Exxon profit surges from a year ago!!!!

[cheapie]

http://money.cnn.com/2006/04/27/news/companies/exxon/index.htm?cnn=yes
:mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:


NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) - Exxon Mobil reported higher quarterly profits Thursday as the price of oil surged. But the company missed analyst estimates and failed to top last quarter's record earnings.

The company said it earned $8.4 billion, or $1.37 per share, in the first quarter of 2006.
Special Reportfull coverage
GAS CRUNCH
Oil keeps easing
Big oil defends its big profits
Gas bargains, carpool partners found online
Anatomy of a gas gouge
Video More video
Many consumers are driving long distances for the best prices on gas. CNN's Sumi Das reports (April 24)
Play video

Analysts were looking for earnings of $1.47 a share, according to First Call.

Profit was higher compared to the same quarter a year ago. Last year the company made $1.15 a share in the first quarter, according to First Call.

Shares in Exxon (Research) fell about 2 percent in pre-market trade on Inet.

Last quarter Exxon earned $10.7 billion, or $1.71 a share. It was the biggest quarterly profit for any corporation in U.S. history.

Exxon also posed the biggest yearly profit ever recorded in the U.S. in that quarter. The company chalked up $36.1 billion in earnings for 2005, or $1,146 a second, a 31 percent increase from the year prior.
Record profits cause a furor

Record oil company profits have sparked talk of action by lawmakers in recent months.

There are currently bills moving through the Senate to either limit future oil company mergers or skim off some of their earnings in a "windfall profits" tax.

The oil industry has responded by saying they need to remain consolidated in order to compete in a global energy market with foreign nationalized oil companies, many of which are bigger than Exxon Mobil.

They also say they're invested heavily in new energy technologies.

But they've also returned lots of the profits to shareholders.

Exxon raised its dividend to 32 cents in the first quarter 2006 from 29 cents in the fourth quarter 2005. The company has increased its dividend for 29 consecutive years.

[MikeD]

I don't see the anger. They're not forcing us to suck down gas the way we do. If we all start buying cars like the Prius, and not H2's, then I'll understand.

[cheapie]

what? the rise is gas prices is not due to a limited supply. trucking companies are going out of business like crazy because of it. those that don't have to substantially raise rates, almost certainly resulting in consumer goods prices increasing. the airlines are barely staying in business. and it's all because the oil companies can.

i resent the idea that i should drive the smallest, most uncomfortable vehicle available or else the oil industry has free reign to rape me.

also, if the price of our inneficiency went to fund the environment i wouldn't be so pissed. but it's not. it's lining the pockets of these greedy bastards.

[Kudos]

they passed profits onto the shareholders, all companies do that.

it's annoying when they claim the rise in prices are due to oil shortages when it sure seems it's just to make more money. However, it's quite possible they had or have less oil available to them then in previous years, therefore having to raise their prices to keep making profit.

It seems like they're getting a lot of profit, but just think of how much gas you use in a week, and multiply that by the millions of drivers out there. Even a penny profit on the gallon is going to post a lot of cash

[DarkFury]

I guess everyone needs to become a "shareholder" in Exxon now huh? :rolleyes: :hmm:

[LegendKiller]

all I gotta ask is sfw? a guy who owns two hemis and says bigger is better complains....and...? I have no sympathy for anybody who owns a vehicle that gets less than 22mpg when they aren,t using that extra power the majority of the time

cheapie, since you did nt reply to my last post, why do you think oil costs so much?

[cheapie]

your last post?

frankly, i don't know. you're a lot smarter in this area than i am. i think the way that it's traded has a lot to do with it. the position of the dollar. and of course demand.

but...since there doesn't seem to be problem with supply and inventories are still at high levels i'm not buying that there's more buyers than product. also, the record profits could only be that sales are growing. but i think prices are increasing much faster than sales driving the profits.

part of my post is a knee-jerk reaction. part of it is a realization that they are in a profit-taking mode.

i work in a market sector where we currently have a very strong position. we COULD get more for our product because of the lack of alternatives. however, it wouldn't be smart and would end up causing resentment and an eventual bite in the proverbial a$$. i'm guessing that's what's going to happen here.

[LegendKiller]

when is a company supposed to be in a profit-giiving mode? they are there to earn stakeholders return.
obviously oil is more expensive, obviously itcosts just as much to sell a 50 barrel as it does to sell a 70 barrel, so you get more profit. I will respond with more later. my thumbs are getting tired of ttypng

[MikeD]

Supply and demand. We want more; so does China and India. It causes the price to go up.

Hey Cheapie, it's like that XBox 360 you sold a few months back for $700. Same concept...you could get $700, so you took it. Big oil is the same. ;)

[cheapie]

yes. they were both price-gouging.

but the difference is that access to cheap game consoles isn't vital to our nation's economy.

[InfiniteNothing]

price collusion

[DarkFury]

all I gotta ask is sfw? a guy who owns two hemis and says bigger is better complains....and...? I have no sympathy for anybody who owns a vehicle that gets less than 22mpg when they aren,t using that extra power the majority of the time

cheapie, since you did nt reply to my last post, why do you think oil costs so much?
SFW? WTF is that?

