ps2 or xbox?

[DankNstickY]

i'm plannin on getting a new game system. but i dont know which one.

i was leaning towards playstation, but some friends started telling me i should get an xbox.

what do u guys think, and why?

[Tommy Boomfiger]

Boy, you really do have a problem on your hands, dont you (http://www.gotapex.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?forumid=11)

[Cheesypuff]

Last year...I would have said ps2...now...I think I'm gonna go with xbox...for multiple reasons...

xbox...has a 8gig hdd which equals faster loading time and virtually unlimited saving.

xbox...has better graphics due to the fatty gf2 card in it.

xbox...has a ethernet hook up already while the ps2 does not...which you have to buy.

xbox...the small controler feels good in the hand...but I don't like the big controler that xbox makes...those are bad...but the small are good.

though

ps2...it has free online gaming...not like xbox live thing....


so seeing all the pros and cons about ps2 and xbox, this is pretty much why I'm leaning on getting a xbox for myself instead of a pse.

[gear02]

Don't forget the PS2 can play PS1 games...

Also the PS2 has better PS2-exclusive games than the Xbox, though that margin is fading fast.

I say you're good with either one. Or get both. :D

[DankNstickY]

Originally posted by gear02
I say you're good with either one. Or get both. :D

geez i wish.


so how's the online gaming thing work with both systems? what do u need in order to play online (besides the system itself :P )


don't you think that it'd be a better deal to buy the ps2 ethernet thing and have free online gaming, rather than gettin a free ethernet connect and having to pay for online games?

[SpeedyVic]

Here's my plug for the Xbox. Better graphics. Xbox Live is all broadband so better online playing. You have to have cable or DSL though. HDD is a definite plus. I have Xbox Live and I think it's great. Virtually zero lagg. And you can DL new content for your single person games, like Splinter Cell.

You PS2 owners, how many of you that had PS1 actually still play the PS1 games? Not trying to start a flame war, just curious is all.

[Tommy Boomfiger]

Originally posted by SpeedyVic
You PS2 owners, how many of you that had PS1 actually still play the PS1 games? Not trying to start a flame war, just curious is all. yes

[Jihforce]

Xbox...However, I'm concerned about the "quality" of games that's coming out for it. Its been 1 year and its still lacking in that department.

[spigidygak]

Originally posted by Cheesypuff
Last year...I would have said ps2...now...I think I'm gonna go with xbox...for multiple reasons...

xbox...has a 8gig hdd which equals faster loading time and virtually unlimited saving.

xbox...has better graphics due to the fatty gf2 card in it.

xbox...has a ethernet hook up already while the ps2 does not...which you have to buy.

xbox...the small controler feels good in the hand...but I don't like the big controler that xbox makes...those are bad...but the small are good.

though

ps2...it has free online gaming...not like xbox live thing....


so seeing all the pros and cons about ps2 and xbox, this is pretty much why I'm leaning on getting a xbox for myself instead of a pse.

Personally I think the loading times are negligible. My friend has the xbox and so far the games he has that use the hard drive don't seem anything faster than the ps2 games I use with memory cards.

Graphics are better on xbox. . . most of the time, however pretty marginal. Only real noticeable if you have a nice tv and using component cables.

Yes xbox has ethernet built in. . .however you pay for xbox live set which is the same thing as buying the network adapter for the ps2 which ads (me shudders) a modem jack. . . but hey not all of us can get broadband or afford it.

Yes the small controller feels good, the first one is just utter crap. But, there is just no better controller than the dualshock. Probably reason why sony didn't change the shape of it for the ps2. Just added analog control on all buttons.

Basically for me I'd say sony has the upper hand in better exclusive software. Which is more important than any of the reasons above. I think the only Xbox exclusive game that I'm drooling over is splinter cell, but that will be on pc eventually. Sure halo was cool. . . but wasn't that great imho. I think gran turismo, grand theft auto 3 and vice city are enough reason to go with the ps2.

[x1337xD335C1P13x]

XBOX comes with four available controller ports, compared to the 2 for PS2.
XBOX loads most games faster than PS2 (GTA vice city takes forever to load, especially the beginning)
XBOX has HALO, and HALO 2 is coming out.
XBOX is selling with 2 ok games, and a controler for $199.99, whereas PS2 is $199.99 by itself (at target)
XBOX has an Intel 733MHz processor, whereas PS2 has a 300 mhz
XBOX doesnt need memory cards, it has an internal hard drive!
And personally, i prefer the green and black to the blue and black.

[xsiled2]

Originally posted by x1337xD335C1P13x

green and black to the blue and black.


there is no black on the xbox(plastic), minus the black button on the controller.

