Terrorist Attacks in London [Archive] - HP Deals, Computer Coupons And Bargains

Butch

07-07-2005, 03:08 AM

Initial thoughts are that it is electrical, but not ruling out terrorism . . .

Several Explosions in London
Cause Injuries on Subways, Buses

A WALL STREET JOURNAL ONLINE NEWS ROUNDUP
July 7, 2005 5:57 a.m.

LONDON – Several blasts went off on the London subway and on several buses Thursday, police said, injuring some people and prompting officials to shut down the entire underground network a day after London was awarded the 2012 Olympics and as the G-8 summit was getting under way in Scotland.

Initial reports blamed a power surge, but officials weren't ruling out an intentional attack.

The Metropolitan Police said that there had been explosions on at least three London buses. The police confirmed an explosion on a bus in Tavistock Place in Central London.

The BBC reported an eyewitness as saying there had been one fatality on a double-decker bus.

Police said incidents were reported at the Aldgate station near the Liverpool Street railway terminal, Edgware Road and King's Cross in north London, Old Street in the financial district and Russell Square in central London, near the British Museum.

London Ambulance Service said several vehicles had been dispatched to the area near Liverpool Street station.

Citing unconfirmed reports, LBC News radio said seven people were killed in a blast at London's Aldgate underground station. LBC News also said "a couple" of fatalities had been reported at Edgeware Road station, but couldn't confirm the information. The radio station didn't provide any further details.

"We believe there was some sort of explosion. There are some walking wounded at Aldgate," said a spokesman for City of London police, speaking on condition of anonymity.

"We are not sure of the scale of the incident. Reports are still coming in."

Several Tube stations were closed following the incident, including the busy King's Cross station in north London.

Bradley Anderson, a Tube passenger, told Sky News that "there was some kind of explosion or something" as his train reached the Edgware Road station in northeast London.

"Everything went black and we collided into some kind of oncoming train," Anderson said.

Office workers near the Aldgate underground station felt the blast, and some buildings have now been evacuated and an exclusion zone thrown around the station.

Witnesses saw people covered in blood and soot walking out of the station.

Phil Swan, who was traveling in the first carriage of a train at Aldgate station, said he heard a bang which blew the glass out of the train, blacked out the lights and filled it with smoke.

One plain-clothes police officer at the scene said that police believed a blast could have been triggered by an electrical explosion.

Write to the Online Journal's editors at [email protected]

sbp

07-07-2005, 04:30 AM

Tony Blair was on TV and confirmed it was terrorism.

Another Madrid. Screw you terrorist bastards.

My heartfelt sympathies go out to the victims and the families of the dead.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4659093.stm

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050707/ap_on_re_eu/britain_explosion

Half a dozen explosions rocked the London subway and tore open a packed double-decker bus during the morning rush hour Thursday. The blasts killed at least two people and injured scores in what a shaken Prime Minister
Tony Blair said was a series of "barbaric" terrorist attacks.

Blair said it was clear the attacks were designed to coincide with the opening of the G-8 summit in Gleneagles, Scotland. The prime minister said the meeting of world leaders would continue but that he would return to London.

"Whatever they do, it is our determination that they will never succeed in destroying what we hold dear in this country and in other civilized nations throughout the world," Blair said a day after London was awarded the 2012 Olympics.

Bloodied and bandaged witnesses reported panicked crowds fleeing the blast sites. A witness at the bus explosion said the entire top deck of the bus was destroyed.

nickel

07-07-2005, 05:42 AM

isn't IrishSS there now?

Merlin

07-07-2005, 05:59 AM

Minute-by-minute account

Thursday, July 7, 2005 Posted: 1246 GMT (2046 HKT)

Manage Alerts | What Is This? (CNN) -- Below is a minute-by-minute timeline of the multiple explosions rocking London. All times are British Standard Time.

13:22 p.m. Police say a bomb on a train at Edgware Road underground exploded as a second train was passing and hit both trains.

12:53 Britain's Home Secretary Charles Clarke tells the House of Commons there were four explosions in central London and the underground system will be closed all day. They would decide later in day whether to resume bus services. Earlier six attacks were reported.

12:51 Emergency services personnel tells CNN writer William Chamberlain that all survivors had been evacuated from Kings Cross station, leaving the dead below ground "in the double digits."

12:35 Scotland Yard revises the number of blasts down to four, three in the underground system and one on a bus. These are: Russell Square and Kings Cross Underground, Moorgate, Aldgate and Liverpool Street Underground, Edgware Road station and Tavistock Square where there was an explosion on a bus.

12:27 Police and hospital officials tell Reuters that a total of 185 people are wounded across London, 10 of them seriously and seven critically.

12:00: British Prime Minister Tony Blair says the "barbaric" London blasts are terrorist attacks and were designed to coincide with the G8 summit in Scotland. He will return to London.

11:35 a.m.: London police chief tells Reuters news agency there are "indications of explosives" at one of the blast sites.

11:15 Police say there were at least six explosions in London.

11:15 European Union commissioner for justice and security affairs Franco Frattini tells reporters in Rome that the blasts in London are terrorist attacks.

11:10 Police say they have reports of two deaths and nine injuries at Aldgate East subway station.

11:07 All bus services have been suspended in London, news agencies report.

10:47 Home Secretary Charles Clarke says multiple London blasts cause "terrible injuries."