The car I bought gets WAY better mileage than the truck (which still has its usefulness and purposes as well but it has been benched until Wintertime when it will be needed again.)... and is equivalent to others in its class. I'm personally not very comfortable in many of the smaller cars so I'm not buying those (yet). BTW, even if my car got an average of 22 you'd probably say that it needed to get 24 or 26 MPG in order to still make your point... :pfft:

My comment was towards their EXCESS PROFITS... not about my gas mileage... so step off your soapbox homie. :hmm: Now if they charge more because it just covers their costs and they continue to get the same profit margins, then ok... other than that... then they are GOUGING consumers and benefitting from it.

[zippyjuan]

Questions have been raised about the oil companies manipulating the supplies to raise prices- like OPEC does at the wholesale level. The claim is that while it is normal for refineries to shut down around this time of year to change to the various mixes required by different states for polution control, they have supposedly been shutting down more and for longer periods of time than necessary. This has left some regions actually facing shortages. While their profits for the quarter were the fourth largest in history, it is a decrease from last quarter.

A large increase in the price of fuels may be the only thing to get people to use less of it and push the country in the direction of importing less oil, as Bush suggested we try to do in his State of The Union speech. Despite rising costs, we still have some of the cheapest gas in the world. Higher energy prices will be a drag on the economy.

[DarkFury]

A large increase in the price of fuels may be the only thing to get people to use less of it and push the country in the direction of importing less oil, as Bush suggested we try to do in his State of The Union speech. Despite rising costs, we still have some of the cheapest gas in the world. Higher energy prices will be a drag on the economy.
That's fine and good and all.. however, if these companies continue getting HUGE profits from this then pretty much maybe something should be done to take some of that profit and put it towards more research to reliably reduce the reliance on oil... (but then again... knowing how "big business" works, this money will just end up in someone else's pockets and not produce the desired results that help the average consumer.)

[cheapie]

interesting article on ethanol

http://www.businessweek.com/autos/content/apr2006/bw20060427_493909.htm?campaign_id=rss_daily

[Cubsfan]

Another article on ethanol/alternative fuels:

http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/earth/2690341.html?page=1&c=y

This chart was very interesting:
http://media.popularmechanics.com/documents/Fuel_of_the_Future-e852.pdf

[smeakim]

It’s partly due to demand, partly due to supply, partly due to political reasons, partly due to oil speculators, partly due to the switchover, and probably other reasons as well. Some of the excuses are a little far fetched and are just to put the blame on someone else. For example, when a hurricane is coming there is no reason to jump up the price of gas the next day. The gas affected by the potential hurricane will not be in the tanks of the station for weeks to come. Same reason goes for when oil slides for three days straight and the price goes down. The gas in the tanks at stations is not affected by the price of oil, but they still go up and down as the price of oil does. The gas in transport is also not affected by the increase or decrease of oil down stream. Also why do prices jump up much faster when there is something looming, but the price when it goes down is only by a penny or two at a time? Also right now ethanol is actually more expensive to make and is only cheaper at the moment because it is subsidized, I have family in NE who know about the subsidies first hand. Also ethanol is more expensive and harsher on the environment to produce at the current time than gas. Also everyone can’t drive a Prius, and unless something like fuel cells or other renewable resources can be developed to produce enough power for certain industries, we will always be dependent. Lets say we also throw out all the H2s, Excursions, and H3s we are really no better off. That drop in demand will do nothing to affect the price curve to allow for prices to come back down.

Everyone does not feel safe in a little car. I had a friend who was hit in a smaller car. She was severely injured. She now drives an H2 because she is in fear of stupid drivers. There are many reasons people make to choose bigger vehicles. I have a truck in CO. I need it for the winter because sometimes I can’t even get out of my community without it. Is it the best choice for the rest of the year, probably not, but supporting my family by being able to get to work makes it necessary and safer to drive with in the winter. IMHO.

[LegendKiller]

SFW? WTF is that?

The car I bought gets WAY better mileage than the truck (which still has its usefulness and purposes as well but it has been benched until Wintertime when it will be needed again.)... and is equivalent to others in its class. I'm personally not very comfortable in many of the smaller cars so I'm not buying those (yet). BTW, even if my car got an average of 22 you'd probably say that it needed to get 24 or 26 MPG in order to still make your point... :pfft:

My comment was towards their EXCESS PROFITS... not about my gas mileage... so step off your soapbox homie. :hmm: Now if they charge more because it just covers their costs and they continue to get the same profit margins, then ok... other than that... then they are GOUGING consumers and benefitting from it.

wow, so you go from sucking a lot+1 to sucking a lot -1. great for you!!!

this is yet another case of people slamming their heads in the car door and then blaming, ignoranlty, 'the man' for their headache. it is ppl like you, who whine about small cars, and then go buy the biggest damn tanks they can find, that are causing the problem. if people stopped being so self-centered and egotistical, then we wouldn't be where we are. let me repeat that, people like you caused this. it is YOUR fault for buying ags guzzling hogs when you didn't need to, take some personal reaponsibility.

furthermore, when profits are constrained by whiney abusers is when this country goes to crap. I am sure you would welcome 50 cent gas with open arms as you gas that behemoth, but the rest of us just might want a nice planet to give our grand kids. if you don't, send yours to the biggest smog zones and let them get asthma, while mine enjoy decent childhoods.

lastly, I am almost 6' 3" and we own ONE accord (i rideshare with a coworker) and I have plenty of room while driving or riding. despite 2 major knee surgeries my knee never hurts in that car. don't pull that "room" bs on me, brother.

keep making excuses and not taking personal responsibility. next time you goose that hemi, think of your selfishness and also think of the easiest way you can blame it on somebody else.

