Free open discussion thingy about stuff!

[carpenoctem]

Hey everyone, I just figured I would post to see what kind of crazy thoughts people have had lately. The other day I was looking at a hill and thought "you know, if you took a 30' by 30' section of that hill and counted every grain of sand, you might come up with a prime number of grains, so that if you put all the grains into piles, you would always have unequal piles." Umm...right...so, anyone else smoking crack lately?

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And furthermore, I believe that Carthage should be destroyed.

[StonedWheat]

Ok I was wondering the other day about what blind people see when they dream. And how do they use computers?

[revil]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by StonedWheat:
Ok I was wondering the other day about what blind people see when they dream. And how do they use computers? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

they use braille computer screens...
those are especially nice on those naughty websites...

[pennypinch]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by StonedWheat:
Ok I was wondering the other day about what blind people see when they dream. And how do they use computers? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I also have lots of questions about blindness and sight. I mean, is being blind just black, or white, or is it a total void of anything? Also, colour is a really interesting topic for both blind and "seeing" people. I mean, the obvious one is, "Is blue for me the same as blue for you?", but I wonder how, if they can, blind people understand or reconcile colour. When we talk about "red" things, what do blind people think of?
And I wonder what the perfect woman would look like drawn by a blind person...

[spigidygak]

uh. . . http://www.chat.ru/~dkutsanov/u.gif

[target]

i was thinking just the other night. while i was out driving,listening to the radio aboot different 900 psychic lines thought to myself, 'self, there could really be some money had if someone were to create a psychic sex phone service.' i mean, really, think aboot it, you could corner two of the major phone markets...

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strength and honor

[CluelessSi]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by carpenoctem:
Hey everyone, I just figured I would post to see what kind of crazy thoughts people have had lately. The other day I was looking at a hill and thought "you know, if you took a 30' by 30' section of that hill and counted every grain of sand, you might come up with a prime number of grains, so that if you put all the grains into piles, you would always have unequal piles." Umm...right...so, anyone else smoking crack lately?

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

is it 30' by 30' ony grain layer i suppose....
cause u not getting any sand if you only have two dimensions. need 3 http://www.gotapex.com/ubb/biggrin.gif
So u mean 30' by 30' by one grain of sand http://www.gotapex.com/ubb/biggrin.gif


[This message has been edited by CluelessSi (edited 08-03-2000).]

[carpenoctem]

Well, its a hill, so I take a 30' by 30' at sea level, and everything up from that goes with it...sorry for the confusion...

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And furthermore, I believe that Carthage should be destroyed.

[att]

how would you know if the piles were uneven, some particles would roll of and thus become their own pile. then you would have even and uneven piles and no way to tell which is which unless you counted every grain of sand.

[carpenoctem]

That is an interesting thought...I wonder what blind people do see when they dream...but, as far as computers go, I think blind people probably have bigger problems then worrying about their email. Anyone know a blind person we could ask about the dream thing though?

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And furthermore, I believe that Carthage should be destroyed.

[MaggieOK]

How would you describe sight to a blind person or sound to a deaf person?

[att]

sound would be hard, but color you could describe in feeling. hot is red, cold is blue, i dont know how you would describe fuscia though. any suggestions?

[The Rock]

Like MaggieOK said, it would be hard to explain sight to a blind person. You could flip that around. How would a blind person who was blind all their lives explain what they see. How would they even know what black or white is.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by carpenoctem:
That is an interesting thought...I wonder what blind people do see when they dream...but, as far as computers go, I think blind people probably have bigger problems then worrying about their email. Anyone know a blind person we could ask about the dream thing though?

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

[AJ]

how can you compare- between 2 different people- if we see colors the same way?

[StonedWheat]

ok heres another one I was wondering about (I still wanna know about the blind dream thing). How come hair stops growing at a certain length? Maybe not head hair, but definitely eyebrows and body hair. I mean, pubic hair dosen't grow to be like a foot long. That would be tacky. But if you shave your eyebrows it eventually grows back to the same length. It's as if the hair has memory or something to grow back to that length. The strangest thing about this is that hair is comprised of dead cells. I could kind of understand like a lizards tail growing back to the same length but not human hair. When I let my facial hair grow out, it won't go out beyond a certain length. If I trim it even a little bit it will grow out to that same length. Wierd! Any hair follicle experts out there?