[DankNstickY]

well... i havent been on here in a few days.

i got the ps2. best buy raped my parents. $320 for console, additional control, memory card, and a game. geez.

got metal gear solid on monday for $20, and i can't stop playing it.

as far as the 4 controller ports on the xbox vs the 2 on ps2, u can always get the adapter thingy to hook more up. no biggy.
and for the xbox online-gaming-ready, you need cable or dsl, which i dont have neither, so doesnt really matter which one.

oh well... i'm still happy :D

[ribitch]

i got the xbox and love it. My brother has a PS2, but i think the xBox looks much better, runs loads faster, and the controlers are better. The only thing i wish i hade was vice city, but he has that, so i can live with playing it on his ps2.


the 300MHz is based on a different architecture than the xBox. you are compareing apples to oranges. or apples to intels :D

[gear02]

Originally posted by ribitch
the 300MHz is based on a different architecture than the xBox. you are compareing apples to oranges. or apples to intels :D

YES! Please please please! At least know that you can't compare an Intel chip, AMD chip, and a PowerPC by just it's clock speed. The architecture is different and so the clock speeds are NOT equal.

This is one of my biggest pet peeves and the reason why AMD decided to use the XP 2200+ moniker, so that people would stop doing direct comparisons.

[i6s1]

Get xbox if you have cable or dsl. If you don't have broadband, get it. Then get an xbox.

[xsiled2]

Originally posted by ribitch
the 300MHz is based on a different architecture than the xBox. you are compareing apples to oranges. or apples to intels :D

um in this case the 733 is a crap load more powerful then the ps2 so ur whole apple to intel comparison is worthless...

the more powerful 733 IS more powerful then the 300 regaurdless its clock.

[apmiller]

If it's a choice between XB and PS2 then you should just go with the PS2. It's the safe bet! You can't go wrong with the selection of games. X-Box just doesn't have that many hit games.

System performace there's no doubt that x-box beats them all but it means nothing when they don't have the games to back it up.

[xsiled2]

um HALO HELLO... what ps2 game is better?.. ever played time splitters 2 on a ps2? IT SUCKS, looks great on xbox...

[apmiller]

Originally posted by xsiled2
um HALO HELLO... what ps2 game is better?.. ever played time splitters 2 on a ps2? IT SUCKS, looks great on xbox...

Actually Time Splitters 2 is better on the Game Cube. No load times and better graphics...

X-Box has no games. They games they do have are on the PS2 as well. Might as well get a PS2 so you can have all the games than be limited. With the addition of being able to play the PS1 games too and having the best controller...X-Box isn't worth it.

[Jihforce]

XBOX BABY!
I got me one today ;) My coworker gave it to me. Heehee.
Wedding present. Muhahahaaaa

[Memo]

Originally posted by apmiller


Actually Time Splitters 2 is better on the Game Cube. No load times and better graphics...

X-Box has no games. They games they do have are on the PS2 as well. Might as well get a PS2 so you can have all the games than be limited. With the addition of being able to play the PS1 games too and having the best controller...X-Box isn't worth it.

That's completely false. Xbox DOES have great games. Splinter Cell for one is a great game. Most of the multi-platform games look WAY better on Xbox (Tony Hawk 4, Madden, all the sports games). Halo is also bad ass! And XBox has XBox live

[xsiled2]

Originally posted by apmiller
having the best controller...X-Box isn't worth it.

ok first lets look on worth, hrm xbox, 2 games one controller $200, playstation a 3 year old system that is showing its age no game one controller- $200. xbox runs the best games SMOOTHLY with PC like load times, on top of that you dont have to buy a card to save games.

controller, sure the original was crap on the xbox, but since the only way you could have one of those is from getting the original series of xbox or you like it.

the ps2/ ps controller can only be good because it is super generic at this point. its used for everything and unless youve been a box you probly know how to use it.

the xbox S and original for that matter are set up for better gaming, they allow a person to have PC like controll without shoving both of your thumbs side by side.

game cube has less games then xbox and the discs are as toy as the hyandai logo.

[Memo]

I agree with Xsiled, the Xbox controller S is superior to the Ps2 controller. THe original XBox cnotroller was a piece of crap but the S version makes it EASY to use 2 joysticks with your thumbs at once, which is a MUST for games like Splinter Cell where you move the camera and guy at the same time. It also adds 2 more buttons which are sometimes needed with todays more complicated games.

[apmiller]

Wow...good stuff here. I like talking to folks that pay attention to the industry and just don't come back with "it's just cool so there!"

I don't really disagree with you folks either.

Like I've said before, the Xbox is a powerhouse and there is no better console as far as specs go. Yes, games do look better on the XBox. Not in every case but most of them. Games not originally made for the XB tend to look better on the GC and that's only because the GC was made to put out color like no ones business so it appears to look better.