10:46 Police report serious casualties in London explosions, but no deaths confirmed, The Associated Press reports.

10:46 Witness to Britain's Sky News says second blast heard in Russell Square.

10:45 Police sources say a bomb is suspected in London bus explosion, AP reports.

10:33 Police confirm at least three explosions on buses in central London, according to AP.

10:25 Police confirm explosion on bus in central London in the area around Russell Square.

10:24 Scotland Yard says "multiple explosions" rock London.

10:14 News agencies report a bus has exploded in central London.

10:02 Scotland Yard says it is dealing with a "major incident."

09:53 Metronet says the entire London subway network has been shut down, news agencies report.

Police says incidents are reported at the Aldgate station near the Liverpool Street railway terminal, Edgware Road and King's Cross in north London, Old Street in the financial district and Russell Square in central London, near the British Museum.

09:41 London Underground reports a second explosion at a subway station in northwest London.

09:33 Witnesses say London Underground told them services are suspended after "power surge."

09:27 Metronet, the subway maintenance company, says power surge has caused explosion in London tube station.

09:25 Police say "there are walking wounded" in London's financial district.

09:15 British Transport Police tell news agencies an explosion has struck London's financial district in the area near Liverpool railway station.

cheapie

07-07-2005, 06:05 AM

hopefully they will find the bastards responsible and make examples out of them!

ski

07-07-2005, 06:29 AM

Heh, my friend just went to London on Saturday. I hope he stayed out of trouble...

my first reaction was "Who bombs London?" What the f*ck point are you trying to make? Effin' get a job or something, I swear.

Butch

07-07-2005, 06:39 AM

CNN.com is reporting as Breaking News that there are at least 40 dead . . .

Merlin

07-07-2005, 06:41 AM

hopefully they will find the bastards responsible and make examples out of them!
At least one of them was a suicde bomber so it may not be possible to "catch" them.

mcs328

07-07-2005, 06:47 AM

That's terrible turn of events. 2012 Olympics the day before and terrorism the day after.

bricheese

07-07-2005, 06:57 AM

AHH! im watching the news so sad they better catch them
is is the same group who did 9/11????
wow thats so sad watcing those injured people talk to the camera

ski

07-07-2005, 07:19 AM

Read this on FARK, /agreed

"I don't know if any Islamic extremists read Fark, but if so, let me say just this. Blowing up innocent people will never achieve what you desire. In fact, killing civilians will just piss off your enemies more. You will do nothing more than strengthen the resolve of the people you desire to hurt. You will not crush England, you will not crush America. Look at the histories of both countries. This type of animal activity never works. But please feel free to blow yourselves up somre more. Pretty soon you will run out of idiots who don't mind killing babies for "God", and your leaders will be hunted down, and hanged for the warmongers that they are.

/that's it. Have a terrible day."

Merlin

07-07-2005, 07:46 AM

is is the same group who did 9/11????
al Queda's Europe cell claimed responsibility.

jstreet

07-07-2005, 07:52 AM

I had no idea why there were so many police on and around the subway today. My heart goes out to London's people.

Burzhui

07-07-2005, 08:08 AM

definatelly sucks, howeer i'm not sure how many of you noticed, but bombs go off in london, it's on eery channel. Bombs go off in israel it's a 30 second mention on the 10 o'clock news

jstreet

07-07-2005, 08:11 AM

definatelly sucks, howeer i'm not sure how many of you noticed, but bombs go off in london, it's on eery channel. Bombs go off in israel it's a 30 second mention on the 10 o'clock news

There are also other differences between London and Israel apart from bombing frequency.

LegendKiller

07-07-2005, 08:36 AM

definatelly sucks, howeer i'm not sure how many of you noticed, but bombs go off in london, it's on eery channel. Bombs go off in israel it's a 30 second mention on the 10 o'clock news

I fail to see the point you are making. It isn't often that *FOUR* bombs go off in Israel at the same time. Moreoever, it is usually just a madman with a bomb strapped to his body in the market, not a timed and calculated attack in the subway system. The london bombing has a pretty high casualty rate also.

Burzhui

07-07-2005, 08:41 AM

Gothic Girl

07-07-2005, 08:42 AM

isn't IrishSS there now?
OMG I think you're right. Geez I hope he's ok.

ArkiStan

07-07-2005, 09:40 AM

They're reporting over 300 or injured.....

Yossarian

07-07-2005, 09:54 AM

I fail to see the point you are making. It isn't often that *FOUR* bombs go off in Israel at the same time. Moreoever, it is usually just a madman with a bomb strapped to his body in the market, not a timed and calculated attack in the subway system. The london bombing has a pretty high casualty rate also.

if i understand him correctly, hes saying why should this attack get so much press, when everyday there are bombs going off in israel and other countries, that aren't as close as allies as england. are they any less devastating? why should a bombing in england get round the clock coverage, when an attack in isreal gets a 30 second spot on the late news, whihc has a decidedly smaller viewr base?

kimchicowboy

07-07-2005, 10:11 AM

rip their balls off!

ski

07-07-2005, 10:56 AM

I'll go out on a limb and say that England is our motherland. Had America been founded by Israelis, I'm sure we'd be more near and dear with press coverage.