[DarkFury]

Geez LK... I guess you got a major bug up your rear don't cha? If I wanted to buy a "gas hog"... I could go out and buy an SRT-10 Ram 1500 with a whoopin 8 MPG on Premium 92... and all it does is go fast. I use my truck to haul all kinds of stuff and keep me safe in the Winter (when I put my car in the garage.). I probably don't travel as far as you do back and forth to work, so pretty much I'm still comfortable with MPG that both my vehicles still get and I haven't complained about them.

I travel a total of 10 miles a day back and forth from work... pretty much I barely put 10,000 miles per year on both of my vehicles combined. I probably don't burn as much fuel as someone who commutes over 40 miles one way to work in a Honda Accord... like my buddy who already has like 45K miles on his 2 1/2 year old Acura.... they just drive a hell of alot more than I do so I can afford to have a car that is alot more comfortable but less efficient. I guess I should fault them for selecting a house so far away from work burning gas unnecessarily huh? (yeah right!!!) Granted, if I were in their position, I probably would make some different choices as far as vehicles are concerned.... but as is... I enjoy what I currently have.

So you can take your vinegar "for people like me" elsewhere... like I said before, the price of the gas itself is not a problem. It's the companies who are TAKING ADVANTAGE of it for their own gain which is my problem with it. Just like the gas stations that ran gas prices up to $4 and $5 per gallon when the war broke out in Iraq... they were in the wrong trying to rape people and make a profit for themselves.

BTW.. my 2 vehicles are "not the biggest tanks" that can be found. There are many more that are WAY WORSE.. but just because I didn't go and buy a Honda Civic or Accord ... or a Prius, you wanna come down here and rattle your saber at me. /my hand goes straight to your face on that one... :pfft:

Oh well... people like you will complain anyways... so whatever. Keep on being mad and whatnot... and the next time you goose that Accord (rattling like a can of angry bees if you have "riced it up" ) try not to get all mad that it isn't a HEMI!!! :heh:

[MikeD]

Is it about the amount of profit they're making? The toll on the economy? What's the flavor-of-the-day we're complaining about now?

If it's profit margin...c'mon, that's the goal of any business. INCREASE PROFITS. I don't see anybody complaining about the price of a large pizza going from $10 to $15 over the past few years; think flour, cheese, and tomato paste have gone up that much in the same period of time? Hell no...the pizza guys know they can get it, so that's what they charge.

As for the economy: I understand your point. However, I still can't get past the fact that we as citizens are still choosing to use up a ridiculous amout of fuel. Sure, we all choose our cars for various reasons: safety, fuel economy, looks, name. But if you look at some of the vehicles rolling off assembly lines these days, and it's obvious that a portion of the population is voluntarily choosing to "waste" gas (and alot of it). Until we look at ourselves and what we can do to solve the problem, we probably shouldn't be blaming Big Oil.

Hey, it's the American Way: point fingers and blame someone else for our own problems.

[cheapie]

again, the pizza isn't a good example. you can choose other food. if pizza was the only food available and they all started jacking up the prices then you point would have more merit. sure, we could all eat less. but when an industry has a virtual lock on a product, then it's a bad idea for them just to start jacking up the prices because they can. would you feel the same way if gas was $18/gallon? i'm guessing you would be explaining how they have an obligation to increase profits. :shrug: just sayin'.

[zippyjuan]

Petroleum products are not traded in competetive markets. The supply is controlled by a few who are not terribly competetive against each other for price. The demand is pretty inelastic too- it takes a large change in price to obtain a small change in demand. We are at the point now where people are starting to complain, but not willing to make any personal changes in their usage habbits. Thus the law of supply and demand will probably not bring us to the proper price of these limited resources. If they were fairly priced, I believe the price we pay would actually be much higher. World demand is growing and not just due to us anymore. India and China are big consumers these days. You can add in speculators in futures markets for oil- it isn't just for hedging anymore- and that is also driving up the price.

Now because there is an election coming up and there haven't been many issues to get excited about (every one is getting tired of terrorism and the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq), Congress has siezed upon the issue of gas prices and is coming up with new ways to mess things up but hopefully get votes for them. One is to give everybody $100. Buying votes. One wants to suspend the federal taxes on gasoline. Another wants to cut the subsidies companies get to drill on public lands like in the Gulf of Mexico. Why we are paying them for that I do not know. They make a profit on it even without the payments. They should be paying the government for the rights to extract the vaulables from public lands. None of this will really have much effect on the price at the pump but will add to the growing budget defecit as they try to literally buy your votes.