What has been a thorn in the XB side has been the fact it has few games...PS2 has more games you can choke a buffalo with. Sales show gamers like to have as many games as they can get their hands on, but thats the adverage gamer...folks like me. All though we want quality we will give it up a bit just to have more games. We want to keep playing non stop. That's why the PS2 out sells all other units, the GBA comes in second and the GC and XB are always fighting for the third spot.

The controllers...here is where you loose me. Even the new XB controller feels strange in my hands. I still don't like it. I rather have the PS2 or GC controllers. They feel more natural to me. But that's just my opinion...

[gear02]

Originally posted by apmiller
Wow...good stuff here. I like talking to folks that pay attention to the industry and just don't come back with "it's just cool so there!"

The controllers...here is where you loose me. Even the new XB controller feels strange in my hands. I still don't like it. I rather have the PS2 or GC controllers. They feel more natural to me. But that's just my opinion...

Give it more time and you'll find the S controller to be a better fit that PS2. I don't like the GC controller too much since it doesn't have too many buttons, which make sports games hard to play. Also, the three other buttons (B, X, Y) are in strange positions.

Load times and graphics rock on the cube, but I don't like the fact that it uses memory cards. Same for PS2. I love the Xbox hard drive for my sports games since they take up tons of space. Madden for cube took a WHOLE Memory Card 59 and about a quarter of a PS2 card.

But in any case, you really can't go wrong buying either of the three consoles. Just find the better deal and ignore all the fanboys.

[apmiller]

Originally posted by gear02


Load times and graphics rock on the cube, but I don't like the fact that it uses memory cards. Same for PS2. I love the Xbox hard drive for my sports games since they take up tons of space. Madden for cube took a WHOLE Memory Card 59 and about a quarter of a PS2 card.

But in any case, you really can't go wrong buying either of the three consoles. Just find the better deal and ignore all the fanboys.

Agreed...though I love my Cube, I'm getting a little tired of switching back and forth between the 4 memory cards I have.

[SpeedyVic]

Why does the Xbox not have as many games as the PS2? Probably because of market saturation. More people have the PS2 due to it being out longer and also because of the initial price of the Xbox. (Way too high!)

I am hoping that lowering the price of the Xbox to a competetive level (coupled with the launch of Xbox Live) will increase the market share for the Xbox. If more people play on the Box, more developers and publishers will invest more of thier assets to making high quality games for the Xbox, instead of just converting a PS2 title.

[apmiller]

Originally posted by SpeedyVic
Why does the Xbox not have as many games as the PS2? Probably because of market saturation. More people have the PS2 due to it being out longer and also because of the initial price of the Xbox. (Way too high!)

I am hoping that lowering the price of the Xbox to a competetive level (coupled with the launch of Xbox Live) will increase the market share for the Xbox. If more people play on the Box, more developers and publishers will invest more of thier assets to making high quality games for the Xbox, instead of just converting a PS2 title.

I think your right. PS2 had a big advantage to start with. The XB has the ability of being huge and taking over the market but (in my opinion) only if they can start turning a profit. Microsoft is very open about the fact they sell this thing way under the cost of making it and with every unit sold they take a loss. X-Box Live has not pulled in the numbers they thought it would either. Though Microsoft still cliams they still stand behind the XB and have no plans on pulling out. They say that though the losses are high they can make it up in other areas of the company. This makes me wonder how long can they go with taking the loss? Eventually they will ahve to shut it all down (I would think) if they can't make it profitable.

[Mpowered]

Damn, what difference does it make that one system has better graphics than another? Stop nitpicking.

Figure out which has the games you want more. If the XB has your favorite games get it, if the PS2 has them go for it. All the damn hardware in the world isn’t going to make sucky games any more fun. And yes, sucky is a personal preference!

[GraingerGuy]

Originally posted by xsiled2


there is no black on the xbox(plastic), minus the black button on the controller.

http://www.theforumisdown.com/uploadfiles/1102/xboxsystem.jpg

How is that no black on the Xbox or the controllers? They are predominately black....:confused:

[sleepminded]

ps2
its just better :o

[xsiled2]

Originally posted by GraingerGuy

How is that no black on the Xbox or the controllers? They are predominately black....:confused:

youve never seen one in person then, its all green, dark yes, sure it might look black in a dark room, but its all green.

[apmiller]

Originally posted by xsiled2


youve never seen one in person then, its all green, dark yes, sure it might look black in a dark room, but its all green.

Are you sure about that? You look at one up close and it sure looks black... :hmm:

[Jihforce]

Its black...i have one sitting under my tv and I can tell you that its black.

[ProMinx]

Originally posted by xsiled2


there is no black on the xbox(plastic), minus the black button on the controller.

What are you talking about, XSiled?! How can you say that there is no black on the X-Box? My X-Box is black ribbed plastic with a green circle at the center of the X. It isn't "dark green". It is BLACK. I would say that the enormously overwhelming presence of black counts as having black...

