AIComputers - 50% Off Coupon. Our AI Rep's ICQ#256399925

[20solara02]

i was just wondering if people are still getting the error

"Error Occurred While Processing Request
Error Diagnostic Information
.....
....
"
when they try and view their order.

thanks,
michael

[rohackle]

what is this? suck up time?
Lots of people ordered.. 3000+ folks did.
This guy makes money off of all the deals he posts.. even a 1/2 penny adds up. I feel bad for him but we gotta rant to someone! not like AI is answering back on anything!
if we get burned, most people (not me) are going to take it all out on this APEX dude. I for one might lose some money.. not that bad.. ill take it up with my credit card comp, but the pride and trust my friends and family and co-workers had in me when i gave them this deal will be severely affected. I feel like the guy who got a virus in his email, opened it and then sent it to everyone in my mailbox. I told many people who told many other people, it all comes back to me.
That is what i will be angry about. All you people sucking up to this guy because you want to get that great rebate/coupon on a free mouse pad need to say it like it is. You are doing him a service lining his pockets and you are allowed to speak your mind on this mess.

this is the first time ive used apex to learn about deals..
thats all i have to go off of

[Apex]

About 1/2 way through the emails now. Hoping to have some good news on monday.

[bradpitt]

Hoping to have some good news on monday.
:stupid:

[DarkFury]

what is this? suck up time?
Lots of people ordered.. 3000+ folks did.
This guy makes money off of all the deals he posts.. even a 1/2 penny adds up. I feel bad for him but we gotta rant to someone! not like AI is answering back on anything!
if we get burned, most people (not me) are going to take it all out on this APEX dude. I for one might lose some money.. not that bad.. ill take it up with my credit card comp, but the pride and trust my friends and family and co-workers had in me when i gave them this deal will be severely affected. I feel like the guy who got a virus in his email, opened it and then sent it to everyone in my mailbox. I told many people who told many other people, it all comes back to me.
That is what i will be angry about. All you people sucking up to this guy because you want to get that great rebate/coupon on a free mouse pad need to say it like it is. You are doing him a service lining his pockets and you are allowed to speak your mind on this mess.

this is the first time ive used apex to learn about deals..
thats all i have to go off of
All the more reason to hang around G|A after the results of this particular deal is concluded...

Gabe/Apex is a "class act"... Those of us who are "regulars" here will vehemently vouch for that.

I can understand how this situation looks to a "new" person... however that is not how it usually is around here. Gabe's/Apex's word is bond... however that can only go as far as to what he can actually control.

We don't "suck up" to Apex because we want something from him... we support him because he is a good person and our FRIEND and HOST. Please know the difference before you judge. As a matter of fact, I questioned him about even posting this deal... however he felt that the company AI wouldn't let him or you down... but unfortunately so far, that hasn't been the case.

But guess what... that company has let down a bunch of folks before it even came to G|A... believe not? Then go pick up a copy of the current Maximum PC and read the Watchdog section. Either way... I can only fault Gabe for taking "past performance" of a company to assume that they wouldn't do anything "suspicious" in the present/future. However at least he is MAN enough to back it up (if need be... however I truly hope it doesn't come to that.)

Either way... I understand folk's anger here, but as far as making money on the referral links...well how many of you have a "paid membership" to be here?

/me looks around... sees no hands raising...

Yeah... the bills for a site this large has to be paid somehow and guess what? Deal referral links and advertising pays for all of this. So back off the man for RUNNING A BUSINESS and being gracious enough to provide a forum for everyone to discuss their ideas, opinions and deal finds to share freely with everyone.

/me backs away from the soapbox... Thanks.

[dizzytrain]

Call your card ompany and be foreceful, I am now certain i will be refunded, i pointed out how long i have been a perfect customer, and that other cc companys are refunding people because of this phony deal, they said after i fill out the forms (i will get them in seven days) they will refund my card and begin a full investigation into that companys business practices. Again be clear and point out that other card companys have refunded. they seem to want to compete for your future business. Anyhow Apex once you get my e-mail and send it to them can you let me know that you did so. this way i wont have to resend to you, again ,
Apex thanks for trying
And AI i hope you credit my card back in the next seven days so that you wont have to face their "full investigation" they seemed very interested in the fact that their were over 1000 original orders. i think that number raises some sort of red flag.
Ai just refund the orders and you should be fine, if not your gonna be in for a really big headache, i doubt it will be worth your trouble. (everyone who needs forms should call and demand that they be sett out early) this way you will have them incase they dont recredit your card (assuming you have requested that). And point out to your Cc company that there were over 1000 initial orders placed for this deal.
Best of luck

[Dave_7]

what is this? suck up time?
Lots of people ordered.. 3000+ folks did.
This guy makes money off of all the deals he posts.. even a 1/2 penny adds up. I feel bad for him but we gotta rant to someone! not like AI is answering back on anything!
if we get burned, most people (not me) are going to take it all out on this APEX dude. I for one might lose some money.. not that bad.. ill take it up with my credit card comp, but the pride and trust my friends and family and co-workers had in me when i gave them this deal will be severely affected. I feel like the guy who got a virus in his email, opened it and then sent it to everyone in my mailbox. I told many people who told many other people, it all comes back to me.
That is what i will be angry about. All you people sucking up to this guy because you want to get that great rebate/coupon on a free mouse pad need to say it like it is. You are doing him a service lining his pockets and you are allowed to speak your mind on this mess.

this is the first time ive used apex to learn about deals..
thats all i have to go off of

Yeah, thanks for your insight... Mr. 2 posts ever.

The longtime residents here have faith for a reason.



Dave.

[Apex]

Anyhow Apex once you get my e-mail and send it to them can you let me know that you did so. this way i wont have to resend to you, again ,

Have already gotten 5 so far from you thus far (let me know if you've sent more than that). Have already forwarded yours (the first one).



8:39pm Pacific, Friday night:
Another update for everyone. Have finished forwarding the cancellation emails, working on some of the more involved questions, etc.

[dizzytrain]

thank you, sorry if i sent so many
again thanks,
It sucks weve had to bother you so much, but i want you to know we appreciate it
:cheers:

[Apex]

thank you, sorry if i sent so many
again thanks,
It sucks weve had to bother you so much, but i want you to know we appreciate it
:cheers:

No worries, my organizational skills are improving. ;)

For those of you who have not cancelled, I'd suggest considering waiting until monday (especially since not much happens on the weekend anyway).

[dizzytrain]

Before i thought i was just getting a headsup on really good deals when i came to this site,
I have discovered that i am getting much more,
this deal going sour will not stop me from using this site, infact With this forum as back up and apex in charge,
I think its fair to say that if you are gonna do something online that might expose you to risk as far as purchases are concerned, then you should do it here, where you can organize if need be, and have a guy you can trust in charge of things. Apex if i can buy something through your links i will, thanks for the board, i cant imagine how angry i would have been without a place to fume.

[tourbound]

Apex,

Any word on getting my refund sooner than the imposed date of May 21st? I sent you an email a couple days ago, so just curious.

[Underclocked]

Yes, I'm paranoid.

But I just sent a second email to my CC company asking they not only monitor the account I used for AI closely, but for them to cancel that account and re-issue using new numbers.

There is NO doubt in my mind about the people involved with AI.

[redcolours]

what is this? suck up time?
Lots of people ordered.. 3000+ folks did.
This guy makes money off of all the deals he posts.. even a 1/2 penny adds up. I feel bad for him but we gotta rant to someone! not like AI is answering back on anything!
if we get burned, most people (not me) are going to take it all out on this APEX dude. I for one might lose some money.. not that bad.. ill take it up with my credit card comp, but the pride and trust my friends and family and co-workers had in me when i gave them this deal will be severely affected. I feel like the guy who got a virus in his email, opened it and then sent it to everyone in my mailbox. I told many people who told many other people, it all comes back to me.
That is what i will be angry about. All you people sucking up to this guy because you want to get that great rebate/coupon on a free mouse pad need to say it like it is. You are doing him a service lining his pockets and you are allowed to speak your mind on this mess.

this is the first time ive used apex to learn about deals..
thats all i have to go off of
i dont want to post in this thread, as i didnt order anything, but i just want to say that you, mr rohackle, are a low-brow bloodsucker ferengi. if you dont know that, good! cuz i guess ignorance is bliss. and judging by the way you know this site so well, you are just that - IGNORANT.

"this Apex dude" could have just DELETED ALL REFERENCES TO THIS fiasco, deals posted, and locked the threads, banned emails and members, and NOT HAVE ANSWERED any emails at all. If you know ANYTHING about dealsites and forums, most owners of other dealsites already would have done so, and would have hightailed out of here. Unfortunately youre ignorance can be an excuse, since you apparently do not know the history of THIS community and how the owners truly care about its members and readers, in contrast to the history of other forums (who actually have done some atrocious deals in the past).

by the way you expressed your frustration, you just revealed how selfish you really are. sure, you "shared the deal" with friends, coworkers and family, but all your little peabrain can think about is "me, me, me". how "it all comes back to me". how the "pride and trust my friends and family and co-workers had in me ... will be severely affected". BIG FKN DEAL! is that all you really think about? you, you and you? you think you will look bad to your family and friends and coworkers? you are so scared about your image being tarnished. HOW DO YOU THINK Gabe (the "apex dude") FEELS? do you have 3000 people frustrated and aiming for you? no of course not, but Gabe has. He doesnt even know them, yet he is FACING THEM by answering emails, and posting here. you think he likes being the target of frustrations? you think he is sitting pretty and kicking back? dont you see the damage control he's trying to do? you think he is making a lot of money out of this site? do you even know how much money he has to shell out each month for the bandwidth costs? this is one busy site, and yes, thru advertising and clicks and referals, he gets some money, but NOT enough to offset the cost of running this site. THERE IS MORE MONEY GOING OUT THAN GOING IN. but of course you dont know that because, oh wait, you are IGNORANT. my bad.

to you it feels like suck up time, cuz that is all you will ever see in situations like this. you dont see how Gabe is answering all 3000 emails. Can you go thru and answer 300 emails a day? You think having this mess and a newborn baby is easy to juggle? You dont even appreciate the effort, cuz all you can think about is your precious image, and how you feel you got burned. You think he can sleep easy the past few weeks/nights? Ultimately he is responsible, yes, and as he has demonstrated, he is ACTING responsible as well.
Do you always go out and immediately tell everyone you know what a "great find" you got, without checking into it first, and taking a grain of salt with it? Have you not heard of caveat emptor? buyer beware? doesnt it behoove you to first make sure you understand what you are going in for, and then MAYBE, tell everyone its safe? or do you just run off your mouth to everyone at the first drop of a hat? by the way you just ran off your mouth, i guess you do. Now if you do that, isnt that a bit IRRESPONSIBLE of YOU? You blame "this Apex dude", but you too are one to blame.
but i guess you just cant know that, cuz you, mr rohackle, are Ignorant.

oh yeah - this goes to all you crybabies who also act like mr rohackle here.

[dizzytrain]

Everything we know and could say about AI is based on our eperience, and their business practices thus far, with no legitimate means of communication all we can do is speculate, so here is where my thoughts are at right now, at the end of this week, with still no e-mails from them or phone contacts

What if ?
What if Ai computers is just a small two man operation that builds out of some basement in new york.
what if they got in way over their heads? thinking this would generate cash flow for their suffering business not realizing how very complex it would be to work out a scheme like that, starting from so low a position. What if they are now very confused and overwhelmed, unsure of what to do next. Being careful not to e-mail anything or do anything that would put their deception on the record. Carefully atempting not to communicate there answers directly through e-mails or even posting it on their site or on this board. hoping this might protect them from being accused of giving faulty answers to questions on the record, in the event of an investigation.
If this is the case Ai just explain yourself, refund the charges and i dont think we will be all that infuriated.

What if Ai does have employees that will be left holding the bags trying to explain what is and has been occuring, meanwhile the top guys are half way to some other country by now, after deceiving a whole lot of us
If this is the case we are not going to get our cards refunded (by them), even if we shout out endlessly

What if AI is as they present themselves on their site to be, a legitimate fully operating company professionally staffed building P.C's at an acceptable rate, intending to have all orders shipped in a timely fashion , priding themselves on customer service quality products and ethical business practices. Unfortunately, Suffering from a perfect storm of irregularities.
If this is the case our cards should be refunded by them no problem, and promptly

Now which scenerio seems to be the most likely?
How and when our cards are refunded is the test that will answer that question, i really hope they pass it

[stech4u]

maybe a suggestion to make things easier for gabe...

if your cancelling your orders, it might be more efficient to put "AI.CANCELLATION OF ORDER" or something that everyone agrees by, in the SUBJECT of the email... so he can just filter them out right away...

just my $0.02

[Burzhui]

All the more reason to hang around G|A after the results of this particular deal is concluded...

Gabe/Apex is a "class act"... Those of us who are "regulars" here will vehemently vouch for that.

I can understand how this situation looks to a "new" person... however that is not how it usually is around here. Gabe's/Apex's word is bond... however that can only go as far as to what he can actually control.

We don't "suck up" to Apex because we want somethign from him... we support him because he is a good person and our FRIEND and HOST. Please know the difference before you judge. As a matter of fact, I questioned him about even posting this deal... however he felt that the company AI wouldn't let him or you down... but unfortunately so far, that hasn't been the case.

But guess what... that company has let down a bunch of folks before it even came to G|A... believe not? Then go pick up a copy of the current Maximum PC and read the Watchdog section. Either way... I can only fault Gabe for taking "past performance" of a company to assume that they wouldn't do anything "suspicious" in the present/future. However at least he is MAN enough to back it up (if need be... however I truly hope it doesn't come to that.)

Either way... I understand folk's anger here, but as far as making money on the referral links...well how many of you have a "paid membership" to be here?

/me looks around... sees no hands raising...

Yeah... the bills for a site this large has to be paid somehow and guess what? Deal referral links and advertising pays for all of this. So back off the man for RUNNING A BUSINESS and being gracious enough to provide a forum for everyone to discuss their ideas, opinions and deal finds to share freely with everyone.

/me backs away from the soapbox... Thanks.


i'm with not so stupid up there. There is no need to suck up, we won't get anything special for saying nice things about him... but support him we will because he never steered us wrong before and because he is a man of his word.

[crackerbox]

I know this is my first post, but im a long time lurker.

with that out of the way, here we go...

First, i got my order in for the AMD 64 gamer pc in at a very low order number. Before they changed the way the order viewing worked, i was able to check how many people ahead of me had actually gotten in on the $200 + 50% off, and i was on of the first 30 orders, so if anyone should get their PC soon, it should be me and the other ~29 folks ahead of me.

about a week ago, i received my Stage 3 Email, 2 days later, my card was billed...

too bad i used my debit card

Second, I, like alot of you, got worried and did a little investigating (I dont like spending $500+ and not being sure if im going to get my purchase or not)
so i did the whois lookup and got their address. then i took that address, took off the "b" and did a reverse address lookup to see if i could get the phone number of their business neighbor. Believe it or not, it worked...
their neighbor was one Pioneer Corp. and it even listen a phone number.

so i called this guy up. A man with a middle eastern accent answered the phone with, "Pioneer Corp." I told him i was investigating a possible federal online fraud ring, and that his address came up in the process of the investigation. He said that he WAS aware of Aicomputers... he said that about a month ago, they packed up all their stuff, and left. He told me that as far as he knew the FBI was involved in the situation too. I asked if he could provide me with anymore information, "any names or addresses would be extreamly helpful," I told him. He said he didnt have anymore info, but i could probably find some stuff on google.

so... since i used my debit card, i guess i have no choice but to stick it out, luckily i ordered through Apex's link, and if i remember correctly, he said he would personally pay back anyone who got burnt on this one, thanks apex, you truely do "value your viewers"

[dizzytrain]

its not sucking up, im certain he has been hearing the worst since this mistake,
its only fair that he gets a reasonable amount of priase, since he has earned it for actuallly going through so many e-mails. that is a lot of work. People on here dont just complain,
thats why AI has made a serious mistake
if they showed that they were acting in good faith they really would have won a lot of people over,
if we thought sucking up would get things done do you think we would have been so skeptical in regards to AI and would have the nerve to post negative reactions to their treatment of us, for them to see.
most of us are not in need of special treatment.
my main concern right now is that anybody who used an atm card, receive preferential treatment from Apex in his handling of e-mails
It is important that he knows who used their check cards, perhaps when or if you e-mail him you should put in the subject box "ATM " i dont think any of us would mind if you got the lions share of Apex's time and ability to communicate with these guys. The folks who used their debit cards must be at the front of the line.

wow - crackerbox
good thinking, this info is really valuable
And will certainly come in handy

[DarkFury]

Debit cards and the Internet are a DANGEROUS combination...

I don't know how strongly I can stress that... It's just not worth the risk to EVER give out your Debit card number (secure site or not...)

Not preaching here... but honestly, I wish folks would take heart to that message.

[dizzytrain]

if this guy from pioneer is correct then MR Ai lied to me about still being at that address, in fact he seemed upset at me for suggesting that he was lying to Apex regarding their physical address.
The fog just keeps on lifting
If they are really as shadey a group as this new info suggests, i wonder how long it will take them to hit this board with phony messages, in fact im surprised they have not already done so. anyways going to TRY not to think about this much over the weekend
but who knows, i just keep drawing myself back into this board,

[crackerbox]

ok here is a little more detail on what i have already summarized:

the phone number listen on the bottom of AIcomputers.com is:
(631) 755-8000
the reverse lookup of that come out as:

System Developers
155 Marine St
Farmingdale, NY 11735-5609
(631) 755-8000

now if we look up that reverse address we get a different story:

Pioneer Industries Inc
155 Marine St
Farmingdale, NY 11735
(631) 777-6000
- this is a working number, and a real person answers, who claims they arent AIcomputers.

One more thing, on one of the previous pages in this particular thread, someone mentioned the return address they had gotten off of a package they had recieved from AIcomputers in the past month or so.

AI Services
775 Park Ave
Huntington, NY 11743

I reversed that address and was returned an error "too many results returned for your search"
odd i thought, because i provided a house number, street name, state and zip...
Then i got on the phone with someone at my cell phone company, she was nice enough to do a reverse lookup for me. Her computer returned her around 103 results. she sorted through them for any instance of "computers" or even any electronics related sounding store... she was able to give me the numbers of 3 of the results that had the most promising results (although none of them sounded like aipc or artificial int. or AIComputers) i tried all three with no luck.


so there you go.

I've always wanted to visit NY state, just never had a good enough reason :)
*UPDATE*
Using a higher Tier info lookup system i found a little more info:
775 park ave in huntinton, NY shows up as:
one Mr.
Tauraso Jr, Vincent J
775 Park Avenue 110-3
Huntington, NY 11743

-also-

Heidelberg, Harris I
775 Park Ave
Huntington, NY 11743-3976

this is right accross from Little Plains park on route 35.

disclaimer: The following is opinion only
from my experience Heidelberg sounds like a Jewish name, and i dont know too many of them pulling couldbe internet scams... although im not saying its not possible, I just think that "Tauraso" sounds more suspicious

[epii]

disclaimer: The following is opinion only
from my experience Heidelberg sounds like a Jewish name, and i dont know too many of them pulling couldbe internet scams... although im not saying its not possible, I just think that "Tauraso" sounds more suspicious

What a fantastically, pointlessly bigoted addition. I'm I-talian, and i take that personally. :neartears

[Marka]

Great, just what we need, fighting between posters about race. I'm Jewish and will cast the first stone: ANYONE IS CAPABLE OF THIS SH*T. They can be Jewish, Italian, French or Chinese, scum are scum, so drop the racial insinuations. By the way I want to say thanks to all the people that are doing research on AI, as well as those who have gone out there. Another thing, those of you using Citibank CC's, you'll have to change your CC number to prevent being charged.

[satish]

ok here is a little more detail on what i have already summarized:

the phone number listen on the bottom of AIcomputers.com is:
(631) 755-8000
the reverse lookup of that come out as:

System Developers
155 Marine St
Farmingdale, NY 11735-5609
(631) 755-8000

now if we look up that reverse address we get a different story:

Pioneer Industries Inc
155 Marine St
Farmingdale, NY 11735
(631) 777-6000
- this is a working number, and a real person answers, who claims they arent AIcomputers.

One more thing, on one of the previous pages in this particular thread, someone mentioned the return address they had gotten off of a package they had recieved from AIcomputers in the past month or so.

AI Services
775 Park Ave
Huntington, NY 11743

I reversed that address and was returned an error "too many results returned for your search"
odd i thought, because i provided a house number, street name, state and zip...
Then i got on the phone with someone at my cell phone company, she was nice enough to do a reverse lookup for me. Her computer returned her around 103 results. she sorted through them for any instance of "computers" or even any electronics related sounding store... she was able to give me the numbers of 3 of the results that had the most promising results (although none of them sounded like aipc or artificial int. or AIComputers) i tried all three with no luck.


so there you go.

I've always wanted to visit NY state, just never had a good enough reason :)
*UPDATE*
Using a higher Tier info lookup system i found a little more info:
775 park ave in huntinton, NY shows up as:
one Mr.
Tauraso Jr, Vincent J
775 Park Avenue 110-3
Huntington, NY 11743

-also-

Heidelberg, Harris I
775 Park Ave
Huntington, NY 11743-3976

this is right accross from Little Plains park on route 35.

disclaimer: The following is opinion only
from my experience Heidelberg sounds like a Jewish name, and i dont know too many of them pulling couldbe internet scams... although im not saying its not possible, I just think that "Tauraso" sounds more suspicious


I wish I had that suite number when I went there yesterday. I drove out to 775 Park Ave, Huntington, NY yeserday. This is a office building with a number of businesses. The directory of the building does not show any company by the name of AI, AI Computers, Artificial Intelligence, System Developers or for that matter Pioneer. Here are some photographs:

http://stacman.dyndns.org:90/~shival/AIPics/DSC03965.JPG
http://stacman.dyndns.org:90/~shival/AIPics/DSC03966.JPG
http://stacman.dyndns.org:90/~shival/AIPics/DSC03967.JPG

I also have a photograph of sign inside the lobby that shows the buildings tenants but I could get a sharper picture, but here it is http://stacman.dyndns.org:90/~shival/AIPics/DSC03968.JPG. I still cannot find the cable for my Kodak Camera to transfer the photographs I took of the 155 Marine Street, Farmingdale, NY location. Will post links as soon as I do.

[av6]

I wish I had that suite number when I went there yesterday. I drove out to 775 Park Ave, Huntington, NY yeserday. This is a office building with a number of businesses. The directory of the building does not show any company by the name of AI, AI Computers, Artificial Intelligence, System Developers or for that matter Pioneer. Here are some photographs:

http://stacman.dyndns.org:90/~shival/AIPics/DSC03965.JPG
http://stacman.dyndns.org:90/~shival/AIPics/DSC03966.JPG
http://stacman.dyndns.org:90/~shival/AIPics/DSC03967.JPG

I also have a photograph of sign inside the lobby that shows the buildings tenants but I could get a sharper picture, but here it is http://stacman.dyndns.org:90/~shival/AIPics/DSC03968.JPG. I still cannot find the cable for my Kodak Camera to transfer the photographs I took of the 155 Marine Street, Farmingdale, NY location. Will post links as soon as I do.

Thanks for those pictures! I actually work in a business park and wow the exterior doesn't look so appealing.

[Flattoe]

All--

I ordered on the first day of the offer with some reservation. My order is in the 45XX series and I am still in new status. I have waited patiently for the last 2 and a half weeks for AI to provide some reasonable explanation to the communications issues they are having or fix them. It is becoming painfully obvious that even if I was to get my order (which I doubt and two months is waaaaaay to long to wait) I would hold the components quality in suspicion. If for some reason AI made an error with my order or if one of the components was bad AI Computers has not proven to have any kind of reasonable customer interface to resolve issues. The negative potential of this deal keeps mounting and as far as I can see from the posts on this thread no one has had satisfaction of communication or product delivery---I am officially out. I have changed my contact information in the Ai Computers website, sent an email to cancel my order (copied Apex) and have cancelled my credit card with which I made the order.

Good luck to all of those who have the fortitude stay on this ride. I hope we hear good things from you about recieving a well build system at the price promised.

Thanks to everyone who has done some sleuthing to try and located this company and find some legitimacy in the offer-- your work and support of our community should be appreciated and highly respected by all.

Last but not least-- Thank you Gabe for providing the link to this thread. I emailed you the first day of my order after I read the Maximum PC article and was a little concerned about the disconnected and unanswered phones at AIComputers. You have been a stand up guy and even though I just orderd all of the parts to build my own system through NewEgg.com (promised delivery on Tuesday) I will continue to frequent your site and look forward to finding some good deals.

[DarkFury]

I wish I had that suite number when I went there yesterday. I drove out to 775 Park Ave, Huntington, NY yeserday. This is a office building with a number of businesses. The directory of the building does not show any company by the name of AI, AI Computers, Artificial Intelligence, System Developers or for that matter Pioneer. Here are some photographs:

http://stacman.dyndns.org:90/~shival/AIPics/DSC03965.JPG
http://stacman.dyndns.org:90/~shival/AIPics/DSC03966.JPG
http://stacman.dyndns.org:90/~shival/AIPics/DSC03967.JPG

I also have a photograph of sign inside the lobby that shows the buildings tenants but I could get a sharper picture, but here it is http://stacman.dyndns.org:90/~shival/AIPics/DSC03968.JPG. I still cannot find the cable for my Kodak Camera to transfer the photographs I took of the 155 Marine Street, Farmingdale, NY location. Will post links as soon as I do.

You might want to resize those pics down to like a 800 x 600 or smaller. I'm on DSL broadband and it still took almost a minute to 1.5 minutes for just one of them load. :eek:

1600x1200 resolution on the web is not a good thing. Personally I usually resize them down to under 600 wide... still big enough to see all the details but usually at 1/10th the file size.

Just a suggestion... :thumb:

[Lito]

Well I also jumped in on this deal and canceled it yesterday. I was going to try to hold out but after checking the better business bereau website I was not really happy with the number of complaints that have been filed against the company. I decided to cancel. I am not too worried since my order was a 46xx and was still in new status and my CC was not charged yet. I ended up just canceling the CC# I used for the order. In case anyone is interested here is the link:
http://www.bbbnewyork.org/businessreports/Default.aspx?id=73780

[kksf00]

Apex - from what you have dealt with AI


SHOULD EVERYONE BE CANCELING THEIR ORDERS?

everybody seems to think that this deal is a never going to be fulfilled. you seem to have more info than the rest of us. so, if you had gone into it like the rest of us - what would you do?

Just answer this please. Let's not waste any more time speculating!

[Ravendas]

NY OAG Online business complaint form (http://www.oag.state.ny.us/online_forms/complaint_alert.jsp) - Note that it is a misdemeanor to submit false info!

Looking up the corp. registrant (http://appsext5.dos.state.ny.us/corp_public/display_entity?p_nameid=2821292&p_corpid=2817091&p_name_type=A&p_search_type=BEGINS&p_request=1&p_entity_name=AIPCS%20SYSTEMS%20TECHNOLOGIES,%20INC.&p_entity_name_input=AIPCS) for AIPCS get one result: a Kostantinos Mouzakitis of Woodside, NY. (http://www.anywho.com/qry/wp_fap?lastname=MOUZAKITIS&firstname=&city=&state=NY&zip=&btnsubmit.x=33&btnsubmit.y=3) No idea if it is the same guy though.

Still no response from AI to my one email Apex. D'ya want me to resend and BCC ya on it?

-Rav

[ello13]

Apex - from what you have dealt with AI


SHOULD EVERYONE BE CANCELING THEIR ORDERS?

everybody seems to think that this deal is a never going to be fulfilled. you seem to have more info than the rest of us. so, if you had gone into it like the rest of us - what would you do?

Just answer this please. Let's not waste any more time speculating!



I really think you need to be making that decision YOURSELF. We're not playing simon says here... If you feel uncomfortable with the deal, then bail out while you still can, but I guess you can't make that decision on your own.

[SteelheadBob]

This train wreck just keeps on rolling along.It sure brings out the best in people. I was always told the time to research a deal is before I spend my money. There were plenty of warnings here and elsewhere on the net. For future reference Google is a great starting place.I guess I would feel like an idiot to if I called up everyone I knew and told them to jump on a sinking ship. I saw almost the exact same thing happen a year ago with a company near Cleveland called Micro Pro.Oh and Crackerbox if you go back and read I believe Apex posted that if you used your "CC" and they denied the charge back and you did everything possible to dispute the charges he would cover it. I don't think it applies to cash, M/O,checks,or debit cards.Here is a golden rule of internet buying. If you learn nothing else from this whole dog and pony show it is this, "Always use a CC, it is the only thing that protects the buyer" You pay for the service use it. If you don't have a CC bring the money over to Mom,Dad,or someone who has a CC and pay them and put it on their CC.I have had to dispute charges three times and all it took was a phone call and then signing some paperwork and mailing it back.What is really funny is not one of those disputed charges ever fought it.Good luck

[knimbleknight]

"this Apex dude" could have just DELETED ALL REFERENCES TO THIS fiasco, deals posted, and locked the threads, banned emails and members, and NOT HAVE ANSWERED any emails at all. If you know ANYTHING about dealsites and forums, most owners of other dealsites already would have done so, and would have hightailed out of here.

Certainly not in favor of bashing Apex, as he is going above and beyond the call of duty on this one, but perhaps he should have simply cleaned his hands of this deal from the start before making assurances that may or may not pan out. True, it is ultimately up to the individual to decide whether to stick this out or not, but he did stick his neck out on this with his money back guarantee, which leaves him open for criticism if this does prove to be a scam.

Again, I commend him for working so hard on this, but I don't really see what his involvement accomplishes, other than to get people to stick this out past the point where they normally would have bailed. If this is a legit deal, what good does forwarding people's cancellation orders really do? AI does receive e-mails just fine - they answered two of my e-mails on the first day of this deal (one asked how long it would take to ship, and the reply was 7-10 business days, and the other asked to cancel, and they replied with a cancellation confirmation the next day).

And now Apex is recommending people to stick it out until Monday. Apex, can you share what additional information you have obtained that makes you think Monday will bring good news? Are they actually shipping out a few systems? Even if a few people were to receive their orders, that doesn't necessarily mean all is right. That's actually a great way to string people along some more. This company is just way too sketchy - I mean, what kind of company actually tries to comfort customers by telling them they have 6 months to protest a fraudulent charge? All I can say is that if you aren't 100% sure that this company is legit, I think that kind of recommendation is irresponsible. Yes, people are free to make there own choices, but as the "regulars" here have clearly demonstrated, people have a strong trust in you, so if you aren't sure about this, you should respect that trust and be a little more neutral in this matter.

[kksf00]

I really think you need to be making that decision YOURSELF. We're not playing simon says here... If you feel uncomfortable with the deal, then bail out while you still can, but I guess you can't make that decision on your own.

Of course i can make the decision myself. But i need INFORMATION and APEX may or may not have it, so I'd like to know what he thinks. My question will probably help others too and end all the endless speculation about what's going on.

How about getting off my back?

[SteelheadBob]

Just a few more points to ponder
1. Why is there no mention of any problems on AI's website?
2. Why is AI still taking orders?
3. Who is the warrenty with?
4. If you did get a computer and you needed tech support what number do you call?
5. When you order why do they ask for your daily charge limit?

[Lodz]

Of course i can make the decision myself. But i need INFORMATION and APEX may or may not have it, so I'd like to know what he thinks. My question will probably help others too and end all the endless speculation about what's going on.

Agreed. ello13, stop being a tool. :boxing: People are asking Apex because he gave his word that we wouldn't be completely hosed by this deal. I'm tired of people posting that others shouldn't be asking questions or wondering how they can get back their money that was taken from them. If Apex doesn't want to respond to a particular question, he doesn't have to. But there's nothing wrong with asking the question.

I find myself getting more and more irritable as I wait for the outcome to all this. And how many here still think that this deal might be legit. Show of hands? Just curious. I really have no idea what to make of it.

[quantumburnz]

Regardless of all the red flags I've seen from the beginning, I'm still hanging in there. This sounds like the most fishy deal I've ever heard of or dealt with, but it's worth it if I get my computer. Call me ignorant, stubborn, whatever you want, but I still have some faith in Apex's orginial beliefe in these people. We'll see what happens.

[Markel]

This sounds like the most fishy deal I've ever heard of or dealt with....
I guess you've never heard of CyberRebates. I did a few cycles with them (and got all my rebates), but when their prices started skyrocketing I knew it was time to stay clear (thus I didn't get burned when they went under).

And yes, I am keeping my order with AI.

[Quiescence]

Just a few more points to ponder

5. When you order why do they ask for your daily charge limit?

Many web sites do the same thing. If your charge limit is less than the price they withdraw the money accordingly.

[Bidhere23]

Over @ spoofee.com they are having the same discussion regarding AI:

http://www.spoofee.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8118&page=1&pp=15

Cut/Paste:

Heres the factual skinny on these guys, after a WHOIS search under aicomputers:

AIPCS Systems Technologie registered AIComputers.
AIPCS are based in Farmingdale NY at 155-B Marine Street 11735
1-631-755-8000
The admin and technical contact is Constantine Mouzakitis.

goto register.com and do a WHOIS on aicomputers to get this info.

[Bidhere23]

http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview.cfm?catid=40&threadid=1299897&STARTPAGE=2&enterthread=y

[pcguy]

Over @ spoofee.com they are having the same discussion regarding AI:

http://www.spoofee.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8118&page=1&pp=15

Cut/Paste:

Heres the factual skinny on these guys, after a WHOIS search under aicomputers:

AIPCS Systems Technologie registered AIComputers.
AIPCS are based in Farmingdale NY at 155-B Marine Street 11735
1-631-755-8000
The admin and technical contact is Constantine Mouzakitis.

goto register.com and do a WHOIS on aicomputers to get this info.

Am I the only one noticing how closely spoofee's interface resembles G|A?

[Underclocked]

This deal was all over the internet. It was also posted on other forums aside from this this one. I'm sure there are a lot of parallel threads to this one.

[Apex]

Sorry folks, not going to be online much today. Will be back tomorrow afternoon to evening.

I did not mention specifics on Monday because I do not know (or I would have said. I'm not being coy). I will share info as soon as I get it.

I would personally wait if I ordered with a credit card. An extra few days will not change the risk. For those who did not, I cannot advise you because I wouldn't even buy from Microsoft or IBM with a debit or check card. We're talking the difference between excellent protection, and almost none.

[bullethead]

Hey all my stuff just came and was delivered in ivory white box's with golden hay.
An extra box came and when I opened it, Paris Hilton came out with a video camera and a smile. My wife said she was going to run up and get some beer.
We all went into the room and played Half-Life 2, hehehe.
(sorry had to clean it up alittle bit, hehehe)

I would say theres a better chance of the above happening then the real deal, lol.

Im waiting it out but not expecting anything. If I get something great, Ill Ebay the parts and make a few bucks. If I dont then oh well.

[Underclocked]

16 days after I CANCELLED my order, I just now get an order confirmation email. WTF?

[beo]

16 days after I CANCELLED my order, I just now get an order confirmation email. WTF?
Yeah, I just received the Stage-3 email today, but it was dated Tuesday. (About the time I saw the status change to Stage-3 on the webpage.) Sounds like the timestamp on their mail server is off (intentionally?) I sent cancellation notices Friday. No reply there. CC has been contacted. Oh well.

[bullethead]

I tryed do a search for
AI computer stage 3 with spaces without spaces and evrything in between.

Nothing showed up other then this thread over and over again.

This is official the only thread AI has screwed someone in stages instead of screwing them over all at once, lol

[SteelheadBob]

Riddle me this Batman. If they are legit wouldn't they have a phone by now. I know alot of people would rather phone an order in then order online. Good thing non of there prior customers need tech support. While were down this road where are all there satisfied customers and why haven't they posted supporting AI.I think Steve Miller said it best.


Steve Miller - Take The Money And Run Lyrics
This here's a story about Billy Joe and Bobbie Sue
Two young lovers with nothin' better to do
Than sit around the house, get high, and watch the tube
And here is what happened when they decided to cut loose

They headed down to, ooh, old El Paso
That's where they ran into a great big hassle
Billy Joe shot a man while robbing his castle
Bobbie Sue took the money and run

Go on take the money and run
Go on take the money and run
Go on take the money and run
Go on take the money and run

Billy Mack is a detective down in Texas
You know he knows just exactly what the facts is
He ain't gonna let those two escape justice
He makes his livin' off of the people's taxes

Bobbie Sue, whoa, whoa, she slipped away
Billy Joe caught up to her the very next day
They got the money, hey
You know they got away
They headed down south and they're still running today
Singin' go on take the money and run
Go on take the money and run
Go on take the money and run
Go on take the money and run
Go on take the money and run
Go on take the money and run
Go on take the money and run
Go on take the money and run

[Underclocked]

bullethead,

Some light reading for you: http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=%22aicomputers%22

[lmc]

16 days after I CANCELLED my order, I just now get an order confirmation email. WTF?

I just got my order confirmation today too...and I ordered 18 days ago. My order is still open though... this is ridiculous!

[pcguy]

Hmmm.........I was just thinking..........if this deal isn't legit what would be their motivation for even having a guy on icq........I suppose it's possible they might just have circumstances right now with the T1 bit or whatever, but it would be nice to see someone on these forums get a comp so we can be reassured and then for anyone who does to post of course

[Apex]

I'm back to work again, and will be working on the emails again (4:52pm Pacific, Sunday).

[crackerbox]

im gunna get banned for this

well pcguy... let me share my cynical insight with you:
after reviewing some of the posts that quoted conversations that various people have had with this AI guy on icq, it seems very possible that the majority (not all) of the answers given by the ai guy could have easily been "bot" responces, ie not an actual person, but a chat bot, setup to respond a certain way, to a certain keyword.

Now, for the above affended and anymore who took offence to my 2nd post, in which i said one last name sounded more suspicious than another:
when i saw the last that i thought was suspect, i didnt think that was an italian last name, infact i believed it to be a middle eastern last name. Being 1/3 italian, myself, i meant no biggotry to anyone, except maybe...naw not worth it.

Now let me preface my next statement with the fact that i have been, by one, and maybe more doctors, been classified as borderline paranoid~pscitzofrenic.
but WTF do they know...f'n quacks

What if...

What if Apex and his deal site(s) are 97% of the time legit, but a whole 3% of the time, he runs deals that are infact fraudulent scams...

What if Apex is actually on payroll with these guys.

What if by apex handeling "damage control" the end number of people who actually dont cancel their orders and get scammed for good, increases.

What if by apex appearing to "try" and help everyone out and not just close this thread, he is actually trying to make it appear that he isnt down with the scammers.

I mean serriously, why is is that the ONLY person who can contact AI is apex??

Something isnt adding up here.

I contacted my bank today, and even though i purchased with a debit card, there is a strong chance i can get my money back, but if i did get my money back, i would be more than happy to spend it on court and lawyer fees to begin a Class Action Law Suite. With all the frivilous law suits that are getting approved now aday, just think about how easily this one would go through...

But let me let you guys in on what is actually going down here:

AIcomputers went out of business a month ago... THERE IS NO ONE THERE.
but the domain name is still paid for, so it is still up.
The foriegn piece of SH*T that runs the web site decided that it would be a really good idea, to screw abunch of hard working americans out of their money before he goes back over seas and returns home to his 3 donkeys, dirt hut, and 200lbs cammel humping bride with more facial hair than i have.

ok ban me

[bradpitt]

im gunna get banned for this
...


LOL ! :)
maybe we can get a class action lawsuit going? any lawyers here?

[Apex]

im gunna get banned for this

ok ban me

Not exactly sure why that would get you banned. :shrug:

[Cantacuzene]

This started out as really funny. Now its just sickening what with all the cry babies here.

[irwinh]

im gunna get banned for this

Now, for the above affended and anymore who took offence to my 2nd post, in which i said one last name sounded more suspicious than another:
when i saw the last that i thought was suspect, i didnt think that was an italian last name, infact i believed it to be a middle eastern last name. Being 1/3 italian, myself, i meant no biggotry to anyone, except maybe...naw not worth it.


Like many following this thread, I am a newbie to gotapex.com. I ordered a laptop as part of this "special deal" (order number in the low 5xxx's) using a CC and am willing to wait a few more days before I send a cancellation e-mail to AI Computers. I've cut out the above quote b/c I have an off-topic question for crackerbox...how is it possible to be 1/3 Italian?

[dizzytrain]

I can understand crackerbox's need to vent, he used a debit card and thats really got to hurt right now. If this guy is going overseas with our money i doubt he will be returning to camels and donkeys, more like bmws. Do you realize how much cash he could have pulled out of his merchant account by now, and he would have almost a month to get out with it. Oh well, wish this deal was posted originally on the forums not the front page, that way it would have been in conjunction with some background on these guys from posters in the know. By the way, if anyone gets in touch with these guys on ICQ or if you can communicate with them apex,
be sure and mention this new info regarding their address, since they have stated clearly that they are still located there. It seems this could be easily verified once and for all. There is no reason for them to be lying about this unless they are frauds

[stovall]

First, Crackerbox, it sounds like you have some issues outside the problem with AI Computers. I actually feel sorry for you. I pity that you need denigrate people from other ethnic backgrounds, and it's all the worse if you do not see how your comments sound to others.

Second, if the AI sight is correct about referrals, Apex gets up to 5% of all orders clicked through his sight. If I owned gotapex site, I might give a similar guarantee since if it is fraud, cc companies will refund. If it's not a fraud, he gets his commission.

And third, what's the problem using debit cards. I rechecked with my bank, asked them what would happen in this case, and they said my Mastercard debit card is fully insured against fraud just like my credit card. The only difference, if I understand it, is that I lose the loss of the money until it is resolved.

Although I usually only lurk, I do refer gotapex to many people at the University where I work, and I'd say about 50 people use this site for deals because of it. I do feel less confident giving my full assurance after looking at this debacle work itself out -- no matter if we get the computers or not.

And no, I don't often post messages. I do enjoy reading the forums, and I want to thank everyone for keeping me informed over the years.

[dizzytrain]

"my Mastercard debit card is fully insured against fraud just like my credit card. The only difference, if I understand it, is that I lose the loss of the money until it is resolved."

thats good news, was a bit worried for the debit users,
is that standard, or is this just a really great card

[pcguy]

im gunna get banned for this

well pcguy... let me share my cynical insight with you:
after reviewing some of the posts that quoted conversations that various people have had with this AI guy on icq, it seems very possible that the majority (not all) of the answers given by the ai guy could have easily been "bot" responces, ie not an actual person, but a chat bot, setup to respond a certain way, to a certain keyword.


That's entirely possible, but it didn't seem like he was a bot when I talked to him.....although maybe they selectively bot it or something

And I also don't understand how someone having an Indian name implies that they aren't as hardworking or "honest" as Americans. All the Indians I've met in the states are extremely hard-working and I'm not sure you can necessarily call Americans more honest, but this is straying from the point.

[ApltnHkyMutt]

ive had things go bad with debit cards before and always got my money back.

[dRu168]

.....

[Ravendas]

thats good news, was a bit worried for the debit users,
is that standard, or is this just a really great card
I used a Bank of America debit card. I've disputed stuff before without a problem. They issue a credit until the matter is resolved. You are only recharged the amount if their investigation is not in your favor.

-Rav

[DarkFury]

And third, what's the problem using debit cards. I rechecked with my bank, asked them what would happen in this case, and they said my Mastercard debit card is fully insured against fraud just like my credit card. The only difference, if I understand it, is that I lose the loss of the money until it is resolved.

The difference here is... "the loss of the money until it is resolved". Yup, that right there is the MAIN reason why NOT to use debit cards on the web.

Credit cards... you claim "fraud" and you just don't pay the charge.... the credit card company looks into it and it will remain pending until resolved... and your cash stays in your pocket to do other things with if that's what you want to do.

Having your funds "hijacked" on a Debit card in the middle of a "fraud investigation" is no fun... lemme tell ya. I have a friend who's wife made a charge online on their debit card that was supposed to be for $4.95... however it was accidentally charged $495 instead which put his account into an NSF status (as he only had about $300 in there to begin with...). His bank was like.... OK, the money is gone and there is a $25 NSF fee, however we will waive that when it gets resoved...

It took them over 2 weeks to straigten this out... in the meantime, he wasn't able to pay ANY of his bills since the money from his account was GONE (and his "payday" had just passed and that money had already been spent), thus over the 2 weeks he was "out of his cash" he was charged various "late fees" and other charges from the "legit bills" that he couldn't pay because of a "debit card error"... that wasn't even his fault.

After that... he learned... NEVER give your debit card number to anyone, especially out on the net.

Now granted, this situation might NEVER happen to you, but it COULD happen, and that alone is reason enough not to use a debit card to buy stuff on the web REGARDLESS of the "insurance" from Mastercard.

[Apex]

Update:

I'm caught up with emails. 2:48AM Monday morning.

[ThinkBling]

Apex, did you ever get any response from aicomputers for shipping just the parts?

[J_money]

The way I always understood it, your visa and mastercard debit cards have the SAME protection as your CCs. I use both; have had disputes on both; both came out on my side. I'm not worried about disputing this. Of course, maybe I should be. We're coming up on almost a month after this deal, and what have we learned?

1. No phones.
2. No Customer Service.
3. Wacky stuff going on via the AI website...i.e. not being able to see your order on the website, just some broken code about "discount" being removed.
4. The mysterious "AI Guy" on ICQ is the only link to the company.
5. The physical address of AI is still not figured out.

First time post, but have been reading this site for years. This just seems insane. But, alas, I am too, because I'm still stickin' to the deal. :cheers:

[groebuck]

So it's monday - where is the good news we were supposed to hear?

[Burzhui]

So it's monday - where is the good news we were supposed to hear?


i just saved 15% on my car insurance

[groebuck]

YEAHHHHHH wwhoo hooooo- he saved HE SAVED

[Jeffbx]

i just saved 15% on my car insurance

I just lowered my cholesterol.

[Jae]

I called Washington Mutual about my Visa Check card and they told me it works just like a credit card. Furtermore if there is a dispute about a transaction they will put the money back in your account while they invesigate the matter!!

[DarkFury]

I called Washington Mutual about my Visa Check card and they told me it works just like a credit card. Furtermore if there is a dispute about a transaction they will put the money back in your account while they invesigate the matter!!
Sounds like you got a good company then... however as always "mileage varies" on this... and some banks DON'T refund the money during a dispute hence my example provided above.

[stovall]

Actually, I stand corrected. My bank also will put the money back in immediately upon a fraud against my account. They were actually saying, I think, that I lose the money until I file the claim -- or just waiting around until I figure I need to file a claim -- which isn't even this case yet because they haven't charged me anyway. FYI, I have a high order number 50xx, I ordered an inexpensive system for my home, and I have the luxury of seeing whether 3xxx & 4xxx orders are filled.

One last thing about the debit vs credit debate. I have a seperate bank account with debit card for this kind of deals. Before, I would just whip out my credit card anytime I saw something (like free w/rebate), and I was really not keeping track of all the money I was "saving" on the Internet. Now that I have a special account w/debit card, I pay MUCH closer attention to things like rebates, more selective in the deals I pursue because it's REAL money, and it's been no expense since it was a local bank w/free checking. (I actually didn't order ANY checks for my checking acct -- which at the time was a first for the person setting up my account.)

Why do I do this? When's the last time you heard of someone going into $25000 debt using a debit card. Yes, I know many of you pay in full every month, but MOST Americans have a HUGE credit card debt. (For example, Vegas HATES debit cards -- because you can only spend what you have.) So if you have ANY debt on your cc, you would be much better using a debit card.

And as far as these horror stories about my friend used a debit card... I'm not saying it is not true, but I would sue my bank (and win) if they treated me like that -- and I would certainly check out a bank's reputation before using them. Of course, just like AI (and maybe Apex in this deal) is not giving us much customer service, I'm sure there are banks like that too. I use Fifth Third in Chicago, I've read that B of A is very good, so if you want to use a debit card, also use a reputable bank, and it would probably be better to use a debit rather than a credit card.

[elpierco]

Is anyone still holding out for this deal??? I have already started putting together a contentention box at newegg...Has anyone received anything yet? My order # is in the 5000 and it is still listed as new so I am guessing my order is towards the end of the line...do we email apex if we want to cancel our order? Thanks

[MASTERPL]

If you want to wait weeks for you order to cancel, sure email ai.

report your credit,debit card lost and get a new one. Much quicker, plus no added ai frustrations.

[J_money]

I'm 46XX, and WANT to hold out, I just don't know how much longer I will wait. I'm not afraid of fraud, I'm just concerned that's it'll be three months before I even get my computer.

[DarkFury]

Why do I do this? When's the last time you heard of someone going into $25000 debt using a debit card. Yes, I know many of you pay in full every month, but MOST Americans have a HUGE credit card debt. (For example, Vegas HATES debit cards -- because you can only spend what you have.) So if you have ANY debt on your cc, you would be much better using a debit card.

And as far as these horror stories about my friend used a debit card... I'm not saying it is not true, but I would sue my bank (and win) if they treated me like that -- and I would certainly check out a bank's reputation before using them. Of course, just like AI (and maybe Apex in this deal) is not giving us much customer service, I'm sure there are banks like that too. I use Fifth Third in Chicago, I've read that B of A is very good, so if you want to use a debit card, also use a reputable bank, and it would probably be better to use a debit rather than a credit card.

Honestly I see where you are going with this... however to me, folks that run up extreme credit card bills and don't pay them off just lack "control"... and I guess that they need something like a debit card to reign them in.

However, for those of us who use CREDIT wisely... it can be a powerful tool. Think of it this way... what if you had a bill that you HAD to pay right away (say your car broke down in the middle of nowhere...) you only have like $50 cash on you and your Debit card has like say $500 on it, but the bill is for like $1,500...

With a credit card, I have instant access to like $10,000 if needed, however I usually try to keep my monthly under $1,000 if I can... however in a circumstance like the one above, having a credit card can mean the difference in being able to get help or being stuck out in the middle of nowhere.

Either way... I do understand what folks say about credit cards vs. debit cards, however I still ain't gonna use my debit card (which I only use for "ATM transactions) on the web in any case. I just have to exhibit greater "self control" in only spending what I can afford to spend... which is generally not a problem for me. :D

[xuru]

Is anyone still holding out for this deal??? I have already started putting together a contentention box at newegg...Has anyone received anything yet? My order # is in the 5000 and it is still listed as new so I am guessing my order is towards the end of the line...do we email apex if we want to cancel our order? Thanks

I'm waiting to see what apex has to tell us today... (47xx)

[DarkFury]

Why do I do this? When's the last time you heard of someone going into $25000 debt using a debit card.
Well if you didn't have $25,000 in the bank, it would come up NSF... and not be a "debt" per se.. but it would most likely be rejected. :hmm:

[Comet]

Is anyone still holding out for this deal??? I have already started putting together a contentention box at newegg...Has anyone received anything yet? My order # is in the 5000 and it is still listed as new so I am guessing my order is towards the end of the line...do we email apex if we want to cancel our order? Thanks

For the record, this is my first post but I've been a long time reader and have enjoyed the discussions.

Yes, I am still holding out for this deal for at least this week. Apex said it best when he said "I would personally wait if I ordered with a credit card. An extra few days will not change the risk". I agree with him and trust his judgment.

I too have priced a comparable system at newegg and it came out around 50% higher than my AI order. For the $500 difference, I'm willing to wait a while longer.

I currently have two orders in the AI system (upper 38xx and lower 40xx). The first one has been in Stage-3 for a week now and my CC was charged with the discount applied. Still waiting for the other shoe to drop and some good news about some computers being shipped / received.

[SteelheadBob]

Some debit cards are different the one I have from my Credit Union works just like a check and offers no protection. I use it locally because it is easier than writing checks.I pay my total balance of my mastercard every month. I do see where your coming from it is easy to charge away and at the end of the month you go WOW. The thing I don't like is they keep trying to raise my credit limit. The reps always sound suprised when I call them and say no thanks keep it the same. I only use the CC for online buying and travel and I use it because I am protected.My one big dispute was with a magazine subscription broker who charged me 2200 for like 50 different magazines. Mastercard took care of the charge over the phone sent me something to sign and I never heard another thing. Now on to AI I think if you check into it the owners are Russian. Not only is a business a place to pull a scam but it is also easy to launder money through a legit business. I think you will have a hard time finding anyone with a killer AI gaming system. As for MR. AI he needs to keep it open so they can get as much as possible.If you think Apex has anything to do with it you must be dumber than you look. I bet he is trying to end this train wreck as quick as he can and right now he is between a rock and a hard place. This site has been up for a long time and Apex has a good reputation he is trying to save it.Just be glad he cares enough about his members to do what he can, I know alot of sites would say see ya you did the deal we just post em.

[stech4u]

anyone get a cancellation-confirmation yet? just wanting to know how long it takes--if its even conceivable... TIA

[dcbly]

Is anyone still holding out for this deal??? I have already started putting together a contentention box at newegg...Has anyone received anything yet? My order # is in the 5000 and it is still listed as new so I am guessing my order is towards the end of the line...do we email apex if we want to cancel our order? Thanks

I'm still in. When I ordered I set payment by "wire transfer". If/When AI calls to set up the transfer, they have no info at this point, I'll change to a CC for the safety.

Darren in Bakersfield

[thaxi]

Comet,
I am waiting on this one just like you. The system I spec'd out is still expensive elsewhere so am gonna wait and see.

Order # 404x
CC got charged last week.

[groebuck]

I tried this weekend and when I look up my order, there is a screen at the bottom which looks like the db crashed (funny the field looks to be the discount!)..

It's been like that for three days....

I think we are all going to get nothing at the least and possibly screwed at the most ...


Where is our good news today regarding AI ?? :puke:

[Lodz]

Gabe,

Any idea why they only respond to emails from you? I could understand that they may have a lot of email to go through, but surely they should have gotten around to the ones that were sent almost 3 weeks ago. Do you sent the emails that you are cc'd on to another address?

BTW - AI overcharged my credit card. Everyone be sure to match the price you were quoted to the price you were charged.

[MASTERPL]

I bet they have filtering setup on their address. All email except from Gabe filter to a blackhole.

[Burzhui]

I dunno what to think... i still have hope.. the guy on ICQ was nice, and they did respond to my email....

[Apex]

Update: Waiting to hear back. Starting on the new emails. I'll be on and off today, though more on then off (go figure). Will post as soon as I hear the news. I'm waiting just like everyone else.

BTW, no on just the parts.

[pcguy]

They probably are responding to gabe because he's posted deals of theirs (which attracts them more customers). If they are legit, this is reason enough to respond to his emails even if they're swamped. If they aren't legit, it allows them to present themselves as legit to him (and hence his readers) for as long as possible so they can swindle more money out of people.

Personally, I'll hang in there a little longer, because as Burzhui said, the ICQ guy was very nice and helpful. Perhaps they are just waiting for a lot of people to cancel because they didn't intend the deal to be so big. Who knows......it would be comforting though, as I said before, to see someone on these forums actually get something and post about it so we know that people are in fact receiving computers.

[billr]

it would be comforting though, as I said before, to see someone on these forums actually get something and post about it so we know that people are in fact receiving computers.

I can't believe that there are people here who, having read the posts on this forum, still believe that AI is a real company that really sells real computers. AI is running a scam, nothing more. People are not receiving computers for the simple reason that AI has no computers on hand to actually sell. My wife is a senior buyer with a big defense contractor. As soon as I explained what was going on, she instantly recognized the particular brand of shenanigans AI was pulling. She's seen it before.

They post a pie-in-the-sky deal so they can get lots of receiveables quickly. Then they show their newly improved financials to a bank and/or their suppliers and pretend that they are an actual company so they can get credit. The few cards they charged are probably to get at some cash quickly. In either case, they use this credit/money to keep them from going out of business by paying salaries and such (and apparently not paying their past-due phone bill). Whether AI uses this money to buy the parts they need to fulfill orders they've already taken is another matter. My wife's seen companies that take the money and run, and she's seen ones that string you along for long enough to let the scam take effect and keep them in business. I'd prefer the former, as the nightmare ends quicker, letting you get back to what you were doing.

Best case, AI needed interest-free loans from everyone dumb enough to provide them with a CC number (myself included) so they could have collateral or a little hard cash in order to stay alive a few months longer. Worst case, they're never going to ship what people ordered. Even best case, is it "fraud" to offer for sale items which you don't yet possess? No idea. Probably it's a legal grey area. In any event, you can't do this sort of thing too many times before the jig is up for good. It looks like this is AI's second time trying to stay afloat, so they can't have many more last gasps left.

No, "comforting" would be AI acting like a bona fide business entity to start with, and not hiding behind non-communication and deception and outright lies (anyone still buying the "we're upgrading our T1" or "our PBX server is on back order" myths?). Or something as lame as "a guy on ICQ". That is just completely laughable. I should have cancelled the minute I read that ICQ was the only way to get in touch with them. Some 20 year-old in his mom's basement does not a business relationship make.

Of course, this is all my opinion, I'm only guessing, take a few grains of salt, I could be wrong, the deal could still go through, the check's in the mail, Jesus was a black man, the tooth fairy is real, and Santa Claus stole my women.

[J_money]

What's wrong with Jesus being black?

No offense taken or meant...I'm just sayin...

[ello13]

Again, if this was plain and simple fraud, they could have just charged everyone's cards at the time the order was placed. The fact that only those getting "stage three" whatever that is is getting charged should dispel the fraud (charge all the cards and run) theory. They might be trying the whole getting money before purchasing parts thing, but that's not exactly fraud. It's unethical business practices, but not fraud.

[billr]

What's wrong with Jesus being black?

No offense taken or meant...I'm just sayin...

There was this guy in college who loved to exercise his free speech rights on campus. One of those "my tax dollars pay for this school, so I can be here whenever I want!" types that all public universities seem to attract. He wasn't a student, he was like this 50 year-old bum. He wanted to start a cult I think, and he was always walking around outside the student union with these ridiculous signs about Yahweh and such, screaming "Jesus was a black man!" at the top of his lungs. One day he was parading around in like fig leaves, another day I think he tried to get naked and got cuffed by the school police.

For all I know, Jesus was a black man. I couldn't care less. But think about context: Tooth fairy, Jesus, Santa. So when you read the last sentence of my post above, do it like you can smell the patchouli and you'll get where I was coming from.

[Burzhui]

What's wrong with Jesus being black?

No offense taken or meant...I'm just sayin...

because he wasn't. Jesus was Jewish, was born in jerusalem, was never linked to marocan jews.. no way in hell he could have been black... not that it matters at all.. the boy's dead

[Jaxidian]

Me and a few friends of mine are trying to cancel orders with these guys now. All of us sent AI an email last Thursday morning to cancel our orders but they still show up online as NEW. Is there a way to really get this cancelled? (sorry, I stopped reading this thread back around page 22 or so, so I apologize if this has been covered).

Thanks!

[Markel]

A word to all the new members who are participating in this thread. I have been around these forums for a while now, and although I've never met Apex/Gabe personally, I've learned a few things about him. I feel that I could hand him my wallet full of cash and credit cards to hold, and wouldn't even need to check it when I got it back. Those (or at least one) who are questioning Apex's integrity are simply barking up the wrong tree. Period.

[FireMan2103]

Sorry...If I'm asking a question that's already been answered...but I'm wondering if anyone has yet to receive an order from AI??

I placed my order on 4/28 with a credit card. Just wondering if I should wait it out?

But that may be the BIG question right now!!!! :neartears

[DarkFury]

Of course, this is all my opinion, I'm only guessing, take a few grains of salt, I could be wrong, the deal could still go through, the check's in the mail, Jesus was a black man, the tooth fairy is real, and Santa Claus stole my women.
Honestly, you coulda stopped before this paragraph...

and the "Black Jesus" quip... well... don't even go there. :nono:

[dizzytrain]

Maybe they are charging cards gradually so as to keep this low profile, and stop us from knowing with certainty this is not exactly as it should be. It would raise red flags if they got a huge sudden influx of cash like that in their merchant account and pulled it out all at once.
Or perhaps they simply have an entry level credit card machine like the one ive used at small business retail stores, they are limited in the number of charges they can do with a machine like that,
perhaps the stage three is just meant to keep us settled down when we realize our cards have been charged.
this is all just me guessing,
but what i do know is that their stage 3 e-mail is deceptive, They state that in stage three the P>C is already built on their website, this means according to their own definition of stage three our computers are not in it. Interesting how we all jumped past stage 2

[beo]

About 1/2 way through the emails now. Hoping to have some good news on monday.
Monday has come and gone, but I haven't heard any news yet... probably means Gabe hasn't heard any either...

[billr]

and the "Black Jesus" quip... well... don't even go there.

If Jesus really existed, I bet he had a sense of humor. He'd almost have to, you know?

[bradpitt]

I think you will have a hard time finding anyone with a killer AI gaming system.

funny you should say that... before they closed the bug in the system where you could look at other peoples orders... i found a guy that bought a computer on 4/19 i think i dont remember ... but he said he got his computer fast (i checked his tracking number, LOL, he got it next day!) and then i emailed him asked him how it was.. he said it rocked ... he also said that his friend got one but it took him 2 weeks to get his ... i dont know i emailed the guy a couple of times he seemed like a real person :-P



but after reading all these posts... i might want to cancel :( .. but i will hold out until this weekend....hopefully we will get some news by then!

[Apex]

Monday has come and gone, but I haven't heard any news yet... probably means Gabe hasn't heard any either...

Correct, have messaged them a few times, have not heard back today. Will update as soon as I do. (11:30pm Pacific, Monday night)

[groebuck]

Error Occurred While Processing Request
Error Diagnostic Information

An error occurred while evaluating the expression:


discount = ORDER_DETAILS.discount



Error near line 341, column 7.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Error resolving parameter ORDER_DETAILS.DISCOUNT


The column DISCOUNT is not present in the query named ORDER_DETAILS. It is likely that you have misspelled the name of the column.



The error occurred while processing an element with a general identifier of (CFSET), occupying document position (341:1) to (341:41).


Date/Time: 05/18/04 06:58:55
Browser: Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.2; MyIE2; .NET CLR 1.1.4322)
Remote Address: 64.102.241.4
HTTP Referrer: http://www.aicomputers.com/myaccount.cfm?page=orders
Query String: page=orders&do=Edit&orderid=4460


This is what you get when you look up your order on their website. It has been like this since Saturday. It would seem to me a company in business to sell computers and parts through the web would AT LEAST maintain their freaking website (let alone their phone lines...T1 upgrade my a**). I'm cancelling now..screw em.

again from their web site -

Our mission is to continue to manufacturer the most powerful PCs in the world. We will always strive to be leaders in every area of our industry. Our customer service will be surpassed by none, period. a.i - artificial intelligence, inc. does everything in our power to maintain our high level of customer satisfaction. Our customer loyalty will be surpassed by none. Most importantly, we create the fastest and most reliable PCs in the market, utilizing only the highest standards of components. We maintain our elite standards by our professional work environment. We generously reward dedication, and complete commitment to the mission of the company and more importantly, you the consumer.

AAAAAAAAAAAAAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAH - I think they failed their mission miserably.

[groebuck]

That is the dude - does that phone number reach him?? If so we should all call him since the business line is busy. (He is the one quoted in maximum PC - the one who said AIPCS and AICOMPUTERS are two separate companies.)

EVERYONE WHO HAS TRIED TO CALL THE COMPANY CALL THIS DUDE !!!


NY OAG Online business complaint form (http://www.oag.state.ny.us/online_forms/complaint_alert.jsp) - Note that it is a misdemeanor to submit false info!

Looking up the corp. registrant (http://appsext5.dos.state.ny.us/corp_public/display_entity?p_nameid=2821292&p_corpid=2817091&p_name_type=A&p_search_type=BEGINS&p_request=1&p_entity_name=AIPCS%20SYSTEMS%20TECHNOLOGIES,%20INC.&p_entity_name_input=AIPCS) for AIPCS get one result: a Kostantinos Mouzakitis of Woodside, NY. (http://www.anywho.com/qry/wp_fap?lastname=MOUZAKITIS&firstname=&city=&state=NY&zip=&btnsubmit.x=33&btnsubmit.y=3) No idea if it is the same guy though.

Still no response from AI to my one email Apex. D'ya want me to resend and BCC ya on it?

-Rav

[Ravendas]

Whoa! Slow down there bucko! They have similar names. No idea if it's the same guy. Good probablility, but no guarantee. Sheesh! Don't bug that guy unless you are 110% sure he has something to do with aicomputers.com. Like I noted before, artificial intelligence, inc. isn't even their real name! I'd wait for Apex to get us a solid contact number.

-Rav

[groebuck]

Wouldn't hurt to call the number and ask say "oh I'm sorry I am trying to reach AI COMPUTERS.." see what he says. I have the Maximum PC at home and his name and stuff is in there. I'll post that....

p.s. it's not like his name is John Smith....it can't be that common of a name :)

[Bidhere23]

BTW, I placed an order using my $5 AI Bucks and although the site says it usually ships within 2 business days that order status still says new. The order was placed last week and the cooling fan only cost $4.90. I wouldn't put any more of my money on the line.....

[Ravendas]

Wouldn't hurt to call the number and ask say "oh I'm sorry I am trying to reach AI COMPUTERS.." see what he says. I have the Maximum PC at home and his name and stuff is in there. I'll post that....

p.s. it's not like his name is John Smith....it can't be that common of a name :)
I agree, I just don't want to take sh1t for posting some poor dude's info on a board, especially if he's innocent. :D

My friend found this: BBB New York listing (http://www.bbbnewyork.org/businessreports/Default.aspx?id=73780) - check under Additional Business names

It's looking really bad for anyone hoping to get a computer out of this deal. Apex, any response from AI about any questions asked? Still no response to my emails.

-Rav

[update] None of those phone numbers work either :(

[MASTERPL]

That BBB site is bad news. Man I wish I would have seen that before I ordered. I should be getting my new card in the mail soon.

[Lyraic]

I just dont see why we can get a straight answer from this company. If we arent going to get the PC's we ordered just say so ....

I think the company rep needs to post here and speak up. I dont blame Apex for this mess... I have however learned from this..
If I am not going to get my PC I will order else where but I need to know. Period!

[Lodz]

I was looking through some old forums and it looks like AIPCS did the same thing a year ago. A few people said they ordered in May and didn't get anything by August. That's when many people tried to cancel and couldn't get their money back. We're going on 16 business days, and nobody has received a system yet. I'm just amazed that someone who was caught doing this once would try it again. Maybe he made enough money in the last attempt for it to be worth another go.

[blivius]

I was looking through some old forums and it looks like AIPCS did the same thing a year ago. A few people said they ordered in May and didn't get anything by August. That's when many people tried to cancel and couldn't get their money back. We're going on 16 business days, and nobody has received a system yet. I'm just amazed that someone who was caught doing this once would try it again. Maybe he made enough money in the last attempt for it to be worth another go.

post us a link dewd!

[Lodz]

Here's one of them from the resselratings forum. They mention some stuff about phones or systems being down. A lot of the stuff sounds similar to now (I beleive these were ordered in Sept-Oct)
http://www.resellerratings.com/forum/t79063.html

And I'll search for the Forum with the people who ordered in May when I get home. I just did a google search for aicomputers and looked through the pages for forums. But the one with the May orders also mentions that the phones were down and they couldn't get a hold of anyone. So this T1 upgrade is taking even longer than we thought.

[Marka]

Guys have you ever, and I do mean EVER dealt with a company that has done something like this? If you say yes, then you figure out what's best for you, but the rest of you guys have to come to your sences. No company does this, you will probably not get a system (those of you that keep waiting and hoping), in fact you'll probably have to go through the headaches of disputing/changing cards, etc...

[MASTERPL]

Or there never was a "t1 upgrade"
sounds like they are buying time.

[lmc]

Here's one of them from the resselratings forum. They mention some stuff about phones or systems being down. A lot of the stuff sounds similar to now (I beleive these were ordered in Sept-Oct)
http://www.resellerratings.com/forum/t79063.html


I think the people having problems with AIPCS in the thread you note here are related to the known financing company issue they had in the past. Its been brought up probably like 20 pages ago in this current thread, but the problems then were related to the financing company, not AIPCS. Which apparently is why they got a bad rap - they had a bad business partnership with a financing company that screwed them, which in turn led to them screwing their customers.

[beo]

Has anyone had any contact whatsoever via email or ICQ since last week? They seem to have gone silent.

[DarkFury]

Has anyone had any contact whatsoever via email or ICQ since last week? They seem to have gone silent.

FLATLINE!!! :eek: ---------------------------------

[Lodz]

I think the people having problems with AIPCS in the thread you note here are related to the known financing company issue they had in the past. Its been brought up probably like 20 pages ago in this current thread, but the problems then were related to the financing company, not AIPCS. Which apparently is why they got a bad rap - they had a bad business partnership with a financing company that screwed them, which in turn led to them screwing their customers.

So was the problem with the phone lines also the financing company? And were the orders that didn't ship also because of the financing company? And was this problem that happened on more than occasion all the fault of the financing company? Hmmm... Maybe the financing company is also responsible for the issues we're having now. Maybe we should be trying to contact them instead.

[pcguy]

Is anyone still hanging in on this deal?

[beo]

Is anyone still hanging in on this deal?
I sent cancellation emails Friday. I'm hanging around only to find out if they're actually going to cancel my order and refund my card.

[cmontyburns]

"Known financing problems?" Gee, it's hard to imagine how a company like this could have finance problems.

It's remarkable how much slack so many people are willing to give this company. Let's review.

1. Company has no published verifiable address.

2. Company has no working telephone number (reputable businesses live and die by connection to their customers, and would not go 24 hours, let alone weeks, with no phone)

3. Company doesn't respond to e-mail

4. Company has a history of complaints on ResellerRatings.com

5. Company was slammed by Maximum PC, a well-read tech magazine

6. Company has an "unsatisfactory" rating with the BBB -- which is no easy task -- and more than 100 complaints on file


I've been a fan of GotApex since the very early days, and have taken advantage of dozens of Gabe's deals. I've e-mailed directly with him from time to time. I certainly don't know him, but he strikes me as an exceptionally honest person.

That said -- and there is no "but" here -- I don't doubt that Gabe stood to profit from this deal, just as he does from almost all deals posted on his site. I would have liked to see more transparency about the nature of his commission. I'd also like to see him disclose the contact information he has, since he no doubt knows the name of the owner of this business. I doubt there are many more employees than 1. I believe he was misled (you have to believe that, unless you believe he was in on this scheme, which I don't). The prudent thing for him to do at this point, from a damage-control perspective, is to divulge all the information he has about this organization and distance himself from them as fast as possible.

I'll get out of the way now so that the sheep can continue toward the slaughterhouse. Keep watching those order stages!

[pcguy]

I think I'll give them a few more days, maybe till the end of the week but then I am cancelling if I don't receive anything. When I talked to him on ICQ he said 3 weeks. The end of this week will be that long, with a few days grace. I'd really like to see something positive on their end.......but it doesn't seem that this will happen.

[gremlin190]

I'm hanging in there with you PCGUY, if nothing happens by Friday then I'm going to cancel. This is getting ridiculous.

[Apex]

Haven't seen him on today. I'm still waiting. I'm almost finished with the emails (yes, all 734), but at this point, if I cannot get a hold of him, I'm not sure what's going on.

[Bidhere23]

Guys,
I know most online vendors are reputable but you may want to look into a credit card by MBNA. They let you dynamically create new credit card numbers with spending limits and time limits. I just went ahead and cancelled my credit card number so I didn't have to go through disputed the charges.

http://www.charleston.net/stories/080403/bus_04compute.shtml

[SteelheadBob]

Steve Miller - Take The Money And Run Lyrics
This here's a story about Billy Joe and Bobbie Sue
Two young lovers with nothin' better to do
Than sit around the house, get high, and watch the tube
And here is what happened when they decided to cut loose

They headed down to, ooh, old El Paso
That's where they ran into a great big hassle
Billy Joe shot a man while robbing his castle
Bobbie Sue took the money and run

Go on take the money and run
Go on take the money and run
Go on take the money and run
Go on take the money and run

Billy Mack is a detective down in Texas
You know he knows just exactly what the facts is
He ain't gonna let those two escape justice
He makes his livin' off of the people's taxes

Bobbie Sue, whoa, whoa, she slipped away
Billy Joe caught up to her the very next day
They got the money, hey
You know they got away
They headed down south and they're still running today
Singin' go on take the money and run
Go on take the money and run
Go on take the money and run
Go on take the money and run
Go on take the money and run
Go on take the money and run
Go on take the money and run
Go on take the money and run

[Porkfry]

I'm gonna hang in there mainly because I want to see what happens.

I just find all the stuff odd. Like if the AI guy reads this forum why not post something here. I mean, sure I could see him getting sideswiped by angry people wanting to know what's going on. But in the long run you'd think that it would be better for buisness to keep the customers not questioning your ethics.

If I was in their shoes I'd think the first thing I'd want to do is start really crankin out those PCs so that people start getting them and then we can hear some "good" news as to that $#!+ is actually moving. The rubber has to meet the road and they have to start putting the PCs out here real soon.

One thing I'd be interested in is if they have a sepperate group that is working on putting the PCs together. When I talked to the AI guy on ICQ last week I asked him how many people he had working for the company and he said 100. Now weather that's true or not I guess remains to be seen. You'd think however that there would be a way to reach the employees in the case of an emergency. I mean hell there's a possibility that one of the "100" employees reads this site. If that's the case then have one of them post here. Sure they don't have to put their name but seriously. If you guys from AI read this you should really speak up. Hell get your freakin phone fixed. Something.

In the end, I will say that if this is goes south it will seem really odd to me that they (AI) would do this in this manner and think its going to turn out good for them. I mean, you've got (lets just say) 3000+ people that could have taken advantage of this deal. That's 3000 really pissed off people. Can you say class action lawsuit?

[mrslyger]

and this isn't in defense of AI's buisness practices...but if they were out to rip everyone off...most of which after reading this thread..have used their credit cards why wouldn't they simply charge everyone immediately and then dissappear. At this point they are attempting to rip off everyones respective credit card company in which case most of us have fraud protection. That would be a lose lose battle for AI. You would think they would attempt, if they were trying to rip us off, to try and get say a cash advance now to expidite your order or something like that.

I've waited this out and followed this thread from day one. I too agree that i don't think Gabe is out to rip us off. I mean if he can't get in touch with them now either that puts him in the same boat as us. He's not making any money either if AI is ripping us off.

I don't know though it's all rather confusing. They replied to my emails initially but now like everyone else i don't get any response. I'm not even trying to flood them with emails. The email responses i did get from them were similar to the ICQ repsonses....one word etc giving no real information.

i would hope the deal works out but it doesn't look good at this point. I agree with what's been said....why wouldn't AI simply post in this forum, send a chain email to everyone explaining the situation, or in the least put up some text on their website. regardless of being flooded with orders emails etc that is absolutely no excuse to run a business in this manner...especially after all the AIPCS bad press. If they wanted to go legit or even post this deal in an attempt to rescue their name they should have at least limited the amount of orders to what they could handle.

I would hope/suggest if this is legit that they build some people their computers and email the others later in the list of orders some real information

[pcguy]

Guys,
I know most online vendors are reputable but you may want to look into a credit card by MBNA. They let you dynamically create new credit card numbers with spending limits and time limits. I just went ahead and cancelled my credit card number so I didn't have to go through disputed the charges.

http://www.charleston.net/stories/080403/bus_04compute.shtml

Damn. My card is mbna actually....I wish i had noticed that on the webaccess before I placed my order........def gonna be using that in the future.

[thaxi]

I too am waiting to see what happens. I still have a week before the charge actually comes on the credit card statement and then another 26 days before it becomes due. My CC company (First USA - United Mileage Plus) doesnt require me to pay disputed charges up-front so I am willing to wait and see if anything does really ship from AI....

Just out of curiosity, did anyone here choose the In-Home Installation option? :hmm:

Order # 404x

[J_money]

because Mr. AI is going to be at your front door step.....nine months from now to hook it up? Riiiiight.

[aznmoogle]

Hmmm...although I'm still in on the deal..waiting it out, I have time to cancel since my order # is a little higher than those in stage 3. I'm glad I used a virtual number from Citi so I can just cancel that and be done with it instead of having to get a new credit card. Just wanted to throw in some scenarios for fun...since there's nothing you can really do except wait since I dont have any solutions either.

The following is hypothetical ranting (so I'm bored *shrug*):

Ever hear of a Ponzi scheme? Most likely you have...actually i think someone brought this up to. It's basically similar to pyramid scheme...where you basically take money from people your current investors to pay off your old ones. Although, AI might not be running an exact ponzi...could be similar who knows?

They have one thing in common so far...in all ponzi schemes you have to have an unbelievably great deal that nobody would pass up...and you have to have it within a time frame to create a sense of urgency. Obviously most people will jump on the deal. So AI satisfies that part at least...heh, in other words when it's too good to be true...

Another thing similar to a ponzi scheme, is that these deals are meant to spread like wildfire through word of mouth, or in these cases, forums. Heh, who wouldn't want their friends and relatives to get in on such a deal.

The only difference, however, between AIComputers and a regular ponzi scheme, is that AIComputers is running a scheme through a business and needs to appear legit. Perhaps setting things up to show that the business has problems and is slow is a better way of taking in more money than if they charged everyone's credit cards and ran. At least this way they can still be in the public taking money from suckers and not have the FBI after them.

Or who knows, maybe everybody slowly moving to stage 3 is because they dont have 100 workers...most likely a few...or maybe even one...just that constantine fellow...who in reality may be just a white guy somewhere in LA running a website and accessing ICQ. Stage 3 could be moving outside the states and charging everyone as soon as they're out of the United States...I mean, where would you go with a large sum of money taken from thousands of people...anyone could run a website, check email, and go on ICQ from anywhere, since there does not appear to be a real physical address nor a phone # that they can be contacted by. Heh, that's the problem with the internet, you can be anyone you want to be and put up any charade. Doesn't it remind you of those identity theft commercials? Heh, Konstantinos is probably some fat white woman chilling in Barbados or something :eek3:

Anyways, just throwing out some stuff :puke:

Oh yah, I have some real questions for Gabe tho:

- Do you happen to know your contact's name at AI computers? If you've had a good lasting relationship with the person over the years...you'd at least know his name right?

- Mmm...did you ever address the issue on people's investigation on the physical address of AIComputers or the phone call to the person who said the FBI were investigating AI? I was just a little curious of what you thought about that.

[mrslyger]

that is the other downside with how AI is handling this whole deal. i can't imagine being a computer novice and in need of tech support. lol

of course needing tech support hinges on actually getting a computer.

that being said i hope AI gets it's act together at least for the people hanging in there.

It would be great if Gabe actually gets some usefull info out of them for once or in the least a cancellation and refund plan for all those who have ordered.

[billr]

and this isn't in defense of AI's buisness practices...but if they were out to rip everyone off...most of which after reading this thread..have used their credit cards why wouldn't they simply charge everyone immediately and then dissappear.

They wouldn't do this if they were using the volume of verifiable purchases in order to secure credit with banks and/or suppliers. The trick is in finding just the right number of credit cards to charge so that they don't tip their hand (to anyone that matters; banks and the law, not me or you)


At this point they are attempting to rip off everyones respective credit card company in which case most of us have fraud protection. That would be a lose lose battle for AI. You would think they would attempt, if they were trying to rip us off, to try and get say a cash advance now to expidite your order or something like that.

You have no idea that this is what they are doing. If they immediately charged everyone's card, the banks would get wind and shut them down. But if they charge just enough cards to buy quick parts, pay some immediate salaries, etc (basically everything but pay their obviously past-due phone bill), then they can make some claims about backorders and burn-in times and whatever until they get enough traction to build and ship a few systems.

It's my guess that if anyone does get a system shipped to them, it'll be a couple months from now at minimum. AI figures that a large percentage will cancel, but some percentage can be strung along enough so that they can make a small profit on parts which are three months from state of the art. And any time they take in delaying crediting a card is a free loan for them, so that's a bonus.

Or they could just be lying, thieving, criminal bastards. Occam's razor being what it is and all...

[mrslyger]

i was just trying to be pleasantly optimistic and i did read your post (or someone elses) earlier pointing out the same scenario.

I'm just crossing my fingers that Gabe will get us some decent info. If not i'll cancel.

The one thing i'm def worried about though is AI turning a profit simply selling our personal info.

:angry:

is that via this thread we've certainly given them plenty of ideas on how to go about ripping us off if they are indeed planning on doing that.

[beo]

I'm just crossing my fingers that Gabe will get us some decent info. If not i'll cancel.
That's just the problem, though. How can you cancel if they won't acknowledge it? I send cancellation last week, and still not a peep - nor has Mr. AI been on ICQ since before that, to my knowledge. Add to that the fact they already charged my card, and I'm in no better situation post-cancel than pre-cancel. CC company has been contacted, but still. I, like many others, am regretting the fact that I ever placed the order in the first place... :disa:

[lurch70]

Did anyone receive ANYTHING from AI in the last 3 weeks????

ANYTHING?

[k28la]

Did anyone receive ANYTHING from AI in the last 3 weeks????

ANYTHING?

Nupe

[tourbound]

Did anyone receive ANYTHING from AI in the last 3 weeks????

ANYTHING?

Since I placed the order, I emailed AI 4 times with questions. The 4th one I sent I cc'd Apex on it, and low and behold, I finally got an email from AI, but it didn't answer any questions that I had asked...go figure.

I also sent 3 cancellation emails in a 48 hour period early last week. The 3rd one I cc'd Apex on as well and he contacted them on my behalf.

I have talked to Mr. AI on ICQ a couple times as well. The last time was last week when I caught him online to tell him I wanted to cancel. He said he would take care of it, but it would take him until the end of the month to refund my CC. I said that wasn't acceptable and I wanted it done before my billing cycle was over. He said when is that? I said somewhere around the 23rd. He looked at his calendar and said he would process the refund on the 21st. I asked him why he needed 9 days to do a 2 minute transaction and he said they were very back-logged with emails and cancelations. I just quit trying to argue. I immediately called my CC company because I wanted to have all my ducks in a row for when the 21st rolls around. The last words from my CC company were: "If you don't get your money back, we will get it back for you". That is all I needed to hear.

[mrslyger]

that is the problem. however, i was assuming people posted orders with credit cards and they would be protected. i can't imagine a company trying to get away with massive credit card fraud on this scale when most who have ordered have at least contacted their CC company to give them a heads up. i really do feel bad for the non tech savy people who have place order(s) and don't have a clue that they might be being ripped off.

all one can hope is AI will make things right in the end cancellation or not. at this point i doubt that but one can only hope that in these times there are at least some honest small buisnesses out there.

i know AIPCS ripped people off prior but all were apparently due to a finance company. recent actions by AI the supposed new company really don't help the argument that they are now legit. hell if they are just swamped at least attempt to enlist people such as those on this board to help out. i mean even at this point i wouldn't have a problem typing up a simple email to joe smoe on their behalf explaining what's going on. it wouldn't take any longer then this post.

it's just unfortunate that things went down this road so to speak.

it's nice to have a venue to vent but through all our venting nothing has changed. that fact just sux. at least in general companies will listen to disgruntled customers and try and make changes. in the least you would think they would have learned from past misstakes.

i am one who ordered even after reading about the AIPCS debacle trusting a gotapex.com link. i don't think Gabe is involved nor am i accusing him of a darn thing. it would just be nice to get some info.

thanks for the help Gabe...i think as most people know you could have simply just shut up and dissappeared through all this. :cheers:

[bullethead]

I just ordered 10 more systems for overnight express mail from AI.
I sent a envelope full of $100's.
Weird though they asked that I mail it to Indonisia.


LOL

Im still hanging in there with my 2 machines I ordered. Im checking this post less and less often since I know it will read much the same day to week until it just dies

[Underclocked]

If it has cost me nothing else aside from aggravation, the deal did cost me a credit card account that I had long ago committed to memory. :)

[J_money]

I wonder if Mr. AI works for anyone else?
SAS? Delta Force?
He's pretty mysterious...maybe he could tell us, but then would have to kill us.
And the whole ICQ thing just "adds to the mystique."

[groebuck]

face it kids they ain't coming. My guess is they needed a certain amount of cash for something - ran the bogus deal to generate the sales, charge just enough credit cards to pay off what ever debt they needed the money for then pass off some phony story about T1 lines, downed phone systems and 30 day building and testing procedures...they were buying time slowly charging more people to buy the stuff they needed to fufill the first orders they already charged for and hoped they would catch up in the end.

They ain't no 100 employee "we build 500 systems a day" shop. They are AIPCS revisited a rinky dink shop that pulled the wool over everyone's eyes. Come on - look at what they did, established a relationship with Gabe to post "little" deals on his site. Zalman heatsinks for what 10 bucks off? They meet those orders no sweat and then whammo show up with a 50% off coupon+200 off and a free GIG of ram??? WHo the hell would not do it??? Like I said it before I failed to follow my own rule - if it looks like sh*t and smells like sh*t...it's sh*t.

So.... CANCEL YOUR ORDERS - if you sit and wait in limbo - then you show no attempt of tyring to stop them from charging your card which makes it that much harder to dispute it with your credit card company...

P.S. think about it - if they had that many people working for them don't you think one..just one of them would post??? I would bet my right one it's a family operation/scam....

[MASTERPL]

I 'm with Groebuck. I pulled out of this scam a few days ago, and boy am I feeling better. I would run to this thread day in and day out praying for a glimmer of hope. All I got was Bull****. Ai is a ****ing scam. They will get what they deserve.

[Flattoe]

As previously noted, I cancelled my order with AIComputers on Saturday night and went on newegg.com and ordered the parts that I wanted to build my own system. The parts shipped yesterday and I received them today. I have built my system and it works like a champ. It cost me about $300 more than the deal that AIComputers was offering. While $300 is a substantial amount of money for me, the piece of mind is priceless. I got what I ordered less than 2 days later. It is amazing what a reputable company can accomplish on your behalf--------

[dizzytrain]

"50% off coupon+200 off and a free GIG of ram??? WHo the hell would not do it??? "


And dont forget about the DELUXE carrying case , made of unicorn leather no doubt

[groebuck]

no it was spun from gold wasn't it?

those who were charged speak up!!! so we know how much they fleeced us for and #2 FILE FRAUD charges - there is a web site link in this thread somewhere - file charges call the NY STATE DA's office, the local farmington news station..do something man!!! make em pay!!!

[bradpitt]

no it was spun from gold wasn't it?

those who were charged speak up!!! so we know how much they fleeced us for and #2 FILE FRAUD charges - there is a web site link in this thread somewhere - file charges call the NY STATE DA's office, the local farmington news station..do something man!!! make em pay!!!

provide links and everything make it easier for us to do it... so many more people will do it :) cause i'm too lazy to search it up ... i know you said the link is somewhere but ahhhh :( sorry to be a lazy bum but thats who i am


oh yes .. step by step instructions are good too :)
(maybe even diagrams! LOL)

[groebuck]

http://www.fraud.org/

http://www.ftc.gov/

Newsroom general: 516-393-1242 News 12 Long Island

http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/bcp.htm

http://www.co.nassau.ny.us/

Here - go get em folks

[phlick]

So how are you supposed to cancel if you can't see your order details??

I'm out too, I forsee the website going offline because the hosting bills aren't paid and then darkness and confusion befalling everyone. Call me paranoid.

PS Order 524X, had to be one of the last ones in.

After reading thru the 900 +odd posts here... and a LONG time Apex reader here's what's confusing me...

Why isn't Apex telling everyone to bail out on this? He still has not come out and said get out while you can, it's pretty obvious from all the evidence that's been uncovered that there are not going to be any computers going out.


Good luck to all whos CC got charged, guess I'll have to contact my CC co to see what hoops I have to jump thru to ensure that they can't/don't charge my card.

No Deal Here. :disa:

[tourbound]

I got charged at stage 3 on Friday, May 7th. The amount was exactly the amount shown on my order confirmation email. I am supposed to get my refund along with an email to prove the refund was processed this Friday, the 21st. This will only be 9 days since I cancelled...thats not to long for a 2 minute refund transaction is it? :rolleyes:

If they don't give me the refund, my bank is on my side. I will be sure to not only dispute the charge but also file a fraud claim against AI. My bank is Bank of America, so I feel very confident that not only will I get my money back, but that they will be on the case to get their money as well. I only hope they will keep me in the loop on what they find out. I would love to help bring them down.

[YourEvilTwinBrothe]

I bailed. If ANYONE would have received a PC by now - I would have just ridden it out -

I AM one of those MBNA customers that uses ShopSafe so i knew my exposure was limited - i e-shop with careless abandon becuase of it - but this was too much.

I will send an email response requesting a cancel - but whatever - the card number they have is dead , it isnt going anywhere.

sad to say i think Groebuck is right , i think we at the hands of Apex got duped.

[pcguy]

just glad I've got a credit card to back me up....notified them of a possible need to dispute a charge....

also, I was just looking at the error again. What I'm pretty sure that means is that they just rewrote the code not to show anyone's orders with discounts in it(doesn't look for it in the database request). They probably also deleted the discount column as well.

[Burzhui]

can everyone just please stop posting bull****, post usefull information only. So far the only info is comming from Gabe and a couple of other members.

[tourbound]

can everyone just please stop posting bull****, post usefull information only. So far the only info is comming from Gabe and a couple of other members.

The "rear" Admiral has spoken :rolleyes:

[Marka]

Burzhui cheb tebe ne zatknutsa. Vsu dorogu ti odnu huinu nesesh na ludei kotorie zdes pishut. Ne nravitsa ne chitai.

By the way the whole financing co story is bogus. The guy who was approving people for finance at AIPCS was on the board of directors/management at AIPCS. So the financing co wasn't even dealing with the customers since he was the one telling them they were approved and then telling them that it would take longer to build and etc..I'm talking Lambros Ballas or whatever his name is.

[faither]

The "rear" Admiral has spoken :rolleyes:
Burz has a point (and it's not just the one on the top of his head).

With so much crap posted here, you've got to wade through scores of posts each day to find the one or two that actually contain any useful information (usually from Gabe). The rest are just "the townspeople lighting the torches" and looking for someone to string up.

This thread has become neff central.





btw...Still haven't cancelled my order.

[groebuck]

Gee that's not condescending - there is no info. What little Gabe gets is the same crap we keep hearing over and over..

T1 upgrade so their phones don't work
Phone system failed, new one on order
They are not AIPCS and that was just a financail misunderstanding ...

Now, even Gabe is not hearing back from them and the only people to communicate with anyone there is through ICQ and even that is no longer happening.

You want useful information - here - CANCEL YOUR ORDER ASAP, this is a scam. They have your credit card number and can legally charge $XXXX.XX dollars to it and keep it for a minimum of 30 days, longer if they dispute your dispute.

I don't mind being a townsperson, but I don't want to string anyone up. I want those who commit crimes held accountable for their actions. I want to warn those who may not know this is going on to beware. This is a forum and posting is what it is for.

[compulsivebuyer]

http://www.techimo.com/forum/showthread.php?t=79063&page=9&pp=20

http://www.geocities.com/noaipcs/

good luck everyone.

[Marka]

Haven't seen him on today. I'm still waiting. I'm almost finished with the emails (yes, all 734), but at this point, if I cannot get a hold of him, I'm not sure what's going on.

You want real input? Here's your real input, straight from Gabe. As to people using this post to whine, b*tch and moan, great. At least they have a "peaceful" way of venting about the problem that this has created for them. I consider myself lucky, all I lost was a week's worth of time, and am now getting a new credit card that I have to retie to all the various things like Speedpass. There are others here who will have to do more than that, like filling out paperwork, wasting time on phone calls to their financial institutions, etc...So the least all of you "serious information seekers" can do is have the empathy to leave those that want to vent alone. If you don't like their posts don't read them, if they are vulgar or obsene report them, other than that leave them the f**k alone.

[Burzhui]

Burzhui cheb tebe ne zatknutsa. Vsu dorogu ti odnu huinu nesesh na ludei kotorie zdes pishut. Ne nravitsa ne chitai.

By the way the whole financing co story is bogus. The guy who was approving people for finance at AIPCS was on the board of directors/management at AIPCS. So the financing co wasn't even dealing with the customers since he was the one telling them they were approved and then telling them that it would take longer to build and etc..I'm talking Lambros Ballas or whatever his name is.


If you want to speak russian , PM me have some respect for people who don't understand the language.

[dizzytrain]

All you admirals and captains out there, Your web space may have been invaded by a company out to scam you, your friends and your guests. If you cant protect your web space, then you dont deserve it. The towns people have taken to pitchforks cause the cavalry has been in retreat, in denial or at least hiding since day one.
Everyone here should keep posting, or atleast keep visiting this thread, we may need to contact each other via private message, and exchange info and experiences in case they do dispute our dispute.
Apex, You should draw a line with this company, send them an e-mail stating that if they do not reply with meaningful answers to your questions, that you will then advise your viewers to cancel their orders. This is the only thing left to do if they are not even speaking with you

Oh well unlike the people at ai computers i am actually excpected to go to work, when i get home and visit this forum again i hope to see some of that monkey wrath dished out AIPC"S way

[groebuck]

Useful information regarding AICOMPUTERS - for those of you who don't get MaximumPC -

In their Doghouse report - In there investigation of AIPCS, they found that AICOMPUTERS was telling them the same story they told Gabe re: financing. They contacted Constantine Mouzakitis. He told them that AIPCS was nothing more than a reseller run by former AIPCS employees. He blamed the AIPCS problems on a "major data loss," and that he and Lambros Ballas (the "facility supervisor") were paying through the nose to make things right with former AIPCS customers. What he could not explain was in the application they completed to run advertising in MaximumPC, it states the company name as APICS Systems as DBA (doing business as) Artificial Intelligence. When asked to supply the name of the owner of AIPCS, Mouzakitis declined.

[Jax67]

can everyone just please stop posting bull****, post usefull information only. So far the only info is comming from Gabe and a couple of other members.

The only useful information I've seen so far are the comments for people to change their credit card numbers. Forget cancelling the order. Not to be rude, but I haven't seen one piece of useful information from Gabe and especially AI. If you want to read only useful information, I would suggest the thread closed; because you're not going to see it.

[mrslyger]

if they aren't legit and are trying to rip us all off, as it seems, then we've certainly given them a ton of ideas on how to go about that in this forum...if they didn't know them already.

[purpleD]

Hi All,

I'm a lurker on this and other deal boards. I just have to say I feel bad for those involved here. I try not to buy computer equipment I don't need (or else I'd be broke from all the great deals on all these sites), but if I was looking to buy a PC when I read about this I'd be screwed with the rest of you.

I feel really bad that Apex is getting used. I was ripped off in an auction once and the key for a good scam artist is to keep you talking, so you wonder whats going on as long as possible before you try to abort. And by then its too late. These people at AI haven't talked to anyone by putting out the illusion they are constantly talking to you through Apex. Think about it: they are sorta keeping everyone satisified to questioning yet at the same time have no official statements about what state anyone's order is in. You can't even say "they promised to ship in xx days", because it was Apex who said that and even he's not sure what he's saying, he's just the messenger.

Now, certainly everyone here isn't Gordon Gecko, but greed is what fuels a con artist. There is greed from people buying and greed from Apex to get the commission. Anyone who's been ripped off before knows how great it felt to think they were getting a product for a spectacular deal before things went sour. You just gotta remember, if its too good to be true, then it probably is.

Oh and in the end noone should really get hurt after all the CC charges get reversed. I was stupid enough to send a cashier's check for nothing back when ebay was just starting out, and I lost my money for good.

[ThinkBling]

What could AI possibly gain from this? Wouldn't they find themselves in an even bigger mess if they charged credit cards and gave nothing?

Can somebody please explain the credit card process from a merchant's stand point? How do funds end up in a bank account after a charge is run?

It is very difficult to see anybody getting away with this.

[bradpitt]

What could AI possibly gain from this? Wouldn't they find themselves in an even bigger mess if they charged credit cards and gave nothing?

Can somebody please explain the credit card process from a merchant's stand point? How do funds end up in a bank account after a charge is run?

It is very difficult to see anybody getting away with this.

like people said before.... they could be using all the orders to get a loan or something from a credit company and run off with that money.... i guess

[Porkfry]

Seriously you guys, I think we're really focusing too much on the "bad" things that have been going on when we need to really think about the things that AI Computers brings to the table. All of which I believe are clearly illustrated in this flash movie (http://www.aicomputers.com/flash.html).

[Apex]

Apex, You should draw a line with this company, send them an e-mail stating that if they do not reply with meaningful answers to your questions, that you will then advise your viewers to cancel their orders. This is the only thing left to do if they are not even speaking with you


The line is drawn. I will post something by close of tomorrow.

[MASTERPL]

Please people don't flood Gabe with emails.

That was my first instict, tell me now i thought.

Let's just wait it out. Thanks for the update, and all your hard work.

[Comet]

With all the gloom and doom I've read in this Forum, I can't believe that there are that many people still left holding onto this deal (but I'm one of them still in with two orders).

I look forward to reading Gabe's advice post tomorrow.

[cmontyburns]

Apex:

What is the name of your contact at AI Computers?

[J_money]

Well....the wrath of the monkey's got my vote. Whatever Gabe says man.

[FireMan2103]

So.....will someone please post the best way (if there is one), to cancel an order. I'm afraid, I just don't feel like waiting any longer for something that probably won't happen. :angry:

Still waiting to get my credit card statement....to see if I've been billed.

Thanks to anyone that responds. :)

[Marka]

The only way to cancell that everyone has posted so far (and I used) has beet to send AI an e-mail, and to CC it to Gabe at [email protected]
I think you should put cancell and order number in the subject

[aggieSlaughter]

If you're goin to cancel, cancel. If not, then wait it out. Don't go throwing blame at any of the people that run this board, especially Apex. They're all working very hard to keep all of you happy. This was a YMMV deal from the start. There were doubts form the beginning if this was going to go through.

I think everyone needs to take a chill pill and let Apex work his magic. He'll let you guys know what's up tomorrow, 'nuff said.

AggieSlaughter

[dizzytrain]

The line has been drawn...

good luck Apex, hope you get some kind of closure on this deal one way or the other

[Foxdog]

Is anyone else in this situationa? AI has a pending transaction with my MBNA card. They have reserved the credit on my acccount for their use, but haven't actually taken the money out. I was told since they haven't taken the loot, I can't claim the fraud yet, however I have no way to cancel their right to the $1063, even if I cancel the card. (After 30 days I can remove their hold.) I don't wnat to move on buying a new rig until this part is settled.

Apex & Crew, you do a wonderful job. I hope no one tries to blame you that AI is such a crap, non-company.

[Marka]

Cancelling the card should null and void all transactions that are pending on it. Try calling your bank again, sometimes different people there tell you different things.

[degeester]

Thanks, Marka and Apex. I did as Marka suggested by e-mailing and cc Apex. Apex sent me a e-mail right away stating he was forwarding the e-mail request to his contact. Hope the order is cancelled.

[kimchicowboy]

apex is so cool. i love ya man. sorry, i just felt like saying that. hahaha.

[Bidhere23]

Cancelling a credit card will not null and void pending transations.

[cmontyburns]

This was a YMMV deal from the start? I didn't see any disclaimer like that on the front page at GotApex.com -- just a pitch about the awesome deal. I don't think there was a link to this discussion.

[faither]

If anyone's interested, they're still offering $200 off plus free shipping.

I'm going to hold off ordering another until I see the quality on my pending order.
















:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:




btw...I'm still in. But hey, I'm crazy like that!

[Marka]

According to Citibank that was the only thing I could do to prevent AI from charging my card. It could be different for different banks, I just threw in my 5 cents. You have to figgure it out with your banks/CCs.

[Arhant]

Thanks, Marka and Apex. I did as Marka suggested by e-mailing and cc Apex. Apex sent me a e-mail right away stating he was forwarding the e-mail request to his contact. Hope the order is cancelled.

I did the same. I got a prompt response from Apex but no response from AI. I can still log in and see my order in the NEW status. I cancelled last week! The problem will be finding a pulse at AI. I'm a 50XX order so maybe they will be out of business before they get that high on the list.
While I was logged in on the AI website, I changed all of the information on my personal account. I hoped that this would make AI unable to process the card, since the name and address don't match. I may end up cancelling the card as well.

[cyber_nicco]

Cancelling the card should null and void all transactions that are pending on it. Try calling your bank again, sometimes different people there tell you different things.


My CC company told me the same thing (this was as I cancelled my card. They said they can put a hold in, without actually charging the card. What's worse, is that my CC company couldn't tell me if a hold had been placed due to a billing cycle thing. I will probably push harder to find out, but I have no assurance at this point.

[pcguy]

Cancelling a credit card will not null and void pending transations.

But you don't have to actually pay for pending transactions on your bill tho right? Just checking for clarification....

[toecheese]

I cc'd Apex and canceled my order five days ago. Gabe responded, but I'm still in a 'new' state at AI.

:boxing:

[SteelheadBob]

First off most credit Card Companys now provide you with online access to your account. I know Citibank and Discover both do and Capital did have it. You still get paper statements and can make regular payments it just shows you your cards activity. Beware though it does not show holds or who placed the holds. Gas stations are the biggest holdees(sp?) in the US. If you do pay at the pump they usually put a 100 bucks on hold and even if you only pump 10 they will charge you for the 10 but the hold will stay untill the next billing cycle. This way they make sure you have enough and get prior approval before pumping.I found out the hard way on vacation about 4 years ago I had over 2200 in holds and only around 500 in gas charges.Even if you don't want online access, if you call the card issuer and ask they will tell you all activity and pending holds. Ask for the cards fraud department and give them a heads up they might start flagging AI charges and at least you tried to warn them.Save copies and print out all emails to AI and your CC company you may need them down the line. Good Luck

[saboism]

I have sent a Cancellation email to AI on the 5/13, I then forwarded my email to [email protected]

As of yet, I have received no reply from either AI or Apex. No communication from anyone whatsoever.

I've been patient, and only sent Apex 1 email. Perhaps it was overlooked? I would certainly appreciate a response if only to know that someone somewhere besides myself knows I attempted to cancel this order. And I've seen numerous posts regarding being caught up with emails.

Did I use the correct address for Apex?

[tourbound]

I have sent a Cancellation email to AI on the 5/13, I then forwarded my email to [email protected]

As of yet, I have received no reply from either AI or Apex. No communication from anyone whatsoever.

I've been patient, and only sent Apex 1 email. Perhaps it was overlooked? I would certainly appreciate a response if only to know that someone somewhere besides myself knows I attempted to cancel this order. And I've seen numerous posts regarding being caught up with emails.

Did I use the correct address for Apex?

Yes, you used the correct address. You can bet that your email wasn't overlooked. He barely has time to read all the email he gets, much less respond to everyone. I'm sure he passed it on to AI on your behalf.

[beo]

Apex:

What is the name of your contact at AI Computers?
He told me his name was "Puddintame," and that if I asked him again, he would tell me the same.

[the greatest]

i purchased several systems from AI computers during their 1/2 off sale. 4 of the 8 (the most expensive 4) that i purchased moved to "level 3" around May 14th, the remaining have stayed "new". my credit card was charged for the purchases of the 4 that are in "level 3". a few weeks ago you could go to their website and review your orders, now if you try there is an error...

Error Diagnostic Information
An error occurred while evaluating the expression:
discount = ORDER_DETAILS.discount
Error near line 341, column 7.

i purchased the zalmen CPU fan when it was on sale several months ago and received it in a timly fashion, these computers on the other hand...

i like everyone else tried to call but only got the busy signal, i tried to email but received no response. what is going on at AI computers i don't know but it seems like they may be working on the orders, it is just taking forever (maybe they only work once a week and are in court the other 4 days?)

if i get the computers (soon) and they are what i paid for i will be happy but it seems only time will tell.

has anyone else been upgraded to level 3,4 or 5?

[Marka]

Have you read the other posts?

[cmontyburns]

Have you read the other posts?

I'm going to guess that no, he hasn't read the past 950 posts. :)

[faither]

He told me his name was "Puddintame," and that if I asked him again, he would tell me the same.
Is that a Little Rascals reference????

[Porkfry]

I wonder if we're going to hear about how they had a fatal system crash in their department and that's what made it so they couldn't respond to mail or get on ICQ, or maybe it was something dealing with the "T1" line and that messed up things....SOOOO this translates out to them not being able to ship the systems out for another month or so, or process canceled orders.

I will say this has to be the weirdest thing that's ever happened to me when it comes to shopping on line.

In the beginning when replies from AI Computers were few and far between I really chalked it up to them being swamped with the orders. I had no reason not to believe that the reason their phone line was down was because they were upgrading, I had no reason not to believe that they were just up to their eyeballs in orders and whatnot.

Things are different now and its frustrating as hell. I'm really glad that Gabe has been doing all he can.

[DarkFury]

Is that a Little Rascals reference????
I think it's been around alot longer than them as well... :D

[Gidget]

Does anyone think that there is even the slightest chance that the computers will actually be shipped?
I'm one of those 'Drama Queen meets Nancy Drew' types which probably explains why I am still part of this nasty little mess. If I cancel now I might miss out on some real action so I'll stick with it a little while longer.
My order number was 37XX and they sent me an email letting me know that my computer supposedly hit stage 3 on May 10. I have not heard a peep out of them since that date.
Does anyone have ANY hope?

[pcguy]

anxiously awaiting G|A's post tonight

[beo]

Does anyone think that there is even the slightest chance that the computers will actually be shipped?
I'm one of those 'Drama Queen meets Nancy Drew' types which probably explains why I am still part of this nasty little mess. If I cancel now I might miss out on some real action so I'll stick with it a little while longer.
My order number was 37XX and they sent me an email letting me know that my computer supposedly hit stage 3 on May 10. I have not heard a peep out of them since that date.
Does anyone have ANY hope?
No.

[tourbound]

Well, tomorrow will be the day that AI will decide its fate, as far as I can take things anyway. I am supposed to have my refund processed and an email from MR AI tomorrow with a copy of the refund.

If I don't get the email from him and my bank doesn't show a pending credit by either late tomorrow afternoon or early Monday morning, I will begin my case for fraud.

I know I will get my money back, I just hope AI does the right thing and doesn't make me file a case with my bank.

Mr AI, I know you read the forum, so I urge you to process my refund tomorrow.

[Gidget]

"The line is drawn. I will post something by close of tomorrow."
__________________

The suspense is killing me! What time is closing time?

[pcguy]

9pm EST.......hopefully he'll post something before midnight :-\

[quantumburnz]

Yes... I'm hoping to hear what Apex has to say as well.

[Apex]

http://www.aicomputers.com

No further orders will be fulfilled. Warranties on received systems are valid (they were prepaid) through the 3rd party company on your warranty cards. AI is closed and done for. All charged cards will be credited back to your card. My personal suggestion would be to contact your credit card company to let them know NOW. This will mark the date of the start of the paper trail for your credit card company, which is important.

All employees were summoned to a meeting and let go TODAY, with no prior warning.

Again, I sincerely apologize I was not able to compel them fulfill the orders. In the last 9 months, we posted smaller deals for them, slowly building up to bigger deals, just to make sure they were legit. They fulfilled all of those orders properly (we kept an eye on threads about this, as well as kept email logs), so we felt it was safe to post this deal. Unfortunately, they were unable to meet their financial obligations this time.

[Gidget]

I'm assuming that no news is NOT good news in this situation!

[xuru]

Apex: If they haven't already charged my CC, do I still have to cancel the card? Or are they unable to charge cards now?

I know. My better half tells me it would be better to do so anyway, but still...

[dcbly]

Let's get a rope and head to NY, I'm sure we can find a tree!

[moetop]

Go to their main page. Please excuse any typos. It says..

------------------------
"As of May 1st, 2004 aicomputers is no longer able to accept new orders for computers, accessories or other items at this time.

We thank all our old customers for their orders and warranties will be valid with original equipment manufactures completely. If you had placed an order the end of April or May it cannot unfortunately be filled at this time, and we are very sorry.

If you have any questions, please contact the ICQ # 240057870 All items,equipment, hardware and url are curently for sale."
------------------------

I know you people are going to think me crazy, but

Apex - Is there a list of stuff for sale? E-bay maybe?

Moe or less it's Over,
Moetop

[DarkFury]

Now hopefully everyone can conclude their business on this...

Dayuuum... you go from selling a bunch of PCs to having to sell everything including the URL to your website. :2far:

All I can say is... DAYUUUM. Hopefully nobody will have any further problems with their CCs and other payment methods.

[Apex]

Apex: If they haven't already charged my CC, do I still have to cancel the card? Or are they unable to charge cards now?

No, you shouldn't need to cancel the CC. Remember, all CC have fraud protection. However, if it makes you feel comfortable, contact your CC and ask them about it. They will be able to give you the best advice for your specific card.




Apex - Is there a list of stuff for sale? E-bay maybe?

No clue on this issue, sorry.

[gremlin190]

Happy that it's over sadden by the fact I didn't get my new computer. Guess I will wait till socket 939 comes out :(

[tourbound]

http://www.aicomputers.com

All charged cards will be credited back to your card.

Apex,

Did they give you a time frame on when they would be issuing refunds? Mr. AI was supposed to refund me tomorrow, will that still be the case?

[Cubsfan]

Anyone else find it funny that clicking on that big notice on the front page takes you to a page to order a system? :) On second thought, nobody probably finds anything funny in this thread!

[Apex]

Apex,

Did they give you a time frame on when they would be issuing refunds? Mr. AI was supposed to refund me tomorrow, will that still be the case?

They told me immediately.

[tourbound]

They told me immediately.

I sure hope so.

Thanks for all your work Apex

[dizzytrain]

Thanks for the closure Apex,
Interesting that on the site it says as of may 1st they wont take new orders but they charged my card may 6th.
Oh well hope they credit my card back before i receive the dispute forms. Anyhow this thread was a very helpful resource

[Gidget]

Call me crazy but I'm curious as to why this all happened to begin with. Was this just one giant scheme? Are they still hoping that perhaps a small percentage of people will 'forget' that they ordered a computer that never showed up and wont think to question their bill?

As soon as someone gets their card credited back please post. I have a suspicion that 'immediately' on AI terms probably translates to 'as soon as you report it as fraud to your credit card companies and they do all the work and snatch the money from us.'

I think maybe changing CC numbers would be wise considering that this all seems as if it was premeditated and not some innocent little 'we got in over our heads' type of deal.

Thanks Apex for giving us the news and for all of your hard work.

[beo]

Happy that it's over sadden by the fact I didn't get my new computer. Guess I will wait till socket 939 comes out :(
Exactly.

ICQ conversation with "Eddie":
-------------------------------------------------
Eddie (10:26 PM) :

Hello, How may I assist you ?

Hinge Swift (10:27 PM) :

hi, are you with AI?

Eddie (10:27 PM) :

I am a representative, Yes.

Hinge Swift (10:27 PM) :

do you know when my credit card will be credited back?

Eddie (10:30 PM) :

I don't have access to that information, Sir.

Hinge Swift (10:30 PM) :

i can't imagine anyone asking you about anything else at this point

Eddie (10:31 PM) :

The company is closed, and items are up for sale, that is why they set this up.

Hinge Swift (10:31 PM) :

i see

Eddie (10:32 PM) :

However, I believe they are finalizing all issues over this weekend, and if your card was charged, it will be credited this weekend....

Hinge Swift (10:32 PM) :

Good to know. Thx for the nfo
-------------------------------

Ahem... anyone want to buy "aicomputers.com" and try to run a business on that domain? WAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

Once again Gabe, you are a gentleman and a scholar. Thanks for all the fantastic assistance, and I hope you get sleep soon. Bless you!

[bullethead]

wow that was a surprise.
who would have imagened?

So all you old school guys that told us newbie to shut it and ride the storm, stick it.

Im done here after manayear believing this page and the back up form the big guys I have zero faith now.

This is the reason New Egg is the people choice. 9 times out of ten they are the cheapest. And that 10th time who cares I saved money 9 other times and got my crap on day 2.

Delete my AI account and delete my apex account.

[groebuck]

Financing issues - hmm sounds a lot like AIPCS .... 10 bucks says they appear as another company in a few months.

[shorty16399]

AI Computers has closed up. The website says orders filed at the end of april and may won't be filled. This sucks. I was order number 3690 and my order never moved from "NEW." I guess lucky for me that my credit card never got charged. Good luck to all of the people who had there credit cards charged. I hope you get your money back.

[Burzhui]

wow that was a surprise.
who would have imagened?

So all you old school guys that told us newbie to shut it and ride the storm, stick it.

Im done here after manayear believing this page and the back up form the big guys I have zero faith now.

This is the reason New Egg is the people choice. 9 times out of ten they are the cheapest. And that 10th time who cares I saved money 9 other times and got my crap on day 2.

Delete my AI account and delete my apex account.

you are braindead, the reason why we said" "yo shut the hell up" was because it was annoying to read through pages and pages of you people bitching and moaning... you placed an order, if it comes through great, if it doesn't cut your losses and move on... don't whine like a little bitch :rolleyes:

[lurch70]

Thanks for this closure ... but unlike GWB I am not going to announce the end of the war until all is settled with everyones CC.

Hope Gabe did not spend his commission money ahead of time :)

[dizzytrain]

but unlike GWB I am not going to announce the end of the war until all is settled with everyones CC.

nor will i

[psaux]

Thanks for all your hard work, Gabe|Apex. :) I have a nasty hunch that were it not for your efforts not only would AI have made off with our money (Though they still might try...), but that of many others as well. Speaking for the other silent suckers, thanks.

[dRu168]

Oh well didn't work. It was worth a try. Good lesson, now time to call credit card company and order a new card, mine is two years old so it's about time anyways. =P

[Burzhui]

Ok the site has been taken offline
http://www.aicomputers.com
This site is for sale. The functionality is for sale.

Serious inquiries only please ICQ # 240057870



This deal is offcially dead :)

[AirVapor]

Hate to say it, but.... I TOLD YOU SO!

http://www.gotapex.com/forums/showthread.php?p=670873#post670873

I realize that there really wasn't any way to be 100% that people were going to get shafted, but all the warning signs were there. A 50% off coupon should have been a huge red flag. Unless you are making a transaction in person, where you can physically receive and inspect your merchandise, you should be very wary of these type of deals.

Apex and his crew post many deals on this page, most from very reputable and trustworthy companies that you can be sure will come through for you. However, there are certain instances when a deal they post is too good to be true. That was definitely the case this time. It seems like this company was trying to liquidate their inventory and maybe even sucker some people that may be too lazy or unmotivated to raise hell to get their cash back.

So, if you were one of those "suckers", I would suggest that you fight to get back every last penny from AI. Don't settle on partial repayment and don't take the STORE CREDIT. This is NOT an acceptable business practice and you should be p'd off that you got f'd in the a. And, if you lose some or all of your payment, then let this be a lesson to you.

[Grubbie]

you are braindead, the reason why we said" "yo shut the hell up" was because it was annoying to read through pages and pages of you people bitching and moaning... you placed an order, if it comes through great, if it doesn't cut your losses and move on... don't whine like a little bitch :rolleyes:

Exactly, look bullethead, we said hold out and wait and see what happens. The deal died and everybody should get their money back easy as that. Not every deal on the site is 100%, **** people have had MANY deals cancelled when morons start ordering multiple items to kill the deal. Other times people have had to wait over 2 months for their product to finally arrive.

Nobody should lose any money in this, you can wait a week and see if you get the credit back to your card. If not you call up your bank and dispute the charge file out the paperwork and you are fine, no reason why you shouldn't get your money back.

People just getting all pissy and uptight over something, you took a shot and you missed, move on.

[Sgt_Friday]

long time lurker, first time poster. I ordered two systems from AI (with the 50%) coupon, after a week, I canceled the order, and my CC, so I feel fairly safe I won't have to dispute a charge (although there is still that authorization hold thing to worry about).

Anyway, I began to be curious about how many orders were in stage-3 or even shipped. So I asked the AI web server and here is what I found out...

Since 4/27

1154 orders
1047 - New
92 - Stage-3
7 - Declined
6 - old
1 - pending
and ... 1 shipped

before 4/27

1069 orders
742 - shipped
158 - pending
153 - old
8 - new
7 - declined
1 - stage-3

[bradpitt]

lol nice sgt friday! :)

[pcguy]

i wish someone of us had been smart and saved a copy of their website (ie the non-honor message) so that they can't try and charge anything to anyone

[Porkfry]

I saved this (http://www.aicomputers.com/flash.html)!

If they still have the flash movie up I think there's still hope!

I'm in stage 3!!!!

[dizzytrain]

Hate to say it, but.... I TOLD YOU SO!

wish you had,
i also wish i had read your post before jumping on this deal, if i knew more about these guys and their past i would have had nothing to do with them. i just took for granted that this company was legit, and then came to this forum after it was clear they were not. just goes to show, take things for granted and end up being taken granted of.
If our cards get charged back it will be no big deal,
if not then these guys should be made an example of, lest every fraud on the net target this site and others like it.

[bradpitt]

i wish someone of us had been smart and saved a copy of their website (ie the non-honor message) so that they can't try and charge anything to anyone

where is it? cause all the pages still work! all but the front page

http://www.aicomputers.com/info.cfm

[teleken]

Here's another link to the "closing doors" announcement:

http://www.aicomputers.com/news.cfm?NID=32&NR=0&view=1

I'm calling my bank this morning just so they're aware. If my account isn't credited back by close of business Monday, I'll start the dispute process.

[Cubsfan]

where is it? cause all the pages still work! all but the front page

http://www.aicomputers.com/info.cfm

For a historical perspective:
http://web.archive.org/web/*/www.aicomputers.com

Check this one out! :) http://web.archive.org/web/20000620122101/http://aicomputers.com/


Or for their other name:
http://web.archive.org/web/*/www.aipcs.com

[Underclocked]

I've a distinct feeling the company will "reappear" almost immediately with a slightly different name. And, if I had a pending charge or hold on a CC account, I would contact my card company and show/direct them to the closing announcement. That should be enough to convince anyone that any hold or charge is invalid.

And I wouldn't wait.