Lolita

07-07-2005, 11:02 AM

I'll go out on a limb and say that England is our motherland. Had America been founded by Israelis, I'm sure we'd be more near and dear with press coverage.

Does anyone still think of England as the motherland? :hmm:

cheapie

07-07-2005, 11:04 AM

plus they are about as good of friends as we have politically right now. if canada had been hit i'm guessing the response would be close.

but since israel gets nailed all of the time i guess familiarity breeds contempt.

zenbooty

07-07-2005, 11:19 AM

Does anyone still think of England as the motherland? :hmm:
This is the US, not Russia or Germany. We don't have a "Motherland," just a nation.

Oh, wait, we have a "Homeland" now. I forgot. Credit the fascists in Washington for that one.

cheapie

07-07-2005, 11:22 AM

credit the facist for making us like the communists? :heh:

zenbooty

07-07-2005, 11:22 AM

Israel seems to get nailed every other week for the past 15 years or so. No one notices it anymore because its become par for the course. Now London, on the other hand, hasn't seen a major bombing in some time.

Also, while Tel Aviv is a popular vacation spot for many, it along with other Israeli cities are primarily just that, ISRAELI CITIES. London is an international metropolis like NYC and Paris. Its impact therefore is felt worldwide.

credit the facist for making us like the communists? :heh:
The USSR was more like a communist/fscist two headed monster. On a macro level the country was communist, but its leadership from what I can see was more akin to a fascist regime in terms of structure, dynamics, and strategy of rulership. In a true communist country there would be no such thing as a Josef Stalin.

Kevster

07-07-2005, 11:30 AM

Does anyone still think of England as the motherland? :hmm:

Since I am a dual citizen with both the US and Ireland, I definitely don't think of England as the motherland. In the historical sense I have plenty of other thoughts about England that I won't repeat here.

All that aside, I have many friends in England and find the English people these days to be very friendly and great to work with. I have many coworkers in London (I now work for British Telecom) and when I heard about this last night I was immediately in communication with one of them to make sure they were alright and that everything was ok. I have been there quite a bit over the last 6 years and know London rather well. My heart goes out to the now 37 people killed and their families, as well as the 700+ that were injured in this barbaric act. They will definitely be in my prayers.

cheapie

07-07-2005, 11:32 AM

The USSR was more like a communist/fscist two headed monster. On a macro level the country was communist, but its leadership from what I can see was more akin to a fascist regime in terms of structure, dynamics, and strategy of rulership. In a true communist country there would be no such thing as a Josef Stalin.

i know. i just found it amusing. :cool:

ski

07-07-2005, 11:38 AM

Does anyone still think of England as the motherland? :hmm:
I'm referring to the fact that we have a lot in common, not to mention our founders came from there. I think more people in America can relate/know more of England than they do Israel.

:shrug:

tupacboy

07-07-2005, 11:48 AM

i wonder if they waited to see who got selected for the olympics first before attacking.... just seems their timing is crazy...

LegendKiller

07-07-2005, 12:13 PM

i wonder if they waited to see who got selected for the olympics first before attacking.... just seems their timing is crazy...

I highly doubt it. An attack like this takes months of planning which is not subject to variables like that right before initiation. Although it might be linked to G8.

ufcrusher

07-07-2005, 12:48 PM

Quite simply Buruzhis point is that the news media has taken steps to make Israel/israelis look like the bad guys and minimize the bad press about what the palestinians/islamic fundamentalist do.

A woman who had been treated at an israeli hospital and healed/helped for a while decides that she cannot live with herself and straps pounds of explosives to her waist on her way to the hospital. Fortunately, the guards/soldiers noticed this and stopped the woman from actually bombing the hospital but it got a 30 second mention on the news. Palestinians hit buses, nightclubs, and other high pedestrian traffic areas with suicide bombers/car bombs and it gets the same 30 second mention. A palestinain teenager who is using sling shots to throw rocks at soldiers gets hit with a rubber bullet gardners a 2 minute or more story. Amazingly the papers fail to mention that the kid was using a sling shot and just says that he was playing soccer and then after being harassed threw a stone at the soldiers who then shot him.

I'm sorry but the news media in the US has become so one sided its sickening. Even when they know the facts they hide them. They try to minimize anything showing the harm/danger/damage to innocents that the palestinians/terrorists are causing.

Yet, a few bombs go off in London and its as though the world stopped. For the record, there have been multiple orchestrated attacks in Israel on different buses, buildings, and other locations in the past. If memory serves it received a bit more mention....maybe a few minutes, but part of that was addressing the upswing in terrorist activity and what steps should be taken.

For those who say well attacks in England are rare vs. attacks in Israel being somewhat common, does that diminish the attrocity? Not in my mind. Has it become acceptable to you that there are so many attacks in Israel? If so, why? And might I say think very carefully and check any source you use before saying something without merit.

In no way am I saying that this event wasnt news worthy......I am just pointing out that the news machine has an agenda and is very suseptible to manipulation. It hides facts in an attempt to make things more sensational (boy shot by soldiers vs. Boy shooting rocks with slingshot at soldiers is shot with rubber bullet) They also seem to fail to mention things such as "a rock from a fully cocked slingshot can easily kill a man or inflict other grevious bodily injury." Those of us who have shot buckshot/rocks/paintballs from a slingshot know the power they yield. I have buried objects in wood fences and trees easily with one.