On to more important things. I have a Playstation 2 (regrettably) and an X-Box (thankfully). If you can't tell which side I have to side with, you clearly can't read very well. While Playstation 2 has been around a lot longer, has established a larger consumer base, and has more games...X-Box is more powerful, has more GOOD games, and has a higher Game-to-console ratio (translation: the average number of games owned by an X-Box owner is higher than the average number of games for any other console owner ever).

I have only had my X-Box for about 2 months, but I already own 10 games. How can you say that there is a shortage of games, when I already own 10 of them in 2 months? If you think I've sacrificed quality for quantity, I'll list them for you:

Amped, Bloodwake, Halo, Jet Set Radio Future, MechAssault, NHL 2K3, Sega GT, Splinter Cell, Star Wars: Jedi Starfighter, and Unreal Championship

That is a pretty good line-up. Don't forget that Sega has thrown in with Microsoft as well, so we'll be seeing the majority of system-exclusive Sega games (not counting Sonic) on the X-Box. Is anyone else looking forward to Panzer Dragoon Orta in a few days? Or Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic in February? Or Halo, Star Wars Galaxies (even if I am in the current PC beta), Fable, or Brute Force later in the year?

Besides...don't underestimate the drawing power of X-Box Live. This is the single best game accessory I have ever purchased. Playing MechAssault online is the most addictive experience I have ever seen in gaming. Besides that, Unreal Championship and NHL 2K3 also work online, and there are 50 other X-Box live games that will be launched in the next year.

There is just no beating an X-Box in the modern console market. I can't think of anything that the system is lacking. I don't regret my X-Box purchase in the least. My roommate...however, is strongly debating selling his PS2 jsut because it has proved overwhelmingly lacking...

ProMinx

[xsiled2]

your all color blind, its all green, the new ones are green the old ones are green, controllers: the S is green the original is green the plastic the cord GREEN.

edit: all :)

[apmiller]

Originally posted by xsiled2
your all color blind, its all green, the new ones are green the old ones are green, controllers: the S is green the original is green the plastic the cord GREEN.

edit: all :)

I think your smoking that controller...

Did you buy some cheap knock off?

Do you have proof that what you have is dark green and not black?

I just don't think you can convince any of us here otherwise.

[apmiller]

Originally posted by ProMinx


On to more important things. I have a Playstation 2 (regrettably) and an X-Box (thankfully). If you can't tell which side I have to side with, you clearly can't read very well. While Playstation 2 has been around a lot longer, has established a larger consumer base, and has more games...X-Box is more powerful, has more GOOD games, and has a higher Game-to-console ratio (translation: the average number of games owned by an X-Box owner is higher than the average number of games for any other console owner ever).

I have only had my X-Box for about 2 months, but I already own 10 games. How can you say that there is a shortage of games, when I already own 10 of them in 2 months? If you think I've sacrificed quality for quantity, I'll list them for you:

Amped, Bloodwake, Halo, Jet Set Radio Future, MechAssault, NHL 2K3, Sega GT, Splinter Cell, Star Wars: Jedi Starfighter, and Unreal Championship

That is a pretty good line-up. Don't forget that Sega has thrown in with Microsoft as well, so we'll be seeing the majority of system-exclusive Sega games (not counting Sonic) on the X-Box. Is anyone else looking forward to Panzer Dragoon Orta in a few days? Or Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic in February? Or Halo, Star Wars Galaxies (even if I am in the current PC beta), Fable, or Brute Force later in the year?

Besides...don't underestimate the drawing power of X-Box Live. This is the single best game accessory I have ever purchased. Playing MechAssault online is the most addictive experience I have ever seen in gaming. Besides that, Unreal Championship and NHL 2K3 also work online, and there are 50 other X-Box live games that will be launched in the next year.

There is just no beating an X-Box in the modern console market. I can't think of anything that the system is lacking. I don't regret my X-Box purchase in the least. My roommate...however, is strongly debating selling his PS2 just because it has proved overwhelmingly lacking...

ProMinx

You make a good point but the same can be said for the Game Cube too.
(Mario Sunshine, Star Fox Adventures, Metroid Prime, Animal Crossing, the Resident Evil series, Monkey Ball, Phantasy Star Online: Episode I & II, Mario Party 4, Super Smash Brothers Melee, Legend of Zelda: The Wind Walker...)

The other thing is that you can buy a PS2 and already have 50 games for it if you had owned a PSX. No to mention you can get a lot of PS2 games very cheap these days thanks to the fact it's been on the market so long.

X-Box live is a great set up for sure. After all it 100% broadban, how you going to beat that? How many folks want to pay $50 a month to keep it up and going though?

If I'm going to spend the money I'd still go with the PS2. I can get a lot more than I could the XB and I know the PS2 will be around a long time and when the PS3 comes out all my PS2 stuff will work on it.