[MikeD]

again, the pizza isn't a good example. you can choose other food. if pizza was the only food available and they all started jacking up the prices then you point would have more merit. sure, we could all eat less. but when an industry has a virtual lock on a product, then it's a bad idea for them just to start jacking up the prices because they can. would you feel the same way if gas was $18/gallon? i'm guessing you would be explaining how they have an obligation to increase profits. :shrug: just sayin'.

I hear ya. But hey, would people still be pulling up to the pumps at $18/gallon? I suspect the answer is yes...so would I really have a need to explain anything at that point?

Would it be safe to say that we can agree that the fault is shared by multiple parties here?

[LegendKiller]

I have a decent analogy for the fuel economy situation in American and the inevitable price increases.

A few weeks ago my wife and I went to the Cherry Blossom Festival here in DC. It was really neat, thousands of people out, beautiful blossoms, and the first time we visited the monuments.

However, a few people took it upon themselves to get a momento of the occasion, by ripping branches off of the trees. Now, I am not talking about massive branches, but decent size ones with a large cluster of blossoms. Some people took small ones and put them in their kids' hair. Keep in mind, these people were in the minority, the vast majority just watched in awe at natures beauty.

Of course, nobody said anything to the selfish, it would be impolite, not PC. So those who were greedy just got nasty looks, which they ignored because it was their God given right to take what they wanted, who gives a crap about anybody else, right?

Now, imagine if the millions of people who go see the blossoms took something... Imagine a certain % of the population grabbed half the tree and took it home with them. After all, these were a gift to the American people from the Japanese almost a hundred years ago, they are entitled to their fair share. Large and small, everybody grabbed some.

Consider the fact that there is a good portion of the population didn't grab anything. Then consider the "sippers", those who took the twigs that fell on the ground, or had 2 blossoms on them. Finally, consider the abusers. They take massive branches, easily equaling 100-200 "sippers".

I imagine there would even be some guzzlers who would take the whole tree and transport it back in their Hemi powered Durango, or other vehicle.

There wouldn't be any damn blossoms left after the ego centric, abusive, and scapegoating abusers took the trees! A beautiful sight would be ruined, perhaps forever.

Of course, the sippers would be pissed at the guzzlers, but the guzzlers wouldn't care. They still think its their right to do what they want, even if it ruins their own property (the trees) and everybody else's.

Finally, the guzzlers would then look to the government to buy new trees, so they can ruin those too.

Yay for the guzzlers.

[smeakim]

There are different reasons for people choosing the cars they do. You would have to have all or most of the population get hybrids before the price would go down. People need to understand that not everyone can afford the premium that exists on hybrids in the current marketplace. They can afford 6K less and pay little by little for Gas, but having a car payment of 400-500 a month is not feasible for everyone.

Also just becuase the vehicle is a hybrid does not mean it gets great miles per gallon. Just look at the ford escape or the chvey truck hybrid. Not anywhere near the MPG as the Prius or Civic.

I also heard a story this morning the costs by the oil companies have risen 13% over last year, but the increase in gas prices has well outstripped that 13% figure. So saying raw materials costs is causing the upswing in prices is a flat out lie.

When a vehicle is developed that is based on renewable resources then you will see the demand shift, but until that point we are stuck where we are today. Just look at how long it took to get Regular gas off the market. Imaging trying to get all gas off the market, or reduce it to the point where it eats into the supply and demand curve.

Sorry more people buying a hybrid is not going to reduce the need for gas enough to lower the price. Hybrids still need gas.

[Chgoman]

Wow, personal attacks going crazy in this thread. People drive what they drive for many different reasons. I drive a Prius because for me it was the right car. I do a lot of driving for work and the mileage appealed to me as well as the price for a car with integrated GPS and a lot of other options. Before I drove my Prius, I drove a Ranger 4x4. Was I a bad person because I drove a truck that got below average mileage? No, for my work at the time, I needed to drive a truck. I had equal justification to drive a bigger truck if I wanted to. I live in an area of Southern California where there is an overabundance of large SUV, Hummers and everything big and I do think it has gotten out of control, but at the same time, we can't just judge everyone as some people have legitimate needs for what they drive.

As far as the oil companies go, they do need to make profits and as large as their profits seem, it is actually a very small percentage as compared to their sales. I know it doesn't seem like it in terms of recent oil prices and gas prices, but they have a very delicate and risky business. If their pricing is off by even pennies in the wrong direction, all that profit dissapears. I'm not saying that I wouldn't mind seeing the profit lower, but just realize that even if they were to be able to control thier profits and give half or all of the money back, the result on gas prices (which is only a part of their business) would likely only be 5-10 cents at most.

[BigJon]

I think it all comes down to the fact that everyone KNOWS that every company is greedy in some way or another. So yes...I'm sure someone is making a profit off of gas that really shouldn't be.

They know you need the product, they know you will have to buy it...whatever the cost. So what's stopping them other than ethics?

[MikeD]

This about sums things up...