I am going to drop this before this thread goes from news to political, but that was the point.

Yossarian

07-07-2005, 01:06 PM

ya know, if i actually thought out my responses, they'd be strikingly familiar to UFC's... :fro:

zippyjuan

07-07-2005, 01:06 PM

ufcrusher

07-07-2005, 01:32 PM

We are acustomed to hearing about violence in the Isreali-Palestinian conflict so barely notice it. When people read such stories, most do not pay any attention to who the violence is by/towards. Just another event that happens almost every day. We are not used to such violence in London so it is more shocking there. The UK is seen as more peaceful and civilized while Israel and Palestine are viewed as more violent. This is why it is news. There is no comarison between the two.

Actually there is ALOT of attention drawn to who the "violence" is by/towards in the israeli/palestinian conflict and the majority of the time is painted to look like its the big bad israeli against the little innocent palestinian who is "only trying to get back what is his" or"just wants a homeland of their own". Just because you feel like you have become desenstized to it doesnt make it so there should be no comparison.

An act of terrorism is an act of terrorism. Your view that well terrorism has happened here more frequently is a cop out. One could easily point to the IRA bombings and other acts to show that its nothing new. (Which as many observers have pointed out have all but ceased since America's war on terror was declared)

Similarly, one could say in the wake of World Trade bombing 1, 9/11 and Oklahoma City, which are 3 individual acts of terrorism on US soil that its becoming more common here as well.

Yes, 3 acts vs. 100's acts are very different, but the point is still valid...at what point do you stop thinking that terrorism is not terrorism?

In my mind, a violent act against civilians which results in the death or injury of non-combatants without warning or being in an actual ongoing conflicts war zone (I.e. - Two opposing fronts fighting each other) is terrorism, plain and simple. Its killing for killing sake just to get across your political ideology (hopefully, they have one and arent just killing to kill for no reason) and mentally attack your opponents. There is no difference if it takes place in San Diego, San Francisco, San Antonio, Sanibel Island, NY, Philly, Baltimore, NJ*, London, Paris, Berlin, Graz, Tikrit, Tel Aviv, Beuna Aires, etc. (* I guess wiping out Jersey could be an act of cleansing, but I am sure they would see it differently)

DarkFury

07-07-2005, 02:00 PM

jstreet

07-07-2005, 02:13 PM

We are acustomed to hearing about violence in the Isreali-Palestinian conflict so barely notice it. When people read such stories, most do not pay any attention to who the violence is by/towards. Just another event that happens almost every day. We are not used to such violence in London so it is more shocking there. The UK is seen as more peaceful and civilized while Israel and Palestine are viewed as more violent. This is why it is news. There is no comarison between the two.This gets my vote. I personally don't know enough about the Israeli/Palestinian conflict to even come close to being able to make a value judgement on who is right or wrong or what. I just know there's always violence there and that religion is part of it, which feeds my already stunningly large level of intolerance of religion.

The media knows this. We don't get a play-by-play on what happened in Iraq today (at least on the front page) because the media knows it's not "big news". Same with Israel and Palestine. It's not "big news" to the media and to the American public because it's the same news as yesterday.

Yesterday wasn't the same as today in London. This makes it "newsworthy" in the media's eyes because it's different. I would hazard a guess that a lot more Americans can identify with the English than they can with Israelis or Palestinians. That makes it newsworthy in Americans' eyes.

People need to stop thinking about the media like it's some benevolent public service that always does the right thing and is here just because they think it's important we all know what is going on all the time. They want cash, clear and simple.

Is this right? Is this good?

"Why is a Kuhndunese life worth less to me than an American life?"
-President Bartlet

President Barlet is a fictional president and Kuhndu is a fictional middle eastern country, but the answer that is given is: "I don't know sir. But it is."

No one wants to be the one to say it, but to your average American, an Israeli/Palestinian life is worth less than a British or an American life. I'd bet mine on it.

bachviet

07-07-2005, 02:55 PM

My prayers are with the victims and their families.

Hopefully they could catch these b@stards and castrate them. :mad:

ufcrusher

07-07-2005, 02:59 PM

Devils Advocate coming out for purpose of insane illustration, THESE ARE NOT MY BELIEFS:
So if a homosexual was beaten to death or drawn and quartered every day in the US it would not be newsworthy anymore? It would be happening all the time, same from one day to the next. To the majority of Americans and around the world a homosexuals life isnt worth the breath it draws.

In fact, these people believe that homosexuals are going against g-d and should be wiped off the face of the planet. In their minds they have no purpose, cant reproduce, and obvioulsy go against the great plan of life. Its why they are carefully making sure that they have no protections left in the country. (Cant marry, trying to throw out domestic partnership laws, some agencies wont let them adopt) In fact, once they are dead they are going to hell anyway!

So according to what was said before, since most Americans could care less about it, lets not mention all the homosexuals being murdered!

Devils advocate off:

If you have no knowledge, basis for knowledge, or true understanding of events why would you make a comment about them? Like many other things in life, you can have divergent views. You can read, study, be taught about events and come to a different conclusion as to whether it was a correct action or not, but to say that since it doesnt effect me, I dont care is very narrowminded. Even to comment on something you dont have a working knowledge on is pointless as people will assume that you have some knowledge or wouldnt have spoken up about something.