With the XB we still don't know if Microsoft will keep with it. They've said time and again it's not profitable but they are sticking with it for now.

[Butch]

For me, the XBOX was absolutely the right choice.

I don't play games frequently, and do not have any PS1 games to grandfather in with a PS2 (My last game system before this was my old NES).

The XBOX is the most powerful, and therefore has the greatest potential to put out impressive games. And given that I play infrequently, I can be quite satisfied with even just a few top notch games that really show the muscle of the system (ie. Splinter Cell and HALO).

I have broadband access at home, and will probably subscribe to XBOX live when there are more games available for it. By the way, apmiller, the cost is $50 for 1 year's access right now (Not one month's). After the year is up, the cost is expected to be about $10 a month.

It would be fun to be able to play GTA or something, but I'm never in such a huge rush to get a game. I'm sure that eventually the GTA series will be available on XBOX. There's money to be made there.

[gear02]

Originally posted by ProMinx


ProMinx

HOLY COW! PROMINX!!!!

Where have you been??!?

Welcome back! :D

[ribitch]

in 2004 the GTA series has potential to come to systems other than PC and PS. the series has an exclusive contract until then.

my xbox is black as can be.

i barely played games until i got my xbox, now i play daily. I am working on 007:Nightfire, Halo, and Splinter Cell right now. Once i get done with one,I will start MGS: substance. i have that and a few other games waiting for when i start beating stuff.

i love multiplayer bond. Throw in a few bots, use explosive weapons, and have a blood bath. cant beat it. Eventually i will check out unreal

[apmiller]

Originally posted by Butch
By the way, apmiller, the cost is $50 for 1 year's access right now (Not one month's). After the year is up, the cost is expected to be about $10 a month.


Now that's better to what I thought. I missunderstood.

Overall I'm a GC guy. I've got kids and we're a big fan of Mario and Zelda so I tend to go with Nintendo over them all. I would rather own a GC and a PS2 but gots to live within my means as much as possible. (But if that PS2 drops to $99 bucks this year like rumored...he he.)

GC is a good unit and finally has some great games with more coming. (About time!)Don't like memory cards though...that built in hard drive would be nice.

[sleepminded]

those x-box games would look better on computers. :o

[xsiled2]

ok xbox owners, take you xbox out side or under a VERY bright light. you will find that all plastic on the S, orginal, and the console are green.

[Butch]

Originally posted by xsiled2
ok xbox owners, take you xbox out side or under a VERY bright light. you will find that all plastic on the S, orginal, and the console are green.

Straight from the horse's mouth . . .

http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/features/2001/jan01/01-06xbox.asp

Microsoft Designers Go to Extremes to Make Sure the Xbox Console and Controller Convey New and Unforeseen Gameplay Experience

LAS VEGAS, Nev., - Jan. 6, 2001- Room 1160 is about as close to top secret as you'll find in the quiet suburban office park that Microsoft's Games Division calls home. The door is always locked, the blinds always shut.

Inside, Microsoft designer Horace Luke and his colleagues have been working on one of the toughest challenges of their careers - translating the new and unforeseen game play experiences of the company's Xbox gaming unit to the physical design of the stand-alone console, controls and logo.

Drawings stamped "confidential" cover the walls. Early versions of the console and controller cover the tables. Against one wall lean photo collages of some of the thousands of gamers consulted to help design Microsoft's first-ever home game console -- and one of its largest investments. Xbox's promotional budget alone is $500 million.

With so much at stake, Microsoft has worked hard to keep the design of Xbox under wraps - until today. Microsoft Chairman and Chief Software Architect Bill Gates unveiled prototypes of the Xbox console and controller this morning during his keynote address at the 2001 International Consumer Electronics Show (CES) in Las Vegas. He also demonstrated two exclusive Xbox games - "Oddworld: Munch's Oddysee" and "Malice" -- that highlight the future-generation console's rich and realistic graphics capabilities.

"Gamers are going to know right when they see this console and controller what to expect when they turn on the Xbox," Luke said recently. "They are going to know they are playing on a system that offers more power and new, unforeseen gaming experiences than they've ever seen on a home console."

The power Luke speaks of is easily evident in the raised ribs that run across the rich, black exterior of the console, giving it the look of a supercharged car stereo amplifier. The console is also emblazoned with a large X with a raised, signature Xbox "jewel" at its center. The controller combines a sleek two-handed grip with more game-control buttons and triggers than any other game console. Extra-long controller cables stream from the back of the console and glow green from the inside.

Based on early versions he previewed prior to today's unveiling, Benjamin Turner, a site director with the GameSpy Network, a collection of 51 gaming Web sites, expects a lot from the final design. "It's definitely going to stand out," Turner said, "in a way that Sony PlayStation 2 does not."

