CYBERREBATE BANKRUPTCY

[Apex]

First and foremost, my heart goes out to all of those who spent their money at CyberRebate these last few months and are now stuck with this Chap11 looming overhead. Moreover, I'm especially saddened for the 100 or so people that purchased through GotApex? during this time. I think all too often, the first reaction of companies (like GotApex?) is to seek to defend themselves from the accusations cast by those who lost out. People have already said in our defense that we did not MAKE you purchase from CyberRebate, however, I did recommend them, and I do take responsibility for that. I cannot, and will not, in good conscience, claim any less.

Let me start by giving a brief history of our dealings with CyberRebate, why I have posted them on the deals page, and where we are now.

We originally found CyberRebate about a year or so ago. We looked into the company and things looked sound. Prices were a bit high, but reasonable considering the rebate ammount. One of our viewers had a problem with a lost rebate. So, we recommended they take it up with CyberRebate, and if they couldn't, the second step would be going to the BBB. I CC'd CyberRebate's affiliate manager on the email and got a call from them the very next morning. He affirmed the company's stance of customer service, and assigned a representative to take care of any and all problems GotApex? viewers may have. Over the next year or so, we've submitted 20-25 requests to them, all of which were quickly and positively handled, the vast majority of them within 24 hours.

The last communication I had with them was with both affiliate managers (Guy Traub, and his replacement, Jared T Bloom) a month or two ago. On that long (about 45 minute) telephone conversation, they both reassured me that the company was in solid financial standings and were expanding operations, in terms of both new hires and products. I took this to be a good sign. I also noticed that they had greatly stepped up their advertising efforts (in web, print, and even TV), which is generally something that indicates expansion. Traffic wise, they were approaching Ebay and Amazon. Major companies such as ****** and many web advertising firms were carrying their banners.

Unfortunately, I cannot say whether Guy and Jared were lying about the company's strength or were deceived by their managers. All I can say is that I read these indicators and made the wrong choice.

This is what I suggest everyone do:

If you purchased and have not gotten your rebate yet, IMMEDIATELY call your credit card company and try to get the charges reversed. At the current time, this is the best option. This is critical: if the customer service rep that you speak with says ok, GET THEIR FULL NAME AND EXTENSION. Do NOT forget to do this. If possible, ask them to place notes of them agreeing to reverse charges on your account, for future reference. If the rep says there's nothing the credit card can do, try calling back. Some customer service representatives are more reasonable than others (you've probably experienced this before). Again, make sure you get their full name and extension.

If you've tried contacting your credit card company several times and they refuse to do anything about it, here's what I'm going to do. I'm going to send you a check for whatever commission I received on your purchase. I owe you, my readers, that much. I wish I could do more.

Furthermore, though Leon and the other people working for me may disagree, I and only I take full responsibility for the CyberRebate postings. Therefore, I will take responsibility for whatever this does to GotApex?'s bottom line. Our losses due to these checks we're sending out will be incurred by me alone.

I will post soon about how to contact me regarding this. Because of the obvious logistical difficulties, I'll need to make a special mailbox for this, and figure out the exact process.

To everyone who is reading this, thank you for your continued support. Without you, this website would not be what it is today. Best wishes,

Gabriel C Lam - AKA Apex

[Kenshin]

Well said, Apex. :D

[pennypinch]

Apex,
I'm impressed with your sense of guilt! Yet, by your own explanation, you had no way to accurately gauge CR's financial health. I, too, watched with growing interest the increasing ad visibility and media coverage of the wacky little upstart you'd introduced us to so many months ago.

Says I (and obviously I speak from a rather detached perspective having held off the impulse to buy some of CR's stuff...like the $1,200 MD player!), I think your continued vigilence and re-evaluation of your business affiliations would be enough for me. I think you could do a better job of warning when the possiblity of a scam exists, but on the whole, I think you present us with largely legitimate dealings, and many solid gray-market ones to boot.

I commend your intent, but you might be taking this a little far. Eh, let's see what those that have lost have to say.

[cruelpupet]

I was one of those 20-25 requests. I forgot to put the receipt in one of my rebate envelopes ($85 rebate), and on top of that I mailed it out on the last day possible. Within 36 hours Apex had it cleared up.

To me that sounds like great customer service, and a pretty good company. There was nothign wrong with apex suggesting them.

- Apex <--- Sorry had to throw that in

[J-Dogg]

I called my CC company, and they wanted to know if this was fruad, like if someone stole my CC. I ordered back in January so I didn't know what to say. How in the world do I approach this? "Umm, yeah, I made a purchase 5 months ago, and I just now realized it was not mine." Or do I tell them I didn't receive the goods I purchased, or that the company just took my money and ran? Thanks in advance for any help on this matter.

[J-Dogg]

Cyberrebate just posted an update on their web page. I liked the following line the best:

"We are currently in the process of creating a plan to repay our customers and creditors. It is our intention to pay back as much as we can, hopefully up to 100 percent of what we may owe. More information will be made available as developments occur. "

They just can't stop lying, can they?

[Kenshin]

Originally posted by J-Dogg
I called my CC company, and they wanted to know if this was fruad, like if someone stole my CC. I ordered back in January so I didn't know what to say. How in the world do I approach this? "Umm, yeah, I made a purchase 5 months ago, and I just now realized it was not mine." Or do I tell them I didn't receive the goods I purchased, or that the company just took my money and ran? Thanks in advance for any help on this matter.


Um, credit card fraud may not be the answer here. Which is to say that, if anything, you should argue that CR did it, and not perpetrate it yourself.

Now, the route I've seen most people taking, with varying levels of success, is that in addition to the merchandise, you were purchasing a service. The service being, obviously, CR providing you with a rebate. Since that's not going through, you were billed for services not received and should therefore, you will argue, be entitled to dispute the charges. (If you're a really smooth talker, you may want to argue that you were paying for the rebate and that the merchandise was something along the lines of a bonus that was offered.)

Of course, I'm not sure if this is the right thread to be discussing remedies, so I'll shut up now. Good luck.

[J-Dogg]

I agree with that, but since the purchase was over 4 months ago, it isn't covered by the 60 day policy. How do I get around that little technicality?

[Kenshin]

What's your card? IIRC, 60 is the minimum required by law, but I'm pretty sure that Discover's policy is something like 180 days.

[J-Dogg]

It's a GM Mastercard.

[ProMinx]

Congratulations on the most responsible reply to this horrible situation, Apex. You re-affirm all of our reasons for remaining supporters of your site while some of the other sites have proven to be rather sketchy.

ProMinx

[freenet]

wow...Apex's promise and refund eclipses that of ALL deals forums!! Pure professionalism. I havent been visiting Gotapex for a while (kinda got into fatwallet) but maybe I need to start again...

Fatwallet created a cyberrebate forum for its users, another good sign, but its owner removed a few posts which may have incurred him liability...meanwhile, Alex at BigBigsavings went out of his way to MADLY delete all posts and guarantees which may have caused him liability....BAD MOVE.

Again, I applaud Gabriel and Gotapex.