The point is simple, if people would open their eyes to the various atrocities going on in the world today and not take (pardon me) your stated point of view, things could be done to fix them. Turning your back on the world does not make it disappear. Just because someone threw a body in front of you and you are horrified by it does not mean that all the bodies being thrown behind you dont count. The bodies are still there.

zippyjuan

07-07-2005, 03:03 PM

What are you trying to say about the bombs that went off in London?

jstreet

07-07-2005, 03:25 PM

Devils Advocate coming out for purpose of insane illustration, THESE ARE NOT MY BELIEFS:
So if a homosexual was beaten to death or drawn and quartered every day in the US it would not be newsworthy anymore?Nice choice of an example :rolleyes:.

I know you're trying to goad me, but I'm not going to bite. If a homosexual was beaten to death daily, or we shot a rocket into a nursery every day, or we went to Mars every day, or we talked with the whales every day, YES, it would NOT be in the news, because it is an EVERY DAY EVENT.

Last time I checked there was not a column in the Washington Post devoted to the President's daily breakfast. He eats breakfast! It happens! And this is the most important man in our own country!

Do I think that an Israeli or a Palestinian or a homosexual's brutal murder compares in magnitude to breakfast? Of course not. But is an American going to pay for a newpaper showcasing something new, different, unexpected, and shocking to the conscience, or is he going to pay for a newspaper that is showing the same headline it's shown for decades? Take a look!

The media is not a non-profit and it wants the most money it can get. It doesn't get it with old news. News flash: It may not be a nice thing to hear, but the latest death in Israel is old news to the American public as a whole. You're kidding yourself if you believe otherwise. Look at the headlines! Americans care more about Britney's boobs then anyone in Israel!

Devils advocate off:

If you have no knowledge, basis for knowledge, or true understanding of events why would you make a comment about them? Like many other things in life, you can have divergent views. You can read, study, be taught about events and come to a different conclusion as to whether it was a correct action or not, but to say that since it doesnt effect me, I dont care is very narrowminded. Even to comment on something you dont have a working knowledge on is pointless as people will assume that you have some knowledge or wouldnt have spoken up about something.

The point is simple, if people would open their eyes to the various atrocities going on in the world today and not take (pardon me) your stated point of view, things could be done to fix them. Turning your back on the world does not make it disappear. Just because someone threw a body in front of you and you are horrified by it does not mean that all the bodies being thrown behind you dont count. The bodies are still there.If you'd actually read what I wrote.... I said I do not have enough knowledge about the conflict to comment on it, and that's why I didn't. I didn't comment on the conflict, I didn't say whether or not I cared, I didn't say that I was turning my back on the world, and I certainly didn't say that body counts don't matter to me.

You put those words in my mouth and I don't appreciate it.

What I can and did comment on is why London's a big player in the media and Israel isn't. And I said that I would bet that a new story about a people with which the typical American can more closely identify would receive more attention than a repetitive story about a people with which the typical American cannot identify.

Fact: The media needs money to run.
Fact: The media would like more money. More money == better.
Fact: The media makes money when people buy their products.

Logical reasoning: If the media gets money when it appeals to Americans, and the media wants more money, it will make an effort to appeal to Americans.

Conclusion: Americans don't care about Israel and Palestine as much as they care about London.

I am the first person to say that I am disgusted with the way things are run, so please don't imply otherwise. I think it is outrageous we care more about Michael Jackson then we do about a multitude of other things. But I can't apologize for other people's feelings because they aren't mine.

LPMiller

07-07-2005, 04:31 PM

I'm referring to the fact that we have a lot in common, not to mention our founders came from there. I think more people in America can relate/know more of England than they do Israel.

:shrug:

By founders, who do you mean? Because our founding fathers didn't come from there, they mostly came from here. They may have had close ties over seas, being only a generation or 2 removed in some cases, but they weren't really English in the sense that they were born there.

if you mean colony wise, that's only partially true, as they also came from Spain and France.

Now yes, England and our history are closely tied together, but mostly I think just our relationship since WW1 and beyond has forged a very brotherly attitude towards the individual people of England and America. Though we do pick on each other quite a bit.

civicdidex

07-07-2005, 04:56 PM

id like to add my 2 cents...compare GNP from israel and england, and that ratio is how its gonna be pushed by our media. it all comes down to who has money. if joe schmo touched a kid, he gets 5 seconds on the news if any. michael jackson does it, its on for the next 10 years. get my drift?
plus, if we had to show a large news article about every bombing in israel, we wouldnt get a chance to see our local news. :)

Burzhui

07-07-2005, 06:11 PM

I'm referring to the fact that we have a lot in common, not to mention our founders came from there. I think more people in America can relate/know more of England than they do Israel.

:shrug:

Now you are just talking out of your ass, we have so much in common with england let me think of one thing... umm NOTHING! Even the language is different! In Israel however they speak the same english we speak here

Burzhui

07-07-2005, 06:22 PM

hmm i think this is the first time that the word ass has not been censored :spock: how bizzare

zippyjuan

07-07-2005, 06:24 PM

Sorry, I don't speak Hebrew. I thought being a New Yorker you might have a little more understanding of the attacks on London than the rest of us. Unless you are being sarcastic.