Xbox Design Previews Function

Since Microsoft last year announced plans to build its first console gaming system, the big news has been what Xbox will let gamers do, not what it will look like. Xbox promises unrivaled technology and the most realistic home gaming experience ever, including a custom-designed graphics chip capable of processing more than one trillion operations per second and providing at least three times the graphics performance of the newest generation of game consoles. Xbox will also offer four game controller ports for easy multiplayer gaming and adding peripherals, a front-loading DVD tray, a multisignal audio-video connector for easy hookup to televisions and home theater systems, an Ethernet port for fast online gaming, an NVIDIA graphics processing unit (GPU), Intel 733 megahertz central processing unit (CPU), and an eight gigabyte hard drive for massive game storage. The power of many of these and other features exceeds - and in some cases even doubles or quadruples - that offered by Xbox's competitors.

So why does Microsoft care so much about Xbox's exterior trappings[a1]? In the highly competitive world of home gaming consoles, the shell of a gaming console is not just a piece of plastic that keeps dust out of the inner workings. The controller isn't just a way to make pixilated characters move around the screen. Design sets the tone and conveys the potential of the gaming system.

"Gamers gain a certain amount of respect and insight into the image from how a console looks," said Vincent Lopez, editor and chief of IGN Xbox, a gaming Web site unaffiliated with Microsoft. "What you see is what you get."

As a result, Microsoft has gone to extremes unheard of in the gaming world to make sure Xbox looks, as well as functions, like the revolution it promises to be.

5,000 Gamers Can't Be Wrong

Microsoft talked to 5,000 gamers in the United States, Japan and Europe. Xbox designers even toured 130 of these gamers' homes to see how and where they played games. Luke alone spent time with more than two dozen gamers in the United States and Japan. He played games and quizzed them on what they liked and didn't like about current consoles. He also visited shops where gamers hang out or buy consoles and games to "absorb the culture, see what they see every day," Luke explained.

The insights he and the other Microsoft designers gained were invaluable, Luke said. Some insights seemed trivial - pastel colored buttons on controllers aren't cool -- but were important to some gamers. Others greatly influenced the overall design. For example, the designers noticed many gamers keep their consoles in the middle of their living room or family room, but only by necessity. The cords from the controller are too short to reach the sofa. Or games must be loaded into the top of the console, making the console too tall to fit into an entertainment center. As a result, Xbox will offer a cord more than 9.5 feet long-- the longest offered by a console maker -- and the front-loading DVD tray for game CDs.

"Visiting gamers in their homes helped put us in their shoes," Luke explained. "We are designing on their behalf."

The Microsoft designers kept in touch with gamers throughout the design process. In particular, gamers tested many of the 34 different variations of the controller that Microsoft built before settling on the current model. It features an eight-way directional pad (D-pad); left and right analog sticks; left and right shoulder triggers; six pressure-sensitive, multicolored analog buttons; dual slots for memory cards and other peripherals; and a built in "rumble" feature for more realistic gaming.

"Not only does this controller offer more ways to interact with the game; the buttons and triggers are located in the places gamers want them," Luke said. "We know because gamers told us where they wanted them."

Turner of the GameSpy Network said Microsoft's efforts to gauge the tastes of gamers might well be unprecedented. "I don't know of any company consulting gamers to such an extent," he said. "I'm heartened they care so much about what the hardcore gamer thinks. That can only be a good thing."

IGN Xbox's Lopez agreed: "That's a great way to get people on your side: Get their input."

Defining Power: Jets, Motorcycles Good; Mack Trucks Bad

Gamers helped design the look of the console and controller in others ways as well. Xbox designers asked them to share what they consider symbols of power. Gamers suggested jet airplanes, Ferrari automobiles, motorcycles, loud stereos. Traditional symbols, such as Mack trucks, didn't interest them.

Luke and the other designers kept these symbols in mind as they created the look of the console case and game controller. Then they let inspiration take over. Luke got the idea for the ribs on the console when he was walking around his office playing catch with aluminum heat sink from a computer he had recently disassembled. The palm-sized sink, which helps dissipate heat inside a computer, has metal spines that resemble those on a car stereo amplifier.

"When gamers see the Xbox, I want them to think of the loudest car stereo they have ever heard - one so powerful it shakes the windows of their home. That's the kind of power they will get with Xbox," Luke said. "I also want the look of the console to build anticipation. I want gamers to be thinking about turning on the Xbox from the moment their mother, spouse or significant other forces them to turn it off."

The Microsoft designers reinforced the idea of Xbox's unforeseen potential and power by putting a raised "jewel" on the top of the console. Luke compares it to a porthole on a furnace, nuclear submarine or atomic collider. "You can see the fire inside burning," Luke explained.

