awful, that people are going to be so sickened and offended, that it should not be done in public, because nobody should ever have to see anything so awful. puh-leez. it's nothing. it's just a big fat nothing. it's only remarkable because it IS oppressed, and thus you are not used to seeing it.


You're right. It is a big fat nothing. But it is enough to bother QUITE A FEW people. Kind of like farting in the elevator. Sure, it's no big deal. Everyone farts from time to time. (And some more than others) But the considerate thing to do would be to wait until you don't share your personal habits with other people who find them crude.

I don't give a damn if you completely undress to feed a damn baby. I've got better things to do than watch. I'm just an advocate of being a bit more respectful for other people. Sure, having a baby (hungry nonetheless) is a pain in the ass. But it's YOUR baby, YOUR pain in the ass. Not anyone else's. Let's keep it that way.

[m0j0]

whew! this is why marijuana should be legalized

[welfareloser]

Originally posted by gwilks98
Sure, having a baby (hungry nonetheless) is a pain in the ass. But it's YOUR baby, YOUR pain in the ass. Not anyone else's. Let's keep it that way.

thought #1 - obviously never breastfed.

thought #2 - and yet... so many people get so violently pissed off when your baby dares to scream in a public place... you just can't win, can you? somebody spank me, 'cause i been bad.

violently ugly thought #3 - maybe all you people wouldn't be so mean if someone had breastfed you! it's bitterness! that's why y'all are so mean!

i should just stay in the kitchen and off the computer. hungry, hapoo?

[m0j0]

Originally posted by welfareloser
[QUOTE]

i should just stay in the kitchen and off the computer. hungry, hapoo?

that's hungry, hungry hapoo

[welfareloser]

Originally posted by m0j0

Originally posted by welfareloser
[QUOTE]

i should just stay in the kitchen and off the computer. hungry, hapoo?

that's hungry, hungry hapoo

are you calling hapoo ... fat? >gasp< careful, there, he might sit on you!

[hapoo]

Originally posted by welfareloser
[QUOTE]
i should just stay in the kitchen and off the computer. hungry, hapoo?


Naw i just ate. :hmm: want me to bring your computer into the kitchen for ya?? :)

[gwilks98]

Originally posted by welfareloser
thought #1 - obviously never breastfed.

thought #2 - and yet... so many people get so violently pissed off when your baby dares to scream in a public place... you just can't win, can you? somebody spank me, 'cause i been bad.

violently ugly thought #3 - maybe all you people wouldn't be so mean if someone had breastfed you! it's bitterness! that's why y'all are so mean!

i should just stay in the kitchen and off the computer. hungry, hapoo? [/B]


response to thought #1: My mother (who has breastfed) feels the same way.

response to thought #2: You making assumptions about me without any backing. I have never made a comment about babies crying. I understand babies are a pain in the ass. I only get pissed when a baby is crying in church when I'm trying to ask for forgiveness for a week's worth of sinning, and I can't concentrate because the mom
A. Won't use the cry room
B. Won't attend to her child and just let it cry.

violently ugly response to violently ugly thought #3: I was breastfed (at the reasonable age, hapoo). The reason why I'm bitter is because it's this kind of absolutist individualistic autonomous philosophy (say that three times fast :naughty: ) that breeds the inconsiderate ******* who drives drunk or dangerously on the phone and other wonderful peaches of American society.


I'm not asking for a lot. I just wish people would show a little consideration for others around them once in a while.



let's come to an agreement:
I'll promise not to fart in your elevator if you promise not to take off your shirt in public :D


[Edited by gwilks98 on 04-13-2001 at 08:28 PM]

[hapoo]

Originally posted by gwilks98

let's come to an agreement:
I'll promise not to fart in your elevator if you promise not to take off your shirt in public :D



:disa:

I'll promise not to fart in your elevator if you promise to take off your shirt in public :D

[gwilks98]

it was meant as a joke, bud

[m0j0]

i don't like extremely short skirts, either...but nobody cares because a lot of guys dig them. so maybe these guys that dig them don't like the breastfeeding thing cuz they are jealous of the baby :idea:

[Nanotech9]

"These are the same religions that advocate the consumption of another man's body for sustenance and the subjegation of yourself to the whims and needs of a mob. Further, they're built on centuries of an overbearing and stifling patriarchical belief system. Of course they sneer at a woman's body - they're all misogynists. "

really?, cause i don't recall eating anyone in the last few weeks... damn, maybe i should start looking for someone to eat...


no, we don't sneer at a womans body, it's just considered private, and to be displayed in one's own home for the spouse etc...

next problem... (hypotheticle mind you...) women go nude, get raped, say it's the guys falut.... but fail to realize that by displaying their body, they are enticing the guy to take action... therefore, just as much responsibility is upon the woman as is on the man for her being raped... or do you say it's all they guys fault, and that he shouldn't have looked at her etc.?

