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View Full Version : morals, deals, ripoffs



att
07-21-2000, 03:07 PM
since the topic of morals came up in another forum, i thought i'd swing it over here for it's own discussion. we all have judged each other by our posts, so lets post some of our feelings on here and see what happens. maybe we'll find we're all pretty much alike. so, i dont feel bad at all about ripping off some big company, what about you guys? it's all about getting what you can out there, and if you dont, you're not gonna be successful. if you think that you arent being ripped off when the gap has children in ethiopia knit shirts, and then turn around and sell them to you for a 200% profit, then you are kidding yourself.

pennypinch
07-21-2000, 03:30 PM
I'm of the mindset that doing business is not unlike war. You try and be agressive, but not to the point of leaving yourself open. In that light, no, I have no problem holding a company responsible for its own actions. I really don't. If a company is expecting its competitors and its customers to be playing fair, they deserve to be taught a lesson until they DO learn. We, they, whoever, is in business for one reason: to make money. That conversely involves not LOSING money, if you catch my drift.
I am certainly not condonig stealing, which our activities have often been characterized as. I find that analogy simply ludicrious. We are simply consumers that are self-interested but play be baseline ethics (i.e., no stealing or fraud). The self-interested consumer will do whatever he can to amass as many and as much goods as he can for the least amount of money. A seller must be aware of that, or risk the consequences. Sorry for the convoluted economics lesson.

Grizybaer
07-23-2000, 11:11 PM
Deals are deals, if a company runs a promotion and too many ppl jump on it well, thats their fault. They put these deals out, they print these free tee shirts, mag lights and other stuff that we like. They're putting it out there for us to take.

tupacboy
07-24-2000, 02:28 AM
get it while u can....

pennypinch
07-25-2000, 12:05 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by AJ:
even my Yahoo SVX! Club<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

you have got to be joking me... http://www.gotapex.com/ubb/rolleyes.gif http://www.gotapex.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

CluelessSi
07-25-2000, 12:11 AM
hehe i hope he doesn't spam my car club http://www.gotapex.com/ubb/tongue.gif
I have not seen him around there yet

[This message has been edited by CluelessSi (edited 07-25-2000).]

AJ
07-25-2000, 12:22 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by pennypinch:
you have got to be joking me... http://www.gotapex.com/ubb/rolleyes.gif http://www.gotapex.com/ubb/biggrin.gif<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

its actually among the top couple dar clubs on Yahoo (1230 members isn't anything to snicker at- yeah you)...we owners stick together...
http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/subarusvx


[This message has been edited by AJ (edited 07-25-2000).]

pennypinch
07-25-2000, 12:42 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by AJ:
we owners stick together...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Unlike your Seranwrap cars... http://www.gotapex.com/ubb/biggrin.gif http://www.gotapex.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

CluelessSi
07-25-2000, 12:47 AM
1230 members not bad...
hehe but Club Si -which once was part of yahoo but moved out to becomme bigger and better- has 7766 members http://www.gotapex.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

AJ
07-25-2000, 12:59 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by CluelessSi:
1230 members not bad...
hehe but Club Si -which once was part of yahoo but moved out to becomme bigger and better- has 7766 members http://www.gotapex.com/ubb/biggrin.gif<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

considering there are only between 5 and 10 thousand SVX's in America, its a good number. cant compete with Honda though..

renots
07-25-2000, 02:05 AM
From: http://www.sightings.com/general2/gods.htm

The Golden Road to Unlimited Totalitarianism - Part 6

Planet of the Golden Calf

By Diane Harvey <[email protected]>
7-23-00

...
Greed was once an obvious and, on the whole, socially unacceptable disease. There was little difficulty distinguishing between normal human desires for civilized comfort, and the pathological out-of-control desire nature of the relatively few.

In the last few decades however, the infection of greed has managed to stealthily mutate into a virulent and deadly new form.

Greed (http://omega.cc.umb.edu/~salzman/NotesOnGreed/index.html) has developed a protective coating which reflects a sheen of normal respectability, and is no longer even recognizable. A lifestyle based on Getting-and-Having is now enthusiastically embraced as a particularly All-American virtue.

Greediness is not merely psychologically fashionable now: it is well established in the American psyche as the summum bonum of our special rights. The original spiritual promise inherent in the phrase "Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness" has been dragged down into the uttermost basement of meaning.

The new version of our basic "rights" consists of the dictionary definition of pure greed: "Excessive desire for acquiring or having". We don't believe in any such thing as "excess" now. And the result of this is a nation suffering from a fatal illness, but which does not, on the whole, even comprehend it is sick.

The occasional lip-service given to deploring our raging materialism is a useless noise drowned out by the yowl of advertising. Seen from space, Earth's once lovely face is stamped with the corporate logo of the Ferengi.

As the current version of the Roman Empire, just short of the inevitable disastrous collapse, we export the florid excrescences of our decaying culture to an eagerly awaiting world. At the present rate, consumerism will shortly be a global plague in the human species.

The consequences of this rampant disease on a planetary scale are evident. Too numerous to be supported by rapidly diminishing resources, greedy humanity becomes a kind of flesh-eating bacteria on the surface of the planet. One can only wonder if subconsciously our civilization registers its coming inevitable disintegration, and chooses to dine on as many hummingbird tongues as possible before the end.

Destined sooner or later to meet the results of its actions, the United States of America perhaps tries to escape its logical conclusion through fevered immersion in ever-more idiotic and demeaning distractions.

Such a level of alarm is no exaggeration. A wholesale metamorphosis from homo sapiens into homo consumerus will be fatal. The reasons for this are numerous and readily understood by all those as yet uninfected.

