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nickel
10-10-2003, 05:47 AM
EAGLE, Colo. (AP) -- The woman who accused Kobe Bryant of rape told police a flirtatious encounter quickly turned ugly when he grabbed her by the neck, bent her over a chair and attacked her, repeatedly asking, "You're not going to tell anybody about this, right?"

The 19-year-old woman was raped after agreeing to go to Bryant's suite at the resort where she worked, Eagle County Sheriff's Detective Doug Winters testified Thursday at a preliminary hearing to determine whether Bryant will stand trial.

Winters described in graphic detail for a packed courtroom how, according to the woman, an exciting, chance meeting with the Los Angeles Lakers' superstar led to a nightmarish assault that left her shaken and in tears.

She said she told Bryant "no" at least twice and he ignored her, pulling her dress up and her underwear down and raping her from behind.

At one point, the woman told police, Bryant forced her to face him and say "no" when he asked if she was going to tell anyone. After the attack, Bryant made her kiss his penis, Winters said the woman told investigators.

Bryant, 25, has insisted the sex was consensual. He sat at the defense table staring straight at Winters for much of the hearing, hands folded in front of him. Bryant occasionally clenched his jaw, but showed little other reaction.

Though the testimony was graphic, the most explosive statement came from Bryant's own defense attorney when she suggested under cross examination that the woman's injuries would also be "consistent with a person who has had sex with three different men in three days."

That led an angry Judge Frederick Gannett to empty the courtroom and summon the lawyers to his chambers. Gannett was also upset earlier when defense attorney Pamela Mackey said the woman's name six times when asking questions.

She apologized, saying she would write herself a big note not to say it.

"Or I could get you a big muzzle," Gannett said.

The hearing -- expected to last only an afternoon -- was finally adjourned after more than six hours, an indication the trial could be long and laborious for both sides. Gannett said it would continue next Wednesday, and the district attorney's office said Bryant had to appear.

Winters, the only witness of the afternoon, recounted what the woman told him in an hourlong interview the day after she met Bryant at the resort. It all began with a tour of the hotel on June 30 that led to some flirting. She went back to Bryant's room and showed him a tattoo on her ankle, then turned down his request to join him in the hot tub, Winters said.

Her shift at the front desk was ending and she wanted to go home, he said, and "she was starting to feel a bit uncomfortable."

Winters said she stood up to leave and Bryant gave her a hug that led to some consensual kissing, Winters said.

But when she turned to go, Bryant grabbed her by the neck, pulled up her black dress and raped her against a chair, Winters said. She told investigators she said "no" at least twice, before bursting into tears as the five-minute attack went on.

Bryant wasn't holding her neck so tight she couldn't breathe, Winters said, but enough to control her movement.

"She was afraid that he was going to choke her," he said.

Afterward, Bryant told the woman to clean up, Winters said. She fixed her hair, wiped her face and left after again promising to remain silent.

She went back to the front desk to finish up her work and finally left the resort with an unidentified bellman, Winters said. She told him what happened and he urged her to report it, later following her home.

Winters testified that the woman's blood was found on the inside of Bryant's T-shirt, based on DNA tests. The woman told him she had bleeding from the attack, he said.

The prosecution also presented photographs showing vaginal injuries and one of a bruise on the woman's jaw, and a rape nurse's statement that her injuries were not consistent with consensual sex.

Mackey, though, suggested Winters had no idea when the bruise occurred, and got him to acknowledge that the woman needed no treatment for injuries when she was examined. She also questioned him on whether he saw marks on her neck when he interviewed her the next day.

"She talks on how Mr. Kobe Bryant grabbed her neck and choked her," Mackey told Winters. "You looked at her neck to see?"

Winters said he had, then Mackey asked him if he saw any injuries on her neck.

"Not from the front, no," he said.

"Not a red mark?" she asked.

"That's correct," he said.

"Not a scratch?"

"That's correct."

Winters said the woman seemed serious when he first interviewed her with her parents at their Eagle home.

"I sensed a crackle in her voice," he said. "She stated that he raped her."

Bryant faces up to life in prison if convicted of a felony charge of sexual assault. The judge said he would not rule Thursday on whether to proceed to trial.

Legal experts had expected the defense to waive the hearing and head straight to trial rather than allow prosecutors to lay out their case for the first time -- evidence that will be discussed in public for months.

Gannett had rejected defense requests to have the woman testify and to see her medical records.

The hearing began as hundreds of reporters and a handful of spectators gathered outside the courthouse to catch a glimpse of Bryant as he arrived with his lawyers in a caravan of three SUVs. He said nothing to the crowd.