Burzhui

07-07-2005, 06:27 PM

Sorry, I don't speak Hebrew. I thought being a New Yorker you might have a little more understanding of the attacks on London than the rest of us.
i don't speak hebrew either. I understand the impact of the attacks, i just don't see why it deseves 24 hour coverage. News stations haven't shut up about it. i mean i have no problem with this, but i just don't see it as being fair.

zippyjuan

07-07-2005, 06:36 PM

What more important story is being ignored as a result? WHo is it being unfair to?

ski

07-07-2005, 09:45 PM

Now you are just talking out of your ass, we have so much in common with england let me think of one thing... umm NOTHING! Even the language is different! In Israel however they speak the same english we speak here
Ouch, dude.

So we have "NOTHING" in common with England? Right, now you, my friend, are talking out of your behind. You can make an intelligent remark, but don't exaggerate. I'm sure you can find at least one thing in common if you brush up on your American History (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_United_States_of_America#History).

On a side note, it pisses me off to no extent that people had the nerve to stand behind this graphic:

http://msnbcmedia.msn.com/j/msnbc/2086000/2086046.standard.jpg

on other boards, within hours after the event happened. :angry:

Merlin

07-08-2005, 04:23 AM

Wow did this thread take a turn for the worse. :disa:

cheapie

07-08-2005, 05:02 AM

:stupid: came back to a hate fest.

anywhoo.....terrorists suck.

Burzhui

07-08-2005, 01:35 PM

Kevster

07-08-2005, 01:49 PM

Ok so you gave me a link to American history and not similarities between england and USA. So i have yet to be corrected

One obvious similiarity is our system of law, which is derived in part from English common law. That's a pretty big similiarity.

ski

07-08-2005, 02:18 PM

Just out of curiosity, what language do they speak in England? Was pretty sure it's English. That's common knowledge among Anytown, USA. You might be trying to say that they use different words for certain things, but that is called a dialect, and they exist within our country in all different regions. Ask any man on the street to name 5 things about Britain and I'm sure he could do it pretty easily (Big Ben, the royal family, celebrities, Wimbledon, London Bridges, tea and crumpets, etc.). Ask any man on the street to name 5 things about Israel and I think most people would only be able to think of Judaism and bombings. My point is that most people in America know less about Israel than they do England. Therefore it's easier to relate. Not saying it's right or wrong, just saying it is.

Out of pure curiosity, I thought I remember reading that you aren't originally from America, Burz. If my memory serves correctly, which country are you from? If by chance I'm not crazy and you happen to be from Israel, I'm not trying to promote ignorance, I'm just trying to tell it like it is, since it was asked why this got so much more coverage.

MrGreg

07-08-2005, 02:50 PM

I understand the impact of the attacks, i just don't see why it deseves 24 hour coverage. News stations haven't shut up about it. i mean i have no problem with this, but i just don't see it as being fair.

The problem is the national news organizations take whatever story has the most drama (i.e. $$$$) and hang on like a pitbull in heat.

-The Michael Jackson trial
-The Kobe trial
-The runaway bride
-The Scott Peterson trial
-Terri Schiavo
-The missing girl in Aruba.

All of the above have received national 24 hour news coverage. These stories only really affect a handfull of people, at most.

Tell me which politition is proposing a rediculous law for the sole benefit of his campaign backers. Keep track of what government officials say, and what they do, and point out when they are full of crap. Give me an honest view of what's going on in the international arena, not just "prince so-and-so wore a shirt with a swastica to a party!!!!!" Talk about something I care about, or I'll change the channel to The Daily Show.

And local news isn't any better. They spend 5 minutes telling me if a house burned down, or another meth lab got busted. 5 minutes on weather and traffic. 5 minutes on kittens and bake sales, and 10 minutes on the Trial of the week. There is a reason I don't watch local news, either.

Tell me what the governor is doing. What are our senators up to? When was the last time you heard about a bill in the state congress? I want to hear about the stories that affect me. Give me information I can use to determine my next vote so I don't have to base it off of the 30 second campaign ads.

Anyway, I've gotten a bit off topic. My original point was that this story is more relevant and deserving of national news coverage than 90% of what the national news actually covers.

navyones

07-08-2005, 03:06 PM

Ouch, dude.

So we have "NOTHING" in common with England? Right, now you, my friend, are talking out of your behind. You can make an intelligent remark, but don't exaggerate. I'm sure you can find at least one thing in common if you brush up on your American History (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_United_States_of_America#History).

On a side note, it pisses me off to no extent that people had the nerve to stand behind this graphic:

http://msnbcmedia.msn.com/j/msnbc/2086000/2086046.standard.jpg

on other boards, within hours after the event happened. :angry:

I sort of like this graphic. It is a perfect example of how some people can twist a statement. Does anyone realize that the graphic was posted as a tribute to the USS Abraham Lincoln having completed nine consecutive months of operations. It was not meant to mean that the mission in Iraq had been completely accomplished. President Bush, as shown in the picture, flew onto the Lincoln on the last day of their deployment to honor the crew. The crew of the Lincoln did accomplish their mission.

Of course both parties twist pictures. Here is one of Kerry surrounded by 6's. Anti-Christ....LOL! Well, that is how the Republicans played it.