If you thought the Dubai port deal marked a record high in Washington cynicism, think again. Nothing can match the spectacle of politicians scrambling for cover during a spike in gasoline prices. And this time the panderfest has gone all the way to the Oval Office. President Bush has joined the braying congressional hordes by ordering the Energy and Justice departments and the Federal Trade Commission to launch an investigation into possible gasoline price fixing.

What a disgrace.

Precisely 10 years ago (April 29, 1996) as gas prices reached a shocking $1.27 a gallon, President Bill Clinton ordered his Energy and Justice departments to launch investigations to find out why. In my column that week, I offered a wild guess as to why: "supply is down and demand is up." I offered Energy Secretary Hazel O'Leary and Attorney General Janet Reno a $100 bet (I roll high on sure things) that their million-dollar probes would do nothing more than confirm my hunch.

No takers. Even Cabinet secretaries don't throw away C-notes. Sure enough, months later these perfectly pointless investigations discounted charges of price gouging and attributed the price hike to . . . increased demand and decreased supply.

Today, every time an Iranian mullah opens his mouth about nukes, the risk premium for Persian Gulf supply interruptions jumps again. Crude oil prices alone account for about $1.70 of what you pay for a gallon at the pump. So 10 years later, I'll wager again. Here's what the Bush search for price gougers and profiteers will find:

· Demand is up. China has come from nowhere to pass Japan as the number No. 2 oil consumer in the world. China and India -- between them home to eight times the U.S. population -- are industrializing and gobbling huge amounts of energy.

American demand is up because we've lived in a fool's paradise since the mid-1980s. Until then, beginning with the oil shocks in 1973, Americans had changed appliances and cars and habits and achieved astonishing energy conservation. Energy use per dollar of gross domestic product was cut by 30 percent in little over a decade. Oil prices collapsed to about $10 a barrel.

Then amnesia set in, mile-per-gallon ratings disappeared from TV ads and we became "a country of a million Walter Mittys driving 75 mph in their gas-guzzling Bushwhack-Safari sport-utility roadsters with a moose head on the hood, a country whose crude oil production has dropped 32 percent in the last 25 years but which will not drill for oil in the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge for fear of disturbing the mating habits of caribou."

I wrote that during the '96 witch hunt for price gougers. Nothing has changed. Except that since then, U.S. crude oil production has dropped an additional 12.3 percent. Which brings us to:

· Supply is down. Start with supply disruptions in Nigeria, decreased production in Iraq, and the continuing loss of 5 percent of our national refining capacity because of damage from hurricanes Katrina and Rita. Add to that the mischief of idiotic new regulations. Last year's energy bill mandates arbitrary increases in blended ethanol use that so exceed current ethanol production that it is causing gasoline shortages and therefore huge price spikes.

Why don't we import the missing ethanol? Brazil makes a ton of it, and very cheaply. Answer: the Iowa caucuses. Iowa grows corn and chooses presidents. So we have a ridiculously high 54-cent ethanol tariff and ethanol shortages.

Another regulation requires specific ("boutique") gasoline blends for different cities depending on their air quality. Nice idea. But it introduces debilitating rigidities into the gasoline supply system. If Los Angeles runs short, you cannot just move supply in from Denver. You get shortages and more price spikes.

And don't get me started on the missing supply of might-have-been American crude. Arctic and outer continental shelf oil that the politicians kill year after year would have provided us by now with a critical and totally secure supply cushion in times of tight markets.

In March 2000, the price of gas hit $1.80 per gallon. Scandalized congressional Republicans shamelessly pushed for repeal of Clinton's whopping 4.3-cent gas tax increase. Now that the president is a Republican, what do you think Senate Democrats are proposing? A 60-day suspension of the federal gas tax. It would cost $6 billion and counteract the only good thing that comes with high gas prices -- the incentive to conserve.

George Shultz once said, "Nothing ever gets settled in this town." But even Shultz, who has seen everything, must marvel at the perfect regularity, the utter predictability, of the bottomless cynicism of Washington in the grip of gasoline fever.


http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/04/27/AR2006042701693.html

Just an FYI, not sure if you have to register at the site or not...

[gwilks98]

Just a question: How come exxon is the only oil company with big articles reporting record profit. If it was gouging, why wouldn't all of them be posting record profits, since prices are within 5 cents at every gas station in your area?

[LegendKiller]

Just a question: How come exxon is the only oil company with big articles reporting record profit. If it was gouging, why wouldn't all of them be posting record profits, since prices are within 5 cents at every gas station in your area?


http://money.cnn.com/2006/04/28/news/companies/chevron.reut/index.htm?cnn=yes

Other companies are making more, just not on the scale the Exxon is.

[clutchy]

I'm pissed about gas prices too, but here's some advice. Buy exxon-mobil stock, chevron stock and soak up the dividends as they come in.

it's going to someone, might as well be you.


For gwilks98: Exxon is the most efficient at getting oil out of the ground, some estimate 5-15/ barrel which is then sold at market rate. 70~ a barrel. hence record profits.

[DarkFury]

http://money.cnn.com/2006/04/28/news/companies/chevron.reut/index.htm?cnn=yes


Since LK posted the link... here is the part of the story that I personally was commenting on...