[att]

b.s. someone mentioned that not being able read in dreams to me before, that's not true, well not for everyone. i have had tons of dreams where i have been able to read signs and stuff. i think some people just have limited imaginations. as far as blind people, we'v all had dreams that seem real because you feel them as well as see them(ie wet dreams) so i would imagine that blind people dream with physical feeling, they may even smell in their dreams because their other senses have become so strong.

[pennypinch]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by AJ:
how can you compare- between 2 different people- if we see colors the same way?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I assume you mean how do you compare between two people if they don't see colours the same way.
Well, what if there is some abstract metric of color. What if what I think is red is actually your blue, but you know it to be red. Likewise, your red is what I call blue. Thus objects are one color, but what if we perceive them to be different things. Like the above example: hot. Well, say you see your red. What if I'm thinking (from your perspective) "wow, that thing is really blue hot!" That's what I mean.

[StonedWheat]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by AJ:
how can you compare- between 2 different people- if we see colors the same way?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well they have tests for color-blindness. Also, I remember doing an objective color test in an optometry office where I had to place about 10 colors in the correct order, starting from black to white. I think people might see slightly different shades of colors than another person, but not a completely different color. Doctors have figured out that dogs see in only black and white, so they would've probably found out if one person saw blue instead of red or red instead of blue. My reasoning is that if they can "see" through the eyes of a dog, doctors can "see" through the eyes of another human too.

[CluelessSi]

for the record - EVERYTHING IS RELATIVE http://www.gotapex.com/ubb/biggrin.gif -
back to the questions. The mind perceives the colors and interprets them just like a computer interepts code. differences in number of cones and rods will result in different shades and blending of color. some sickness affects the number of cones and rods thus distoring vision.

Here is a little experament. just try to concentrate on your peripheral vision and since there is not that many cones in that area of your eye, you will notice a definity blending of colors (objects) There are classic optical illusions to prove that the way we see things are based on mind interpretation. like the illusion with black bars that make a grid but at the contact point there is empty space but your mind will fill those with grey dots when seen in periphial since they have to accomodate and fill in holes due to lack of receptors. Very much the same way JPGs are complied by the computer.

[This message has been edited by CluelessSi (edited 08-04-2000).]

[CluelessSi]

Ahhh the question of what blind ppl see in dreams... well i think it totally depends on what raw data they have in them. if they were blind after a certain age then they have some visuary raw data that can form vivid visual dreams but if they are born blind then they will dream with feeling Very much the same as they are awake. Basically dreams are controled by a portion of the brian and it mimics daily life so a blind person can imagine things but might not get them acurrate but will be able to dream audio aounds and possiably random colors. Also to note i have herad that you can not read in dreams because that uses a difff. part of brian. here are places some of you might want to visit.
http://earthsky.com/1999/es990607.html

http://www.dreamgate.com/dream/articles_rcw/ed2-1bli.htm

[CluelessSi]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by att:
b.s. someone mentioned that not being able read in dreams to me before, that's not true, well not for everyone. i have had tons of dreams where i have been able to read signs and stuff. i think some people just have limited imaginations. as far as blind people, we'v all had dreams that seem real because you feel them as well as see them(ie wet dreams) so i would imagine that blind people dream with physical feeling, they may even smell in their dreams because their other senses have become so strong.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
yea i have doubted that reading thing too but I have not throughly research that so not sure. as for the last statements u can visit the above websites for more info

[AJ]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by pennypinch:

I assume you mean how do you compare between two people if they don't see colours the same way.
Well, what if there is some abstract metric of color. What if what I think is red is actually your blue, but you know it to be red. Likewise, your red is what I call blue. Thus objects are one color, but what if we perceive them to be different things. Like the above example: hot. Well, say you see your red. What if I'm thinking (from your perspective) "wow, that thing is really blue hot!" That's what I mean.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


no thats a difference in linguistics....we would both know "red" is the color of heat....even if you saw red as what we all know is blue, you would ALWAYS think that red was the color of blue. You would still SAY red hot, even though it looked "blue" to you...because red would =blue. That came out funny. did you get that?