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/images2/666kerry1.jpg

Burzhui

07-08-2005, 03:28 PM

One obvious similiarity is our system of law, which is derived in part from English common law. That's a pretty big similiarity.

there are many countries that use the same system of law, that is not a direct similarity between england and USA

Just out of curiosity, what language do they speak in England? Was pretty sure it's English. That's common knowledge among Anytown, USA. You might be trying to say that they use different words for certain things, but that is called a dialect, and they exist within our country in all different regions. Ask any man on the street to name 5 things about Britain and I'm sure he could do it pretty easily (Big Ben, the royal family, celebrities, Wimbledon, London Bridges, tea and crumpets, etc.). Ask any man on the street to name 5 things about Israel and I think most people would only be able to think of Judaism and bombings. My point is that most people in America know less about Israel than they do England. Therefore it's easier to relate. Not saying it's right or wrong, just saying it is.

Out of pure curiosity, I thought I remember reading that you aren't originally from America, Burz. If my memory serves correctly, which country are you from? If by chance I'm not crazy and you happen to be from Israel, I'm not trying to promote ignorance, I'm just trying to tell it like it is, since it was asked why this got so much more coverage.

I'm not from Israel, i'm originally from Russia.
The language they speak in england is English, the language, not dialect, we speak here is American. Big difference in grammar as well as words between the two languages. Just because it's easier to relate, it doesn't make it right or fair. It is a terrible thing that has happened, but what bugs me is that all other terrible acts by terrorists in other countries get played down (btw Israel is on our side) whereas other countries get favored

P.S. I'm not attacking you in any way, i have nothing personal against you

Nija

07-08-2005, 03:40 PM

I sort of like this graphic. It is a perfect example of how some people can twist a statement. Does anyone realize that the graphic was posted as a tribute to the USS Abraham Lincoln having completed nine consecutive months of operations. It was not meant to mean that the mission in Iraq had been completely accomplished. President Bush, as shown in the picture, flew onto the Lincoln on the last day of their deployment to honor the crew. The crew of the Lincoln did accomplish their mission.

Of course both parties twist pictures. Here is one of Kerry surrounded by 6's. Anti-Christ....LOL! Well, that is how the Republicans played it.

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/images2/666kerry1.jpg

i could have sworn that picture was from when the president announced the end of major combat operations in Iraq.

It is also where he got one of my favorite nicknames: Chimpy McFlightsuit :heh:

navyones

07-08-2005, 03:51 PM

i could have sworn that picture was from when the president announced the end of major combat operations in Iraq.

It is also where he got one of my favorite nicknames: Chimpy McFlightsuit :heh:

President Bush did announce the end of major combat operations on that day. That does not change the fact that the graphic saying "Mission Accomplished" was signifying the ship's accomplishment.

As far as the flight suit goes, it is standard issue for anyone flying on a Navy attack aircraft.

Bush isn't the only one, who likes to wear military garments though:

http://www.poorandstupid.com/images/20030508clinton1.jpg

eSDee

07-08-2005, 04:10 PM

So Burz they speak American in Israel?

LPMiller

07-08-2005, 04:44 PM

President Bush did announce the end of major combat operations on that day. That does not change the fact that the graphic saying "Mission Accomplished" was signifying the ship's accomplishment.

As far as the flight suit goes, it is standard issue for anyone flying on a Navy attack aircraft.

Bush isn't the only one, who likes to wear military garments though:

http://www.poorandstupid.com/images/20030508clinton1.jpg

I didn't know a business suit was....oh wait, you mean the guy.

jstreet

07-08-2005, 06:10 PM

President Bush did announce the end of major combat operations on that day. That does not change the fact that the graphic saying "Mission Accomplished" was signifying the ship's accomplishment.The White House asked a private vendor to produce the sign, paid for it, asked the crew to put it up on the ship, filmed a nationally televised speech in front of it during which nothing about the ship itself was mentioned (http://www.cnn.com/2003/US/05/01/bush.transcript/), and on the one-year anniversary of that speech President Bush gave another speech in which he said:
"A year ago, I did give the speech from the carrier saying that we had achieved an important objective, that we had accomplished a mission, which was the removal of Saddam Hussein"...but the entire time the "mission" and the "accomplishment" was about the ship. Even though that is directly contradicted by the President's words. Uh huh. :rolleyes:

navyones

07-08-2005, 06:22 PM

It doesn't really matter now anyway. Now that the election is over, all of this is a moot point. The propaganda would be better, if it was saved for 2008.

jstreet

07-08-2005, 06:35 PM

It doesn't really matter now anyway. Now that the election is over, all of this is a moot point. The propaganda would be better, if it was saved for 2008.:shrug:

So would the truth.

ShawnLee

07-08-2005, 06:55 PM

The White House asked a private vendor to produce the sign, paid for it, asked the crew to put it up on the ship, filmed a nationally televised speech in front of it What about this? (http://www.cnn.com/2003/ALLPOLITICS/10/28/mission.accomplished/) So, the White House made it because the Navy asked for it, and it's the President's fault that it's up?
but the entire time the "mission" and the "accomplishment" was about the ship. Even though that is directly contradicted by the President's words. Uh huh. :rolleyes:Right... Uh, what mission was it that was accomplished? Oh right, the specific mission of the ship? Accomplished. The specific mission of the invasion? Accomplished. So where is that wrong?

Better question: What does this have to do with the terrorist attacks in London? Is it Bush's fault that London was bombed?

jstreet

07-08-2005, 08:09 PM

[url="http://www.cnn.com/2003/ALLPOLITICS/10/28/mission.accomplished/"]What about this?And what about what I said? So freaking sick of my points being unanswered or manipulated. :puke:

navyones made the point that the the sign was supposed to signify the ship's mission.