Oil and gas companies are enjoying an unusually robust quarter, propelled largely by the surge in oil prices due to fears of supply disruptions and booming demand.

FEAR = Higher prices = PROFIT Not actual rising costs of production driving up prices. Are we gonna get a refund if the fear doesn't pan out? I highly doubt it... :2far:


I'm pissed about gas prices too, but here's some advice. Buy exxon-mobil stock, chevron stock and soak up the dividends as they come in.

it's going to someone, might as well be you..

Funny thing is... my first post in this thread said exactly that. Before the "wrath of LK" came down upon me. :hmm:

[clutchy]

Since LK posted the link... here is the part of the story that I personally was commenting on...



FEAR = Higher prices = PROFIT Not actual rising costs of production driving up prices. Are we gonna get a refund if the fear doesn't pan out? I highly doubt it... :2far:



Funny thing is... my first post in this thread said exactly that. Before the "wrath of LK" came down upon me. :hmm:


if the government imposes a windfall tax, yes you will.

[LegendKiller]

Wow, personal attacks going crazy in this thread. People drive what they drive for many different reasons. I drive a Prius because for me it was the right car. I do a lot of driving for work and the mileage appealed to me as well as the price for a car with integrated GPS and a lot of other options. Before I drove my Prius, I drove a Ranger 4x4. Was I a bad person because I drove a truck that got below average mileage? No, for my work at the time, I needed to drive a truck. I had equal justification to drive a bigger truck if I wanted to. I live in an area of Southern California where there is an overabundance of large SUV, Hummers and everything big and I do think it has gotten out of control, but at the same time, we can't just judge everyone as some people have legitimate needs for what they drive.

As far as the oil companies go, they do need to make profits and as large as their profits seem, it is actually a very small percentage as compared to their sales. I know it doesn't seem like it in terms of recent oil prices and gas prices, but they have a very delicate and risky business. If their pricing is off by even pennies in the wrong direction, all that profit dissapears. I'm not saying that I wouldn't mind seeing the profit lower, but just realize that even if they were to be able to control thier profits and give half or all of the money back, the result on gas prices (which is only a part of their business) would likely only be 5-10 cents at most.


I have *no* problem with people using vehicles that fit their workplace needs. However, I do have a problem with people using SUVs (or guzzlers in general) as commuter vehicles. Furthermore, all of this push for bigger cars with bigger engines is rediculous, it is the 70s all over again, except on a much larger scale. It is quite disgusting.

Can I stop people from buying stupidily inefficient vehicles for non-specific purposes? No. However, I can point out the fact that they are being selfish and egocentric in their uses and abuses of those vehicles.

This all comes back to the arrogance of Americans, we believe that we shouldn't be responsible for anything because it is our *right* to drive what we want where we want and damn any consequence. This impractical point of view has caused the current and future situations.

I am not saying people should go out an buy a Prius, I am saying they should consider a I4 or v6 instead of a V8. They shlould consider a large sedan with a V6 instead of a Hemi powered monster. Many don't think relative decreases like 5 mpg matter, but they do, in many cars thats a 30% increase in efficiency.

If the entire country saved, on average, 25% and there was a 1:1 ratio to oil, then our oil consumption would go from what? 32 million barrels a day down to 24 million, that is huge.

If everybody, on average, drove a car with 30mpg, we could probably get that number under 20m barrels.

Some say that only small cars can do that. Well geez, if you stopped enticing auto makers to build tanks with craptacular gas mileage, they might just build a large sedan with good technology that will hit 30mpg. It's all about what the market wants, right now, they want to be self centered and gas hoggish.


Finally, to the point that some hybrids, such as the Lexus, don't get any better mileage. Thats because people have taken them and said "Instead of a V8, lets take a V6 and use the hybrid tech to make up the difference in power". That way you can get a 300hp engine at lesser mpg than a V8. It's a step in the right direction. However, instead of asking for a 300hp engine that you really don't need, why not just ask for a 250hp one?

[DarkFury]

if the government imposes a windfall tax, yes you will.
How... are they gonna include it with my income tax refund or are they gonna mail me a check for my portion?

Most likely, that tax will line the pockets of some politician... (but hence I'll stop there.. .before this becomes a "Political thread".)

[LegendKiller]

FEAR = Higher prices = PROFIT Not actual rising costs of production driving up prices. Are we gonna get a refund if the fear doesn't pan out? I highly doubt it... :2far:
:


Do you actually read posts or do you just cherry pick and ignore everything else. If you would *READ* my posts you would see that they are passing their additional costs per unit to you and their overhead isn't increasing with *unit* costs on a 1:1 ratio.

There are other reasons why the market is going up, not just fear. However, people look for excuses where they can find them.

[DarkFury]

Do you actually read posts or do you just cherry pick and ignore everything else. If you would *READ* my posts you would see that they are passing their additional costs per unit to you and their overhead isn't increasing with *unit* costs on a 1:1 ratio.

There are other reasons why the market is going up, not just fear. However, people look for excuses where they can find them.
That quote was IN THE FARKIN' ARTICLE... not your posts.