But what color should the fire be? In the real world, fire is red. With everything that is Xbox, it is green, a radioactive neon green. The color radiates out from Xbox logos and gives the controller cables the look of alien veins.

As with nearly every other aspect of the design of Xbox, Luke had a hand in choosing the color, though, in a sense, the color chose itself. Green has always been the color associated with technology, magic and outer space, Luke explained. It also was the only color marker he had in his knapsack when he was drawing early designs for Xbox.

"It was just total luck that I had the perfect color of green," he said. "From the moment we saw it on the drawings, we knew it was right."

Now gamers get their chance to peek into Room 1160 and, Microsoft expects, draw the same conclusion.

[gear02]

Originally posted by xsiled2
ok xbox owners, take you xbox out side or under a VERY bright light. you will find that all plastic on the S, orginal, and the console are green.

Before or after you stare at the sun for a couple of minutes? :D

It looks black to me...

I do know that there IS a green xbox and controller that they released before xmas. Are you talking about that?

[ProMinx]

Thanks for the welcome back Gear. I just came back to check on my boys :p How have you been?

APM and everyone, X-Box Live is 50 bucks for the first year (that also covers the communicator and demo cd) and then after the first year it goes to $5 a month (not $10). The odd thing is that it would be only 50 bucks to buy yet another headset and another year, which would be cool because then when you play online with another person at your place you can both use Communicator headsets (and playing without the headset, you miss out on a lot of the fun).

ProMinx

[ribitch]

so its only $5 a month after the first year? so $60 annually?

can 2 people play at one time online using my xbox? say me and my bro playing unreal versus whomever, or do we need 2 consoles to do that? I would like to get it, buut my live enabled games can only dl new features. i have yet to get a game that allows online multiplayer.

[ProMinx]

You can play X-Box Live games with two people on the same console. I regularly play MechAssault online while another friend plays a second mech on the other half of the TV. Only one of you has the communicator in though...so only one person can hear the online chatter, but it's still fun without it. Trust me, Ribitch. Buy MechAssault along with X-Box Live and you will NOT be disappointed.

ProMinx

[xsiled2]

ill take a bloody picture.

[Butch]

Originally posted by ProMinx
Thanks for the welcome back Gear. I just came back to check on my boys :p How have you been?

APM and everyone, X-Box Live is 50 bucks for the first year (that also covers the communicator and demo cd) and then after the first year it goes to $5 a month (not $10). The odd thing is that it would be only 50 bucks to buy yet another headset and another year, which would be cool because then when you play online with another person at your place you can both use Communicator headsets (and playing without the headset, you miss out on a lot of the fun).

ProMinx

Out of curiosity, where and when did you hear about the $5 a month fee? Last I'd heard - and admittedly, it is probably dated information - was that Microsoft had not yet decided upon a price, but was "comfortable" with about $10 a month.

Actually, here's a link that mentions that. I forget if this is the same source I read originally . . . http://xbox.ign.com/articles/361/361526p1.html

[apmiller]

If it's 5 bucks a month that's a nice deal. What is it for PS2? Is there a monthly fee?

CG only has one game that plays online right now and that's PSO which is $8.95 a month. So far I haven't heard of any other game taking advantage of the GC's modem.

[gear02]

Originally posted by apmiller
If it's 5 bucks a month that's a nice deal. What is it for PS2? Is there a monthly fee?

CG only has one game that plays online right now and that's PSO which is $8.95 a month. So far I haven't heard of any other game taking advantage of the GC's modem.

I think the PS2 doesn't have a fee, that is if you can actually find a network adapter in stores. PS2 doesn't have a full system like Xbox Live so it's on a game to game basis. I think SOCOM is free for online play right now.


Originally posted by ProMinx
Thanks for the welcome back Gear. I just came back to check on my boys :p How have you been?[/B]

And I'm doing fine Prominx. Hope you visit us more often!

[Tommy Boomfiger]

Originally posted by gear02


I think the PS2 doesn't have a fee, that is if you can actually find a network adapter in stores. PS2 doesn't have a full system like Xbox Live so it's on a game to game basis. I think SOCOM is free for online play right now.
yeah, ps2 online will be on a game by game basis. some games will be $50 with free online, some will be over $50 with included online and some will have a monthly fee.

i havent had any problems finding the network adapters, ive seen shelves full of them at target and plenty of them at game stores like ebgames and gamestop plus there is always online. the socom/adatper package might be a little harder to find

[gear02]

http://www.computerandvideogames.com/screenshots_library/dir_155/vortal_pic_77983.jpg

http://www.theforumisdown.com/uploadfiles/1102/xbox.jpg

[Cantacuzene]

My Xbox, clearly black...

http://www.theforumisdown.com/uploadfiles/1102/DCP_0006.JPG

[i6s1]

Black with a little tiny bit of a green tint is not green. It is black. When *everyone* disagrees with you, the only conclusion to draw is that you are wrong. (GAM excepted, sir)

There are also rumors that PS2 game companies may start charging for online play, but I don't think anyone wants to be first.