I made the point that the sign was supposed to signify the Iraq mission.

Neither of us made an argument that there was anything wrong about the sign, and neither of us said that either mission was or was not accomplished. And Christ, neither of us said that London's attacks are Bush's fault. I won't speak for navyones, but I'll thank you for not putting words in my mouth.

The contrast in beliefs was, very simply, centered on which mission it was to which the sign was referring.

Because the the White House paid for, presented the Navy with, and requested the Navy put up a sign that said "Mission Accomplished" as a backdrop for a speech which the President stated was a reference to Iraq in an April 30th, 2004, speech that one might think trumps your link from October 23, 2003, yes, I would say that it is the President's "fault", or perhaps "responsibility" that it is up during his speech to the country!

navyones

07-08-2005, 09:04 PM

I actually didn't mean to incite a flame-fest. I don't think those are too much fun for anyone.

As far as the bombings in London, I do think Bush must take some responsibility. Tony Blair has been an unwaivering supporter of the War in Iraq. Now, Al Queda is coming after his country too.

Just a thought: If Al Queda had no interest in Iraq, then why should they attack London?

Burzhui

07-08-2005, 10:17 PM

So Burz they speak American in Israel?

actually yes, most of the people speak our language

LegendKiller

07-08-2005, 10:30 PM

actually yes, most of the people speak our language

Americans speak english, not american. There are Germans who speak German but have their own dialect, sometimes a Berlin german cannot understand a Bavarian German, but it is still German.

I'd love to see a school class called "american".

Houdini

07-08-2005, 10:38 PM

As far as the bombings in London, I do think Bush must take some responsibility. Tony Blair has been an unwaivering supporter of the War in Iraq. Now, Al Queda is coming after his country too.

I'm sure the US will back the UK completely. I can't imagine a different scenario. I hope you don't mean by your statement that Bush must take responsibility for the bombings in London, though. I seriously doubt he was involved.

The murderers who blew up the people heading to work that day deserve and have taken responsibility. They'll face consequences, and hopefully similar events will be thwarted. Something like this can only strengthen our alliance and resolve.

mechmike0034

07-08-2005, 11:58 PM

Speaking of graphics, I thought Scott Stantis of the Birmingham News did a good job:

http://www.al.com/opinion/birminghamnews/cartoons/070705B_stantis.jpg

Kevster

07-09-2005, 04:12 AM

Americans speak english, not american. There are Germans who speak German but have their own dialect, sometimes a Berlin german cannot understand a Bavarian German, but it is still German.

I'd love to see a school class called "american".

One of the Germans I work with speaks english with a hard scottish accent. I have to almost bite my lip not to laugh. Nobody in our Frankfurt office really knows why he has that accent, he just does.

I speak German with a bit of a Bavarian accent because two of my teachers were from there. The way I pronounce "ch" is usually an "shhh" sound instead of a "k" sound. That normally tweaks Northern Germans a little bit. ;)

Burzhui

07-09-2005, 05:28 AM

Americans speak english, not american. There are Germans who speak German but have their own dialect, sometimes a Berlin german cannot understand a Bavarian German, but it is still German.

I'd love to see a school class called "american".

there is a difference between a dialect and a language with a different set of grammar.

bricheese

07-09-2005, 08:36 AM

My grandma is in london and noone can get ahold of her..
does anyone know the number or websight to find the list on injured people

bachviet

07-09-2005, 08:41 AM

Americans speak english, not american. There are Germans who speak German but have their own dialect, sometimes a Berlin german cannot understand a Bavarian German, but it is still German.

I'd love to see a school class called "american".
:stupid:

It's called American English but it's still English that's why we still understand what Britons talking about. If it's a different language, you won't be able to understand.

My grandma is in london and noone can get ahold of her..
does anyone know the number or websight to find the list on injured people
I hope your Grandma is alright.

LegendKiller

07-09-2005, 09:02 AM

there is a difference between a dialect and a language with a different set of grammar.

Ok, so we have multiple people saying that you are incorrect.

I guess we are all wrong.

Australians speak australian.

Canadians speak Candian.

Americans speak American.

The scots all speak scot

The irish all speak irish.

The *ONLY* people who speak english are...the english.

Wow, that is quite profound.

ski

07-09-2005, 09:29 AM

A dialect is a subset of a language.
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=dialect

----------------------------

bricheese, I'm sorry to hear that... I would think if you could get a hold of the authorities in London somehow they could check for you.

Merlin

07-09-2005, 11:46 AM

ski

07-09-2005, 02:38 PM

Bombs go off and dozens of innocent people die. Many more are injured. And you poeple are debating the differences in the way people speak, Bush photo opps, and the amount of coverage it gets. Today I am ashamed of all of you. :disa:
You make it sound as though by having a discussion about parallels, it is impossible for anyone to care. It's pretty inherent the nature of this attack; the postings are not representative of your feelings about it. What I mean is that it's pretty much a given that this is tragic. When you click to open this thread, people don't need to prove your feelings about this event by posting how sad it is 60 times over. That's where other discussion comes into play. Thus, it is the nature of an internet forum thread. I'm not ashamed of anyone.