Bryant had to take off a necklace and was checked with metal detectors before walking into the courtroom.

Bryant, free on $25,000 bond, had been ordered to appear in court for a bond hearing even if the preliminary hearing was waived. He left the Hawaii training camp of the Los Angeles Lakers on Wednesday.

Bryant has the right to go to trial within six months of entering a plea, but he could agree to push that back until later, perhaps after the NBA season ends early next summer.


link (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2003/basketball/nba/10/09/bryant.hearing.ap/?cnn=yes)

Merlin
10-10-2003, 05:52 AM
...attacked from behind...

http://www.imgmag.org/images/numbnutz/SMILIE_rear_entry.gif

bachviet
10-10-2003, 07:10 AM
It's going to be big trouble for Kobe and the Lakers' fans.

Freelance Superhero
10-10-2003, 07:21 AM
Originally posted by Merlin


http://www.imgmag.org/images/numbnutz/SMILIE_rear_entry.gif i think i've found my new favorite smiley.

appleseed
10-10-2003, 08:38 AM
now the defense says she had sex with three guys in three days and that's how the "vaginal trauma" occurred. judge shut down the proceeding and took everyone into chambers :heh:

heh, that's how this whole thing started...going into chambers...:naughty:

Jihforce
10-10-2003, 10:14 AM
Hahaha. That was funny applessed.
All I gotta say is, right about now, he's the last person I'd ever wanna be. I think he probably doesn't want to be himself right about now too.

kei2
10-10-2003, 10:30 AM
Originally posted by Jihforce
Hahaha. That was funny applessed.
All I gotta say is, right about now, he's the last person I'd ever wanna be. I think he probably doesn't want to be himself right about now too.
No need to exaggerate now. There are plenty of sex offenders and other convicts that are [rightly] facing long jail sentences or the death penalty. And I bet none of them have Bryant's cash or fan support. And to top it all off, I bet he'll get away with it. Dirty tactics like bringing the victim's character and background into question, combined with his expensive attorney(s) and the blind following of fans will probably get him off with just probation, if that. And that's just the criminals... there's also plenty of homeless people that would much rather be Kobe Bryant. I doubt he would trade his situation for theirs. So yeah there's lots of people I'd rather not be.

RoniMan
10-10-2003, 11:34 AM
sigh...as much as i'm a kobe fan, i can't NOT see the evidence. and it's not good for kobe. but kei2 is right, kobe's got the cash and fan base, so he'll prob get off with a slap on the wrist.

Jihforce
10-10-2003, 12:58 PM
Originally posted by kei2

No need to exaggerate now. There are plenty of sex offenders and other convicts that are [rightly] facing long jail sentences or the death penalty. And I bet none of them have Bryant's cash or fan support. And to top it all off, I bet he'll get away with it. Dirty tactics like bringing the victim's character and background into question, combined with his expensive attorney(s) and the blind following of fans will probably get him off with just probation, if that. And that's just the criminals... there's also plenty of homeless people that would much rather be Kobe Bryant. I doubt he would trade his situation for theirs. So yeah there's lots of people I'd rather not be.
Who says I was exaggerating? I'd rather have none of his wealth than sit in court and have my name and reputation ruined. In any case, this is the reality of things, he is involved whether he likes it or not.

appleseed
10-10-2003, 01:15 PM
Originally posted by DarkFury

Actually, it started with "going into 'chambermaids'" :eek:



:naughty:

aaaahahahahahahahahahahaha i stand corrected:heh:

kei2
10-10-2003, 02:06 PM
Originally posted by Jihforce
Who says I was exaggerating? I'd rather have none of his wealth than sit in court and have my name and reputation ruined. In any case, this is the reality of things, he is involved whether he likes it or not.
What I mean is you can have your cake and eat it too. You could have none of his wealth AND sit in court and have your name and reputation ruined. There are lots of criminals in that situation. And while you can argue that they don't have a name and reputation to begin with, that doesn't make it any better or easier to deal with.

bachviet
10-10-2003, 03:31 PM
He's better be ready to be attacked from behind. ;)

appleseed
10-11-2003, 10:43 AM
semen from two different men found in the accusers panties. doh!

the prosecution has already made some tactical errors. charges dropped or acquittal? discuss.

edit: sorry, here's the linky (http://www.nydailynews.com/front/story/125779p-112756c.html).

Ladogaboy
10-11-2003, 10:35 PM
Well, if that's legitimate, Kobe is more than likely off the hook. He'll still have to live the consequences of cheating on his wife--he's in a more or less lose-lose situation there--, but at least he'll still have a life.