[cruelpupet]

Originally posted by Nanotech9
next problem... (hypotheticle mind you...) women go nude, get raped, say it's the guys falut.... but fail to realize that by displaying their body, they are enticing the guy to take action... therefore, just as much responsibility is upon the woman as is on the man for her being raped... or do you say it's all they guys fault, and that he shouldn't have looked at her etc.?


While I do believe that there are major problems with rape laws, according to your argument I can tkae that 52" tv in the store window, cause them displaying it enticed me.

[welfareloser]

gwilks: i didn't mean that the same person/people get pissed off about exposure and a baby crying - there are usually enough judgmental people wandering around a mall on any given day that i can get yelled at no matter what i do. i have been lectured for bottle-feeding, lectured for breast-feeding, and lectured for my baby screaming, all by self-righteous strangers. nobody seems to mind yelling at a woman with a baby anymore than they do teenagers dressed like hoodlums, but maybe this is just because i looked too young to know what i was doing ... i also once got screamed at by some very ostentatiously rich woman about how it was us unwed teenage moms that she was supporting with all of her tax money... this while my kid was crying because he had choked on a cheerio... and i was 23 and married... okay, so i don't look any older in person >grumble<
i meant that you have obviously never done breastfeeding, rather than received it, but it was a joke, and everything else was a joke.

my final thought. i will concede the point that it would be polite to take others' opinions into consideration, regardless of what i think about them. and i would take pains to do it EXCEPT: it is a silly and inconvenient taboo, and i would like to see it eradicated. therefore, i would make my quiet objection to the taboo by continuing to do it in public without shame. it used to be shameful for women to wear pants, but then enough women did it, and it is now acceptable. this is something that i would like to see become acceptable.

nanotech. i am speechless. absolutely speechless. what if a rapist gets turned on by a pretty face? or pretty ankles? that's what led to women veling themselves in the east, and they still get plenty raped. thank the gods that most people in washington don't agree with you.

[Jenny]

It is NEVER a woman's fault if she is raped. Whether she was wearing nothing or if she was covered from head to toe. If a woman says no, SHE MEANS NO! To say that a woman is asking for it if she wears tight, skimpy, or whatever clothes is ludicrous. I betcha our mutual friend would be outraged at that opinion also...

It is very sad when you feel that way....

[m0j0]

Originally posted by Jenny
It is NEVER a woman's fault if she is raped. Whether she was wearing nothing or if she was covered from head to toe. If a woman says no, SHE MEANS NO! To say that a woman is asking for it if she wears tight, skimpy, or whatever clothes is ludicrous. I betcha our mutual friend would be outraged at that opinion also...

It is very sad when you feel that way....

i so heavily agree with jenny.

it is never anyone's fault if they get raped! rape is a violent crime, and saying that it is ever the victim's fault is like saying thatn any bad stuff that happens to ppl is their own fault. i mean, if you get your ass kicked...your fault. you have a car accident...your fault. you get jailed for something that you did or didn't do, then you get pumped in the rear by Bubba....your fault. you're walking along one day and someone sticks a gun in your face and takes your money, maybe shoots you....your fault.

no, rape cannot be the victim's fault. or else by definition it would not be rape. duh.

[Nanotech9]

ok, let me give a different example....

your at work... your a guy. theres a gir there that wears no panties and tight miniskirts, no bra, partially unbotnned blouse... the works. Ok, well, you, the guy make a "move" on her. She claims you are sexually harassing her. Ok, now remember, your the guy... you wouldn't have "made your move" if she hadn't been flaunting her stuff in front of you.

basically, what i'm saying is that if a girl wants to flaunt her body, and hang it out there as "bait" so to speek, then she's got to expect a reaction from the guy, cause thats exactly what she's looking for. (obviously this got way past the breastfeeding part of the topic...)

I'm in no way saying that it's not a guys fault for raping a woman, (and it's NEVER right for a guy to do that) but the woman can't then go and claim she was completely innocent after she's been flaunting her body all over the place.

as far as the steeling the TV argument goes... this would be similar to putting a bigscreen TV in the middle of the street and saying "look at me, aren't i beautiful"? and then especting no one to try to steal it.... (or maybe like leaving a Ferrari with the keys in it)

[Edited by Nanotech9 on 04-14-2001 at 01:05 PM]

[Jenny]

The situation if you are the guy and you make a pass at her is TOTALLY different than if the guy grabs her after work one day and rapes her. Having to choose between the two, I would DEFINTELY rather have a guy come on to me several times instead of rape me...

[epoxi]

I'm in no way saying that it's not a guys fault for raping a woman, but the woman can't then go and claim she was completely innocent after she's been flaunting her body all over the place.



well that is a biased view, what if it was the that woman's style,"wears no panties and tight miniskirts, no bra, partially unbotnned blouse... "... in no way is she, or can be, liable of rape by another individual. the other individual has the free will to choose whether or not to sexually assault her or not. her being a "bait" or dressing up like one has nothing to do with her being at fault.