Stop being so dayuum mad and just read... Pffft... :hmm:

(Must be latent anger from the PF being gone... or something. SEEK HELP IMMEDIATELY!!!)

[LegendKiller]

Wow, I agree with Bush....


http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/04/28/congress.oil/index.html


Quite blaming people, point the damn finger at yourself, and buy more efficient cars. DUH! That is how prices will go down and you wont get screwed at the pump.

Exxon deserves its profits and there is no wrongdoing.

[DarkFury]

Wow, I agree with Bush....


http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/04/28/congress.oil/index.html


Quite blaming people, point the damn finger at yourself, and buy more efficient cars. DUH! That is how prices will go down and you wont get screwed at the pump.

Exxon deserves its profits and there is no wrongdoing.

Heh... you funny mang...



FROM THAT ARTICLE....

Bush says:

"My attitude is that the oil companies need to be mindful that the American people expect them to reinvest their cash flows in such a way that it enhances our energy security," Bush said, which includes investment in new pipelines, expansion of refineries and more exploration and investment in renewable sources of energy.

"They also expect to be treated fairly at the pump," The president said.


From something I posted earlier in this thread...



http://forums.gotapex.com/showpost.php?p=1010796&postcount=14

That's fine and good and all.. however, if these companies continue getting HUGE profits from this then pretty much maybe something should be done to take some of that profit and put it towards more research to reliably reduce the reliance on oil... (but then again... knowing how "big business" works, this money will just end up in someone else's pockets and not produce the desired results that help the average consumer.)

I said the SAME DAYUUM THING earlier in this thread. :heh:

[zippyjuan]

Does their retiring executive deserve a $400 million retirement package? Does anyone? http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=1841989 That is more than anyone can spend in retirement.

[clutchy]

Does their retiring executive deserve a $400 million retirement package? Does anyone? http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=1841989 That is more than anyone can spend in retirement.


i thought he worked for the company for an obscenely long time, and helped bring the company back... Anybody remember the Valdez? i'm still boycotting them because of that...

[LegendKiller]

Heh... you funny mang...



From something I posted earlier in this thread...



I said the SAME DAYUUM THING earlier in this thread. :heh:


It is not their responsibility to invest in alternative forms of energy. It is other companies, the government, and the consumer's responsibility to encourage other companies and the government to invest in those forms of research.

Leave alt forms to the people who do it best.


Does their retiring executive deserve a $400 million retirement package? Does anyone? http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=1841989 That is more than anyone can spend in retirement.


I think it's quite rediculous to make that much. However, to use that, as many do, as a reason to say "Its all of the companies fault, they are greedy, see, look at that CEO, it's all of their fault, we are not responsible for our actions, its all them" is pretty onerous.

[zippyjuan]

Add Chevron to the list of record profits- theirs is up 49 %. http://my.earthlink.net/article/top?guid=20060428/44519340_3421_1334520060428-218260145

SAN RAMON, California - Chevron Corp.'s first-quarter profit soared 49 percent to $4 billion (euro3.19 billion), joining the procession of U.S. oil companies to report colossal earnings as lawmakers consider ways to pacify motorists agitated about rising gas prices.

Chevron released its results Friday after two of its biggest rivals, ConocoPhillips and Exxon Mobil Corp., already provoked public outrage with similarly large first-quarter profits. Combined, the three oil companies earned $15.7 billion (euro12.52 billion) during the first three months of the year. That is 17 percent more than the trio made during the same time last year when they went on to pocket a combined profit of nearly $64 billion (euro51.05 billion).

"All these companies have so much money, they don't know what to do with it," said Oppenheimer & Co. analyst Fadel Gheit.


A potentially good thing (which I really don't see happening yet) is that maybe we will finally try to look at ways to curb our oil appetite, but the prices have not gone up enough for that yet. It takes a big change over a fairly long period of time to get people to change their habbits.

[LegendKiller]

Ad
A potentially good thing (which I really don't see happening yet) is that maybe we will finally try to look at ways to curb our oil appetite, but the prices have not gone up enough for that yet. It takes a big change over a fairly long period of time to get people to change their habbits.


Honestly, I wouldn't mind paying $5/gal. If anything, the government should drastically raise the gas guzzling tax, raise the MPG requirement for it, and then use those funds to give grants and subsidies to alt-energy companies.

Of course, there should be an exemption for commercial vehicles.

In fact, it would probably be a better idea to tax those who use more gas at a higher rate through a gas guzzler tax than tax those who use any gas at all.

Want that Hemi? Ok, extra 3k up front and then a yearly tax on it according to a KBB % scale (much like VA personal property tax), say $300 average.

How fast would people start buying more efficient vehicles when they get hammered 4k over 3 years? I'd say pretty damn fast.

[smeakim]

Its relevant and funny

Classic (http://news.yahoo.com/photo/060427/480/dcpm10904272019;_ylt=AotLqB4EVlm9_bd8Lw_Ya4JPtbAF;_ylu=X3oDMTBia2Jza2VjBHNlYwNnYWxsZXJ5)

[zippyjuan]

Good one Smeakim! Proof that congress is only posturing and not taking any serious action. But that is nothing new. I think LK has an interesting idea. Using a "sin tax" to discourage what is believed to be bad behavior and using the revenues to encourage good behavior. Like the cigarette taxes used to discourage people from smoking. Although most of that money is now being spent on other things. I should add that I do not drive a car. I am close enough to walk to work and use a bike or walk the rest of the time.