Then, however, there is the posibility that the girl staged the whole thing, and in that case, she could be looking at some serious trouble herself.

Skeptical
10-12-2003, 01:06 AM
With all this evidence coming out to the Media. I wonder what Wednesdays hearing is going to be like...

cheapchinese
10-12-2003, 04:47 AM
before bursting into tears as the five-minute attack went on.
---------------------------------------------------------------------damn.. kobe.... 5 mins only
:sigh: where's the stamina boy?

i don't know if i dreamt about this or not... but wasn't there a killer after the girl? or did i thought it up?

Ladogaboy
10-12-2003, 08:30 AM
Originally posted by cheapchinese
i don't know if i dreamt about this or not... but wasn't there a killer after the girl? or did i thought it up?

You mean the Swedish(???) national that was taken into custody?

appleseed
10-14-2003, 11:39 AM
Originally posted by Ladogaboy


You mean the Swedish(???) national that was taken into custody?

i dunno why "swedish national" sounds so funny to me...i guess it's just so outlandish sounding.

"There are only two things I hate; those who are intolerant of other people's cultures.... .and the Dutch" (eh, not the same thing, sue me)

i was trying to ignore the whole circus but now i want to see what happens wednesday...gonna get nastaaaaaay :naughty: OJ, here we come

kei2
10-14-2003, 11:51 AM
Originally posted by appleseed
i was trying to ignore the whole circus but now i want to see what happens wednesday...gonna get nastaaaaaay :naughty: OJ, here we come Kobe's going to murder his wife and her friend and then get away with it? It could happen. "And then [s]he ran into my knife, [s]he ran into my knife TEN TIMES!"

Showtime
10-14-2003, 01:53 PM
Kobe is gonna be celebrating another championship at the end of the season. Character assassination? WTF is she doing by yelling rape. She's mad cuz he got his and sent her on her way like the trick she is. 2 different mens sperm in the same set of panties? Please explaine. Suicidal and star struck? :hmm:
He cheated but that isn't a crime. He should of hugged her after and said they'd hook up later and than she wouldn't have flipped the script.
It's easy to judge but I doubt any of you have had it thrown at you like he has. No bruising... just other mens junk in her... Figure it our geniuses.

-jel:halo:

appleseed
10-14-2003, 03:22 PM
i predict charges dropped before trial

Estee
10-14-2003, 04:20 PM
Something better happen in Kobe's favor, or he's going to have a rough run throughout the rest of his career..

eSDee
10-14-2003, 08:43 PM
Originally posted by the jello is jigglin
Kobe is gonna be celebrating another championship at the end of the season. Character assassination? WTF is she doing by yelling rape. She's mad cuz he got his and sent her on her way like the trick she is. 2 different mens sperm in the same set of panties? Please explaine. Suicidal and star struck? :hmm:
He cheated but that isn't a crime. He should of hugged her after and said they'd hook up later and than she wouldn't have flipped the script.
It's easy to judge but I doubt any of you have had it thrown at you like he has. No bruising... just other mens junk in her... Figure it our geniuses.

-jel:halo:

Jel, most of the time in these forums you have a pretty insightful and intelligent opinion but whenever it comes to the Lakers and/or Kobe you seem to drop your standards. I understand you are a big fan but I don't think this technique is doing much good getting your point across. One thing that I think that is faulty about your latest argument is what does it matter if she had sex with someone the day before? I guarantee you that a lot of women who have been raped have had normal sex lives before the rape occured. If there is only one other semen specimen then there is no way you can assume she is terribly promiscous.

I am not saying that I believe Kobe raped her or that she is lying for publicity. I am just saying that a lot of peoples arguments are moving dangerously close to "she was just asking for it", which doesn't fly in my book. Those who believe that some rape victims "ask" for it should in my opinion be castrated and then have all the organs donated to science(except the brain of course).

appleseed
10-14-2003, 09:30 PM
Originally posted by eSDeeLoco


...One thing that I think that is faulty about your latest argument is what does it matter if she had sex with someone the day before? I guarantee you that a lot of women who have been raped have had normal sex lives before the rape occured. If there is only one other semen specimen then there is no way you can assume she is terribly promiscous...



agreed, but i think the argument the defense is trying to make is "how do we know that the 'vaginal trauma' indicated in the pictures (that the idiot prosecutor decided to show, and have a detective who is not a doctor describe) was not caused by the other person(s) she *allegedly* had sex with?"

wow that was a long sentence. sorry :P

they're attacking it from a physical evidence perspective as i understand it, not a promiscuity thing which the rape shield would prohibit. if they can prove that physical evidence was potentially caused elsewhere, ie possibly someone else caused the alleged "injuries," the rape shield will not apply.

i'm no lawyer, but this is the way i understand it. thank you, i'm here all week. imma pass out from all this typing now. :dead:

DaFunkyUnit
10-14-2003, 10:00 PM
vaginal trauma?

sheeeit, i'll give you vaginal trauma!