Edit: Found a green xbox:
http://www.theforumisdown.com/uploadfiles/1102/greenxbox.jpg

[xsiled2]

see the issue is with yellow light you dont see the green, try a halogen light or take it outside in afternoon light.

http://xsiled.homestead.com/files/xbox1.jpg
http://xsiled.homestead.com/files/xbox2.jpg
http://xsiled.homestead.com/files/xbox3.jpg
http://xsiled.homestead.com/files/xbox4.jpg

edit: i might add that the S and the xbox are the same plastic just the light hits them differently. this color is the same with every xobx that is not the translucent one.

[Tommy Boomfiger]

i was thinking you were right xsiled. i hadnt spent very much time with an xbox so i didnt say anything, but those pics sure look black to me. the cable does look green though

[Butch]

Originally posted by Tommy Boomfiger
i was thinking you were right xsiled. i hadnt spent very much time with an xbox so i didnt say anything, but those pics sure look black to me. the cable does look green though

The cable is green.

I thought this box color thing should have been settled with the ARTICLE FROM MICROSOFT'S WEBSITE that I posted earlier ;)

[xsiled2]

how can you not see olive green....

[Capricornholio]

I know this isn't the place to rag, but why even buy a console over having a good rocket ship of a PC. I used to dump all my money on consoles and games, but I haven't touched 'em since owning a PC. I can play all the games I want offline/online, shop, pay bills, & D/L music & porn.

[Jihforce]

Originally posted by xsiled2
how can you not see olive green....

I looked at your images in photoshop and it has both black-green, grayish-green and solid black pigmentation throughout the xbox.

[xsiled2]

hrm ill try to get one in mid day outside.

[ProMinx]

The $5 information I had came from when I signed up for the X-Box service. The contract I agreed to online said something about paying 5 bucks a month if i don't cancel by the end of the year.

I still don't see why the post oone year thing is even important... Who cares if the service is 5 bucks a month or 30 bucks a month? All you have to do is buy a new X-Box Live starter kit and you get another free year for $49.99 instead of $60 (12x$5) or $360 (12x$30). That way you have two headsets so you and guests can both use the headset when playing online. See, the monthly charge is trivial.

On another note, I just went out and bought my copy of X-Box Panzer Dragoon Orta. Here's hoping that this rail-shooter is everything it is cracked up to be. The next X-Box games I'm looking forward to are Knights of the Old Republic and RtCW.

ProMinx

ps - IT IS BLACK. Technically there is nothing you can find that is truly black. What appears to be black is usually very dark purple (both because purple is a dark enough color and because the human eye is very weak in the high frequency blues and violet range). Therefore when something appears very dark, we call it black. The X-Box is green-based black.

[ribitch]

Originally posted by ProMinx
The $5 information I had came from when I signed up for the X-Box service. The contract I agreed to online said something about paying 5 bucks a month if i don't cancel by the end of the year.

I still don't see why the post oone year thing is even important... Who cares if the service is 5 bucks a month or 30 bucks a month? All you have to do is buy a new X-Box Live starter kit and you get another free year for $49.99 instead of $60 (12x$5) or $360 (12x$30). That way you have two headsets so you and guests can both use the headset when playing online. See, the monthly charge is trivial.

On another note, I just went out and bought my copy of X-Box Panzer Dragoon Orta. Here's hoping that this rail-shooter is everything it is cracked up to be. The next X-Box games I'm looking forward to are Knights of the Old Republic and RtCW.

ProMinx

ps - IT IS BLACK. Technically there is nothing you can find that is truly black. What appears to be black is usually very dark purple (both because purple is a dark enough color and because the human eye is very weak in the high frequency blues and violet range). Therefore when something appears very dark, we call it black. The X-Box is green-based black.


the live starter kit priuce expires in october if you read the box. I had teh same thoughts, but that is an introductory price.I assume they will raise the kits price in october. I also believe that the intro price is limited to one per household.

[apmiller]

I still think it looks black but with all the hours I put in on video games my eyes may not be what they use to be. :rolleyes:

[Butch]

Ahhhhh I caved and bought an XBOX Live Starter Kit.

The $24.99 Unreal Championship at EBGames on the Deals page . . . combined with the EB deal for $10 off the Starter Kit and an XBOX Live game did me in.

[Butch]

Originally posted by ProMinx
The $5 information I had came from when I signed up for the X-Box service. The contract I agreed to online said something about paying 5 bucks a month if i don't cancel by the end of the year.



Bah . . . I signed up last night, and my agreement just said that if I didn't cancel by the end of the year, I would would be charged for another year's service at the prevailing rate at the time. No mention of a specific price.