Greed is not a sort of evolutionarily harmless childhood disease, merely appearing on a larger scale. If it spreads to the extent of taking over the entire psyche of a nation, it will kill the host. We see from the historical evidence that a small percentage of greedy people cannot harm a country whose numerous healthy cells, average sane citizens, function as a powerful immunological protection.

But if an entire people succumb to irrational levels of desire for getting-and-having, then the cancer will spread until the body dies

...

One of the oldest prophecies on earth refers to our moment in time, here and now. It comes from the Vishnu Purana, written no-one-knows how many thousands and thousands of years ago. In it the writer is describing what he forsees at the end of the age known as Kali Yuga: the Age of Iron.

Ancient eastern wisdom describes unimaginably (to us) vast cycles of time, called "ages", which succeeed one another in descending into materialism and loss of spirituality. The cycle begins with a Golden Age, when human beings are bright with spiritual awareness and promise.

It ends, several million years later, in the depths of decay. The following prophecy certainly sounds familiar:

"There will be be contemporary monarchs, reigning over the earth: kings of churlish spirit, violent temper, and ever addicted to falsehood and wickedness. They will inflict death on women and children, they will seize upon the property of their subjects, and be intent upon the wives of others; they will be of unlimited power, their lives will be short, their desires insatiable....

People of various countries intermingling with them will follow their example. Piety will decrease until the whole world will be wholly depraved. Property alone will confer rank; wealth will be the only source of devotion; passion will be the sole bond of union between the sexes; falsehood will be the only means of success in litigation; and women will be objects merely of sensual gratification....

External types will be the only distinction of the several orders of life;...a man if rich will be reputed to be pure; dishonesty will be the universal means of subsistence, weakness the cause of dependence, menace and presumption will be substituted for learning; liberality will be devotion; mutual assent, marrriage; fine clothes, dignity. He who is strongest will reign; the people, unable to bear the heavy burden of taxes, will take refuge among the valleys...

Thus, in the Kali Age will decay constantly proceed, until the human race approaches its annihilation."

At which point, according to these ancient scriptures, a great descent of divine power takes place again, and the seeds of the new cycle, the beginning of the next Golden Age, are sown.

Since all forms of life are cyclic, perhaps this ancient prophecy merely describes a kind of inevitable end to our civilization.

Yet always the choice remains: free will exists, and no human being is obliged (yet) to cooperate in spiritual self-destruction.

Furthermore, even when a civilization flowers and then falls to the ground and decomposes, one may choose to become a seed of the future culture. This is strictly a matter of individual desire.

We can go with the flow, down the drain, or fight the uphill battle to claim our souls and the life of the heart and mind. There is a great war unfolding within us and all around us, and we are all participants, whether we have the courage to admit it or not.

This simple choice is the hardest we will ever make: to recognize the virus of selfish materialistic consumption for what it is, and to reject it.

Despite the pressing dark force of increasing greediness, we still have the power to insist on expressing our individual gifts and talents. The price of this is high: it often means a life of struggle. But at this point only darkness and the status quo offer the certainty of cheap mindless comfort.

Light, love and creative intelligence only offer themselves, and the eternal promise of being unfolded into an ever-greater livingness. Every moment of our lives we are desiring, we are choosing to attach ourselves to the downgoing darkness of materialism or to the upwelling light of the soul.

And when death comes, the sum of all our desires and subsequent choices will determine our next destination. There is no religion or spiritual path which does not teach this, for reasons which ought to be quite clear to us all. It is the truth.


[This message has been edited by renots (edited 08-06-2000).]

CluelessSi
07-25-2000, 05:49 AM
hehe can always count on renot to post an articale about anything http://www.gotapex.com/ubb/smile.gif

att
07-25-2000, 10:28 AM
i dont know if i agree with that post, but good looking out, that was interesting. i give a lot of the free stuff i find away to friends and family, so does that make me more morally acceptable despite my capitalistic perversions? it's not an issue of greed, its an issue of using what is available to you to make life better. is that not what being human is about? live as well as you can, and die with no regrets.

AJ
07-25-2000, 11:46 AM
man i dont know whats up with renots. this site he quotes from, sightings, looks like crap, not exactly MSNBC...

dont mean to sound harsh but theres a guy going under a bunch of different aliases pounding random message boards with totally unsubstantiated conspiracy crap, and getting kicked off at many (even my Yahoo SVX! Club). this was one of his sources. so i'm a little sensitive to this right now...i apoligize in advance if its not you

[This message has been edited by AJ (edited 07-25-2000).]

renots
07-25-2000, 02:32 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by AJ:
...i apoligize in advance if its not you
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not me, but no need to apologize

:0)


[This message has been edited by renots (edited 07-25-2000).]

renots
07-25-2000, 02:45 PM
I don't necessarily wholeheartedly believe every posting I quote; you know open minded skeptism vs true believerism. It just nice to see some ideas that aren't filtered through the corporate media get considered and discussed.

Sightings.com can be pretty conspiratorial at times, but there is also enough stuff there that doesn't get mentioned in the corporate press to get the brain juices flowing.

When you consider how consolidated alot of the major sites are getting(Ziff-davis being bought out by cnet, etc.), its nice to see there are still sites out there on the fringe that aren't afraid to present views that are not necessarily mainstream.

We certainly don't see msnbc railing on the dangers of greed, now do we?

:0)

renots
07-25-2000, 02:48 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by att:
i give a lot of the free stuff i find away to friends and family, so does that make me more morally acceptable despite my capitalistic perversions? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Giving and sharing is what makes us human. As long as we don't start treating other humans like faceless corporations, we're doing alright.

:0)



[This message has been edited by renots (edited 07-26-2000).]