[ShawnLee]

Good one Smeakim! Proof that congress is only posturing and not taking any serious action. But that is nothing new.While I agree in general, I have to give them the benefit of the doubt. Perhaps there's a security reason that they needed to transfer into the other cars, or something similar. Still funny.

[gwilks98]

Good one Smeakim! Proof that congress is only posturing and not taking any serious action. But that is nothing new. I think LK has an interesting idea. Using a "sin tax" to discourage what is believed to be bad behavior and using the revenues to encourage good behavior. Like the cigarette taxes used to discourage people from smoking. Although most of that money is now being spent on other things. I should add that I do not drive a car. I am close enough to walk to work and use a bike or walk the rest of the time.

I cringe every time someone thinks a tax will solve anything.

[LegendKiller]

I cringe every time someone thinks a tax will solve anything.


It's worked in europe. It has worked here with smoking, which is on the decline. Sure, there is frictional loss with taxes, but the overall social benefit can be huge.

I cringe at government influence over people's lives. I am far from a socialist. However, people need a wake up call, we need to change our outlook on fuel economy.

[DarkFury]

It is not their responsibility to invest in alternative forms of energy. It is other companies, the government, and the consumer's responsibility to encourage other companies and the government to invest in those forms of research.

Leave alt forms to the people who do it best.
Well you made it a point to point out that Bush supported "your Point of view"... I just wanted to show you that not all that he said did. Take the good with the bad and the ugly... I suppose. :shrug:

I guess you need to retract your "I agree with Bush" statement.. huh? :heh:

[LegendKiller]

Well you made it a point to point out that Bush supported "your Point of view"... I just wanted to show you that not all that he said did. Take the good with the bad and the ugly... I suppose. :shrug:

I guess you need to retract your "I agree with Bush" statement.. huh? :heh:

So, I cannot agree with somebody on one point and disagree with them on another?

Did I mention that I agree with him about that point, or his one about the fact that we need to change our fuel economy standards.

Yet again, somebody trying to point blame through obfuscation at somebody else.

[BigJon]

There is some pent-up anger in here....

[LegendKiller]

There is some pent-up anger in here....

None here.

[DarkFury]

So, I cannot agree with somebody on one point and disagree with them on another?

Did I mention that I agree with him about that point, or his one about the fact that we need to change our fuel economy standards.

Yet again, somebody trying to point blame through obfuscation at somebody else.
Your original point didn't state that you agreed and disagreed with his statements... You gave a "blanket statement"...

Here is what you said...


Wow, I agree with Bush....


http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/04/28/congress.oil/index.html

Then you added your own opinion to the rest of that post. Don't fault me because we can't ASSUME what parts of that article you chose to support.

But hell.. I guess if you wanna "pick and choose" your argument (using any "sound bite" that supports your cause)...then anything is possible. Sure makes the point MOOT doesn't it? :shrug:


There is some pent-up anger in here....
Yup... sure is. (as I also pointed out earlier)

and denial is just the first stage of it. :heh:

[LegendKiller]

Your original point didn't state that you agreed and disagreed with his statements... You gave a "blanket statement"...

Here is what you said...

Then you added your own opinion to the rest of that post. Don't fault me because we can't ASSUME what parts of that article you chose to support.

But hell.. I guess if you wanna "pick and choose" your arguement... anything is possible. Sure makes the point MOOT doesn't it? :shrug:


Yup... sure is. (as I also pointed out earlier)

and denial is just the first stage of it. :heh:

Ahh yes, the whole "selective quote". You forgot this part.



Quite blaming people, point the damn finger at yourself, and buy more efficient cars. DUH! That is how prices will go down and you wont get screwed at the pump.

Denial is the first state DF. You deny you are the cause of your own problems.

[DarkFury]

Ahh yes, the whole "selective quote". You forgot this part.



Quite blaming people, point the damn finger at yourself, and buy more efficient cars. DUH! That is how prices will go down and you wont get screwed at the pump.

Denial is the first state DF. You deny you are the cause of your own problems.
Dayuum man.. You REALLY don't read what I post.

I addressed that part as "your own opinion" of the subject... not a quote from what Bush said.

Dayuuuum.. I give up. If you ain't even gonna pay attention to what I said... why should I even bother trying to continue saying it.

Whatever mang.... carry on, be mad at me and the world who doesn't do things the way YOU do things... Honestly... I don't really care anymore discussing this with you (like we actually discussed it... more like post and ignore what is posted from what I see.).

Time for me to go home anyways... I'll sure enjoy the drive in my HEMI... and I might even stop and get gas on the way home. :D

HAVE A NICE DAY! :wavey:

[MikeD]

I'll sure enjoy the drive in my HEMI... and I might even stop and get gas on the way home. :D

Would that be by choice, or by necessity? :hehehmm: