S: Reeeligion

[Mike_N_Ike]

God this is frustrating :(

I can't even type I'm so upset. I know that good things have come from religion. I just...l;kjaeesaklstjcgcnastca g

Sigh. It's taken the most important thing in my life away from me. I hate it.

I hate it.

[oblongmelon]

wanna elaborate a bit on this?

[zenbooty]

God this is frustrating :(

I can't even type I'm so upset. I know that good things have come from religion. I just...l;kjaeesaklstjcgcnastca g

Sigh. It's taken the most important thing in my life away from me. I hate it.

I hate it.Catholic schoolgirl won't give it up, eh? :hihi:
I hear you, man.

[Maarchk]

God this is frustrating :(

I can't even type I'm so upset. I know that good things have come from religion. I just...l;kjaeesaklstjcgcnastca g

Sigh. It's taken the most important thing in my life away from me. I hate it.

I hate it.

My guess is it took away a girl who couldn't be with a non(fill in the religion here). Or something to that affect. I had a friend who got broken up with in college cause he was Jewish and she was Christian and the school christian group put pressure on her and made her break up with him for no reason other then they were of different religions. Very sad.

[attgig]

don't go crazy dude...many fish in the sea. i thought like that when i was with -then was without my girlfriend way back when. looking back on it now...:shrug: yeah, it may seem like i'm trivializing something important in your life, but just trying to throw a different perspective into it.

[Mike_N_Ike]

It's just making being with somebody impossible. I'm not really any particular religion myself and I don't mind that she is. Hell, she could sacrifice goats for all I care. She doesn't really mind that I'm not either, because I try really hard not to get in the way or her faith.

It's just everything else. It's a lot more complicated than I can probably explain. There are a lot of other people involved and it's run into a breaking point. It's making me hate the entire idea - I feel like I'm only seeing the bad sides of it.

[Jihforce]

Let me take a stab at this...You and girl are cool with each other, however, her folks & family (and/or her close friends) have a problem with you not being of the same religion?

[exigent_chick]

I IM'd you this morning because you sounded really messed up. I thought you had to deal with female castration or something.

Stay Strong.

[Mike_N_Ike]

Let me take a stab at this...You and girl are cool with each other, however, her folks & family (and/or her close friends) have a problem with you not being of the same religion?
Yeah that's pretty much it. I thought it would be easier to deal with but lately it's just about hit a breaking point.

[caribiner23]

Sorry to hear it. We're pitching for you...

[brainsmile]

well maybe you should not take the approach of she can be of whatever religion it doesn't matter to me. Have you learned all you can about why it is important to her and her family?

[nickel]

it's prejudice in my opinion for family/friends to dislike your choice in girlfriend due to religion. i have a friend dating a guy from India. his parents have said they will disown him if he marries her and have nothing to do with the grandchildren from this marriage.
how can this be right?

[Jihforce]

Yeah that's pretty much it. I thought it would be easier to deal with but lately it's just about hit a breaking point.

I'm sorry to hear that. I can sort of relate because my cousin when thru the same thing and I spoke with him for endless hours about it. I think that as long as you can keep your girl from being "brainwashed", you'll be ok. She also needs to be proactive about keep those people in their place too.
Religion is a tough subject tho, many people's lives revolve around it and in most cases, it defines who they are. But hang in there, nothing worthwhile is easy. :)


it's prejudice in my opinion for family/friends to dislike your choice in girlfriend due to religion. i have a friend dating a guy from India. his parents have said they will disown him if he marries her and have nothing to do with the grandchildren from this marriage.
how can this be right?
They justify it because its tradition. But they won't disown him if his parents love him. I think this runs deeper than tradition. I hear that in India, it is customary for the bride's family to give endowments to the grooms family. We're talking tons of stuff/money there. And I'm guessing your friend isn't India nor does she follow that tradition.

[cheapie]

religion usually DOES define who you are if you are serious about it. a christian and non-christian should not hook up. both for pragmatic and religious reasons.

[Mike_N_Ike]

Thanks for the support guys. We're both trying really hard to work through this now. If I'm being vague, it's because I'd rather this didn't get back to certain people. I guess I could have chosen a better title - I'm not trying to say that all religion is terrible - it's just interfering with my life right now in a way that I don't feel is necessary.


religion usually DOES define who you are if you are serious about it. a christian and non-christian should not hook up. both for pragmatic and religious reasons.
What bothers me is that my girlfriend and I both understand our respective views and differences, and respect them. We made the choice to be together knowing this. It's this "join us, or stay away from us" attitude that I get from other people who I don't feel my religion should matter to, that is frustrating the hell out of me.

[cheapie]

how could you be with someone for the rest of your life and think that they are incorrect in a major part of their life? in the event your gf is a christian, she is directly going against the Bible if she hooks up with a non-christian.

you are with someone you think has a false way of looking at life. and she is with someone that, according to her prescribed beliefs, is off-limits.

[Mike_N_Ike]

how could you be with someone for the rest of your life and think that they are incorrect in a major part of their life? in the event your gf is a christian, she is directly going against the Bible if she hooks up with a non-christian.

you are with someone you think has a false way of looking at life. and she is with someone that, according to her prescribed beliefs, is off-limits.
I don't intend to find somebody who agrees with me on every part of life left open to interpretation. There are thousands of things that people can choose to believe or not believe. The whole question of why we are here, is something that I think a lot of people are compelled to search for answers to. I'm one of them. I'm not going to hold it against her that she's arrived at a different explanation than I have. I realize that a lot of religions' doctrines include having a closed mind when it comes to other peoples ideas on the matter, but I believe that we can learn a lot from each other.

I really can't answer the other part becuase I can't speak for my girlfriend.

[Cantacuzene]

in the event your gf is a christian, she is directly going against the Bible if she hooks up with a non-christian.


I'm calling BS on that. There were plenty of cases in the early church when a pagan roman had a christian wife or a christian husband. Heck, St. Helena was married to the tetrarch Constantius and he was a pagan. Granted, their kid turned out all right, but thats neither here nor there.

[Jihforce]

how could you be with someone for the rest of your life and think that they are incorrect in a major part of their life? in the event your gf is a christian, she is directly going against the Bible if she hooks up with a non-christian.

you are with someone you think has a false way of looking at life. and she is with someone that, according to her prescribed beliefs, is off-limits.

Man that's pretty harsh. How is this any different from any other form of discrimination?

[cheapie]

I don't intend to find somebody who agrees with me on every part of life left open to interpretation. There are thousands of things that people can choose to believe or not believe. The whole question of why we are here, is something that I think a lot of people are compelled to search for answers to. I'm one of them. I'm not going to hold it against her that she's arrived at a different explanation than I have. I realize that a lot of religions' doctrines include having a closed mind when it comes to other peoples ideas on the matter, but I believe that we can learn a lot from each other.

I really can't answer the other part becuase I can't speak for my girlfriend.

first, i love how people call having a conviction about something "having a closed mind"

second, if she is a christian, she likely goes to church, prays, reads the bible, etc. it's not just a matter of having arrived at a different conclusions to questions that don't really relate to your everyday life. being a christian goes much deeper. how you raise your kids, pay your taxes, respond to people cutting you off in traffic, etc. are all items that are influenced by your religion.





I'm calling BS on that. There were plenty of cases in the early church when a pagan roman had a christian wife or a christian husband. Heck, St. Helena was married to the tetrarch Constantius and he was a pagan. Granted, their kid turned out all right, but thats neither here nor there.

i'm calling pull your head out of your.....books. wth does constantius have to do with what M_N_I's gf's Bible says?

now go away http://sc.groups.msn.com/tn/D7/70/MontyPythonforfansPepperpots/2/5.jpg


Man that's pretty harsh. How is this any different from any other form of discrimination?


discrimination? well, gee. are your civil rights being violated by my not wanting to marry a non-christian? the bible didn't say don't hire, promote, talk to, work with, feed, take care of, etc. non-christians. lower your hackles and think about it.

[Mike_N_Ike]

first, i love how people call having a conviction about something "having a closed mind"
Semantics I suppose. Positive or negative connotation - but they're effectively the same thing.


second, if she is a christian, she likely goes to church, prays, reads the bible, etc. it's not just a matter of having arrived at a different conclusions to questions that don't really relate to your everyday life. being a christian goes much deeper. how you raise your kids, pay your taxes, respond to people cutting you off in traffic, etc. are all items that are influenced by your religion.
I disagree. It is your outlook on life which determines how you're going to live it. Being a Christian can alter your outlook on life in a positve way to make you deal with all of those situations in a constructive way, but so can a lot of other things.

[Jihforce]

discrimination? well, gee. are your civil rights being violated by my not wanting to marry a non-christian? the bible didn't say don't hire, promote, talk to, work with, feed, take care of, etc. non-christians. lower your hackles and think about it.
RELAX Cheapie, its just a question. I'm not attacking you. My impression is that what you stated was pretty harsh. Discrimination goes beyond just your civil liberties. I can't tell you what exactly the bible says in regards to this because quite frankly, I never got past the 2nd page. However, you seem to be saying that christians and non-christians shouldn't be together because your religion discourages that or should I say "its off-limits"....Am I right? I'd like to know how is that any different that my folks telling me to marry asian women only? Or staying within your culture, etc...? I'd like to think more factors than just "religion" play part in the compatibility of two people.

As you probably know, I'm buddhist, my wife is mormon and not only that, she's caucasian. That isn't exactly the most desirable matchup according to the bible then or according to my cultural background. (Keep in mind that her folks are pretty "hardcore", her dad for example reads the bible recreationally for crying out loud) But we still make it work because we decided that family stands above anything else. That is why I started the thread about "religion vs family". I don't think that decision makes her any less devoted to her religion or any less of a christian either. I honestly think M_n_I and his gf can make it work if they stick to that. If they focus on each other instead of the buzzing sounds around them, good things can happen.

[nickel]

love conquers all
call it a cliche, but i think true love is a powerful thing that can overcome many obstacles, and can blend many differences.

[cheapie]

Semantics I suppose. Positive or negative connotation - but they're effectively the same thing.


I disagree. It is your outlook on life which determines how you're going to live it. Being a Christian can alter your outlook on life in a positve way to make you deal with all of those situations in a constructive way, but so can a lot of other things.



but no offense, this is exactly the kind of thing you will encounter. christians believe that the Bible is a manual, not something to refer to in order to enhance your life. if you gf believes that and you don't, it could be messy :shrug:


RELAX Cheapie, its just a question. I'm not attacking you. My impression is that what you stated was pretty harsh. Discrimination goes beyond just your civil liberties. I can't tell you what exactly the bible says in regards to this because quite frankly, I never got past the 2nd page. However, you seem to be saying that christians and non-christians shouldn't be together because your religion discourages that or should I say "its off-limits"....Am I right? I'd like to know how is that any different that my folks telling me to marry asian women only? Or staying within your culture, etc...? I'd like to think more factors than just "religion" play part in the compatibility of two people.

As you probably know, I'm buddhist, my wife is mormon and not only that, she's caucasian. That isn't exactly the most desirable matchup according to the bible then or according to my cultural background. (Keep in mind that her folks are pretty "hardcore", her dad for example reads the bible recreationally for crying out loud) But we still make it work because we decided that family stands above anything else. That is why I started the thread about "religion vs family". I don't think that decision makes her any less devoted to her religion or any less of a christian either. I honestly think M_n_I and his gf can make it work if they stick to that. If they focus on each other instead of the buzzing sounds around them, good things can happen.


where does discrimination and preferance part ways? if MNI's gf is a christian, she has to disobey the bible to be with him. it's not just a matter of a little disagreement of opinion. if his mojo is so strong she's willing to disregard that part of scripture, :shrug:

don't worry, i have tons of non-christian friends. prolly more than christian ones.

[nickel]

if his mojo is so strong she's willing to disregard that part of scripture, :shrug:

why ya gotta be bringing mojo into this? :P

[zenbooty]

but no offense, this is exactly the kind of thing you will encounter. christians believe that the Bible is a manual, not something to refer to in order to enhance your life. if you gf believes that and you don't, it could be messy.Not all Christians believe this, and I'll leave it at that.

[Jihforce]

where does discrimination and preferance part ways? if MNI's gf is a christian, she has to disobey the bible to be with him. it's not just a matter of a little disagreement of opinion. if his mojo is so strong she's willing to disregard that part of scripture, :shrug:

don't worry, i have tons of non-christian friends. prolly more than christian ones.

I think that's a very complex question. There isn't really a clean cut way to separate the too without someone disagreeing. In MNI's case, i don't think there's anything wrong with her "prefering" to be with him instead of a "christian" man. Which why i think the people that are causing all of these problems should be a bit more supportive instead of being so negative.

[caribiner23]

Each of you is making complete sense.

The issue here is that MNI and his gf are in agreement, but the others in their lives (presumably her life) are causing the hassles:


What bothers me is that my girlfriend and I both understand our respective views and differences, and respect them. We made the choice to be together knowing this. It's this "join us, or stay away from us" attitude that I get from other people who I don't feel my religion should matter to, that is frustrating the hell out of me. It's all about a level of conviction. I've known Christians and Jews who practice within the letter of their religion and others who choose a more liberal stance. How they live their lives is up to them, and how it affects their personal relationships should be dealt with within the context of their relationship (bravo, Jihforce).

I was married to a Jewish girl for 15 years. I was raised Catholic. Neither of us practiced our religions because we had personal issues with the traditions in which we were raised. We had an agreement between us that we would respect the other's position, which despite our dissatisfaction with the religions still influenced how we were raised. We didn't interfere with each other's spirituality, although some family members and friends on both sides pressured us in various levels of intensity. (Her family's rabbi-- or the one who would be their rabbi if they were practicing-- went so far as to tell her parents that we shouldn't be together at all.) We stuck together through it all.

Now, to Cheapie's point, I've found myself out of the marriage for almost 5 years, and I am now involved with someone who shares my views (and more importantly, perspective) on spirituality and I can tell you that this is far more satisfying than this aspect of my marriage ever was.

The key here is that MNI and his gf need to determine together if they're willing to cling to each other through this, or decide to split if the outside pressure is too much.

And Nickel, you've the heart of a freaking poet. :)

[nickel]

And Nickel, you've the heart of a freaking poet. :)
i am a poet! heart and soul :)

[YaYo]

it's prejudice in my opinion for family/friends to dislike your choice in girlfriend due to religion. i have a friend dating a guy from India. his parents have said they will disown him if he marries her and have nothing to do with the grandchildren from this marriage.
how can this be right?

I concur. Its riduculous! Humanity sucks.....