:P

Showtime
10-15-2003, 12:00 PM
http://www.cnn.com/2003/LAW/10/15/bryant.hearing/index.html

"Last week, Eagle County Sheriff's Department Detective Doug Winters testified that blood from the alleged victim was found on the defendant's T-shirt. Winters said the woman told him that she and Bryant flirted when they first met and engaged in mutual kissing later, but that he wouldn't stop when she tried to refuse to his attempts to go further.

Winters said the woman reported that she was scared, and that Bryant grabbed her with both hands around her neck. He then forced her over a chair and, despite her protests, raped her, the detective said the woman told authorities, and then told her repeatedly not to tell anyone about it.

But under cross-examination by Mackey, Winters said there were no red marks, bruises, scratches or finger marks on the woman's neck."

-jel:halo:

appleseed
10-15-2003, 02:04 PM
Winters said the woman told him she had consensual sex with another man on June 27 or June 28 and used a condom, backing earlier defense suggestions she was sexually active before her encounter with Bryant.

Winters also said two pairs of panties from the woman were tested — one from the night of June 30, the other being the one she wore to a hospital for an exam the next day.

The latter pair contained blood and semen, Winters said.

"The accuser arrived at the hospital wearing panties with someone else's semen and sperm in them, not that of Mr. Bryant, correct?" Mackey asked.

"That's correct," Winters responded.

Mackey suggested injuries found during the woman's exam could have come from having repeated sex, a contention she first made in court last week.

full article here (http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=514&e=3&u=/ap/20031015/ap_on_sp_ba_ne/bkn_bryant_case_23). So the prosecution mentions there's blood on the underwear, but it's not the underwear from the night in question, and the semen is from another man? weak. this prosecutor is in over his head. like kobe was :eek:. heh.

Jihforce
10-15-2003, 03:47 PM
Ah, so the "truths" are starting to come out...interesting.

cheapie
10-15-2003, 08:23 PM
the worst thing about this stuff coming out is that we're going to have to listen to jell if he's innocent. sigh....

bachviet
10-15-2003, 09:11 PM
Originally posted by cheapie
the worst thing about this stuff coming out is that we're going to have to listen to jell if he's innocent. sigh....
:stupid:

appleseed
10-17-2003, 12:21 PM
i was gonna start a poll, but better just to ask in this thread:

do u think the case will be bound over for trial on monday (i do), and do you think the prosecution can win after the events of this week?

i think the judge sent the prosecution a message by allowing mackey to continue her line of questioning. i don't think the DA can win.

kei2
10-17-2003, 02:25 PM
Originally posted by cheapie
the worst thing about this stuff coming out is that we're going to have to listen to jell if he's innocent. sigh.... Not exactly. The worst thing about this stuff coming out is that we're going to have to listen to jell if he's FOUND innocent.

Kevster
10-17-2003, 03:43 PM
Get your commemorative t-shirt from tshirthell:

http://home1.gte.net/res0uku8/Kobe%20Beef.gif

appleseed
10-20-2003, 03:19 PM
going to trial (http://www.msnbc.com/news/982332.asp?0cv=CA01)

Jihforce
10-20-2003, 03:27 PM
Originally posted by Kevster
Get your commemorative t-shirt from tshirthell:

http://home1.gte.net/res0uku8/Kobe%20Beef.gif
Hahaha. This is so bizarre, its funny.

appleseed
10-30-2003, 02:08 PM
October 30, 2003 -- A supermarket tabloid is outing the 19-year-old woman who has accused NBA superstar Kobe Bryant of rape, splashing her name and a provocative photo on its front page - and sparking outrage from rape victims and advocates.

The blonde is shown hiking up a skirt to show her leg and garter at her 2002 high-school prom in the photo obtained by the Globe - whose titular overseer is Big Apple publishing phenom Bonnie Fuller.linky (http://www.nypost.com/news/nationalnews/9519.htm) to full story

Showtime
10-30-2003, 02:17 PM
That was very wrong.

-jel

ray
10-30-2003, 03:03 PM
I think they are going to make a big mistake if they do release the name and photos. The judge would probably close the trial to the public and then issue a warning to everybody that if you get 1 strike violating his rules or Colorado's strict laws regarding rape cases, he'll put you in jail. The judge is notorious for being very by-the-book and strict.