Have you seen Erin Brokovich ? juila roberts dressed up "flauntly" in the eyes of her boss, but she didnt recognize it as being showy...that was just her style.

any, and all women are targets for rapist, by no means are men excluded....be a little more open minded and thoughtful man...

[welfareloser]

i understand that women get way too much credit when they cry "rape!" that is a valid complaint. things were so far in the other direction (man is faultless; woman is a floozy)for so long, and now the pendulum has swung too far in the other direction (men are evil, women are their constant helpless victims); and it will take a while for things to settle into a nice middle ground. it is too easy to ruin a man's life.

but "she dressed like a floozy and then charged a guy with sexual harrassment" is a TOTALLY different complaint than "women instigate their own rapes."

m0j0 said it best: rape cannot be the victim's fault. or else by definition it would not be rape. duh.

women sometimes have consenual sex, sometimes the guy was pushy, the woman does it and regrets it later, she can, in today's climate, get pretty far with calling it rape. that is wrong.

and yes, certain modes of dress can be reasonably expected to create a response of sexual desire in men. but men can also be reasonably expected not to rape a woman. if rape occurs, it is because of a flaw in the rapist, and whatever other circumstances occured that got it into his head that he was going to rape the woman are not at fault.

so, are gynecologists absolutely innocent if they decide to something improper? i mean, the poor man has his nose halfway up a vagina most of the day - how can the poor man be expected to handle it?
and those exotic dancers... naked in front of men for the sole purpose of givin em boners. they have no right to complain of they get raped, right?

nanotech: what if some guy decides that your tight jeans are just driving him wild, and he must have you? he apologizes afterwords, but your sweet, succulent butt was just calling to him, and he couldn't be reasonably expected to control himself... silly, right? right.

[m0j0]

Originally posted by welfareloser


nanotech: what if some guy decides that your tight jeans are just driving him wild, and he must have you? he apologizes afterwords, but your sweet, succulent butt was just calling to him, and he couldn't be reasonably expected to control himself... silly, right? right.

:puke:

[Nanotech9]

haha - solution: don't wear quite-so-tight jeans...


ok, maybe my "rape example" wasn't a good example. I think the second one (the "office scene") was a little better thought out. (please forgive me - i was at a public library and i was doing three other thing at the same time, and i didn't take the time to think of a good "example" before i posted. I apologize.

[The Happy Squirrel]

okay
i ahvent touched this one because you guys are making a hgue deal outta nothign

but i cant stand it any mroe

There is absoutly nothgin wrong wiht public breastfeeding
i ahve seen it done several times and the mothers were very descrete about it i dont understnad why you think it innapproiate<sp?> geez if you dont like then dont look
simple as that kids need to be fed and some need to be feed NOW when they are hungry
COME ON!

and all you guys who think boobies are so kewl and breastfeeding is a great thing, try smelling breast milk somtime :)

[m0j0]

:puke:

gotta love this thread....

[ironchef]

Originally posted by Nanotech9
really?, cause i don't recall eating anyone in the last few weeks... damn, maybe i should start looking for someone to eat...
Did you accept communion? Is that not the Body & Blood?


no, we don't sneer at a womans body, it's just considered private, and to be displayed in one's own home for the spouse etc...
"Git in the house where ya belong, woman! Serve me, for I am the Man and it was your loathsome gender that damned us all to a life of misery!"

or.. something to that effect

[ironchef]

http://www.zeldman.com/adgraveyard/6.html

:hehehmm:

[Nanotech9]

Originally posted by ironchef

Originally posted by Nanotech9
really?, cause i don't recall eating anyone in the last few weeks... damn, maybe i should start looking for someone to eat...
Did you accept communion? Is that not the Body & Blood?


no, we don't sneer at a womans body, it's just considered private, and to be displayed in one's own home for the spouse etc...
"Git in the house where ya belong, woman! Serve me, for I am the Man and it was your loathsome gender that damned us all to a life of misery!"

or.. something to that effect



actually, no, that roman catholocism (sp?)... I'm baptist, and it's a symbolism of Christ's body, but it's NOT His Body... the Catholics believe its actually His body though. The Bible teaches against canabalism(sp?).

and no "Git in the house" stuff... i admit, some ppl MIS-INTERPRET the bible and mistreat their wives. But if interpreted properly, you don't treat your wife like that.

[gwilks98]

Originally posted by ironchef

http://www.zeldman.com/adgraveyard/6.html

:hehehmm:



I'm having problems looking at this webpage with internet explorer 5 and 5.5. It loads fine, but once the image loads, it causes some sort of video problem. I gave a description in the tech support forum.
http://www.gotapex.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=22522

Any one else having these problems? (this isn't the first time I've had image problems in I-Explorer) Any help would be appreciated...