GilbertsGrape

i need a new catalytic converter for my 98 Dodge dakota. Does any one know where i can find one for cheap. also will after mkt catalytic converter work on my truck? if so where can i find one.

also is it possable to repair a catalytic converter on my truck? it is making a radeling noise

GilbertsGrape

i dont have a midus with in 200 miles of me. i am stuck with local yocals. well i could drive 35 miles and go to a mopar dealer.


are those universal converters any count.

What about this converter?


http://www.catalyticonverters.com/DODAKOTA91859698.html

mechmike0034

Where are you?

How many miles on the truck?

Unless there's physical damage (you drug the cat over a speed bump or something similar) it is warranted by law for 8 years/80K miles. In California it's 10/100 (I believe...)

Has the truck ever backfired? This can cause converter rattle. Have you had any other performance problems? Misfires can damage converters. Make sure the root cause for the failure is identified and repaired and the truck is performing properly once you replace the converter.

Avoid aftermarket converters on any 1996 or newer vehicle. OBD-II uses upstream and downstream O2 sensors to measure converter oxygen storage capacity, and aftermarket converters as a general rule don't have the same capacity as OE.

I don't believe your current converter can be successfully repaired.

__________________
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GilbertsGrape

i could not find anyhting on a warenty on the converter.

i am in SouthEasern Ky.

the truck has 74k miles on it. the crap in the converer ratles around real bad.

mechmike0034

Beginning with the 1995 model year, the Federal emissions components warranty is 2 years, 24K miles on all components except for the Powertrain Control Module (main engine control computer) and the Catalytic Converter, which are warranted 8 years, 80K miles.

From http://www.sema.org/content/?ID=22238:

2. Clean Air Act Warranty Provisions (42 U.S.C. S 7541 (C) (3) (B))

The federal Clean Air Act requires vehicle makers to provide two emissions-related warranties -- a production warranty and a performance warranty. The production warranty requires the vehicle maker to warrant that the vehicle is designed, built and equipped so that it conforms with emissions requirements at the time of sale. The performance warranty requires the vehicle maker to warrant that the vehicle will comply with applicable emissions requirements as tested under state vehicle emissions inspection programs for the warranty periods specified in the law (for model year 1995 and later vehicles, the warranty is 2 years/24,000 miles for all emissions-related parts and 8 years/80,000 miles for the catalytic converter, electronic emissions control unit and on-board diagnostic device). The performance warranty is conditioned on the vehicle being properly maintained and operated. (My bold...)

See your friendly neighborhood Dodge dealer...

GilbertsGrape

Good Deal I called my dealer it is covered.


Thank you
gary

mechmike0034

Not a problem...

After all, a new OE unit for free beats the stuffings out of paying for either a new ($$$) or aftermarket (maybe it'll work, maybe not...) one.

It is actually illegal and considered tampering (in the eyes of the Feds) to replace an OE converter with an aftermarket one while the 8/80 warranty applies.

mechmike0034

What are we being protected from? A FREE repair?

Why would you buy an aftermarket converter in this case when you could get an OE converter for free?

MM has nothing at all to do with Federal emissions compliance.

SupraRZ

Just buy a random high flow cat and have it welded in place by a muffler shop. Hell, go straight pipe j/k

mechmike0034

My apologies, it was late and I was irritated with something totally unrelated to the subject at hand.

Do you forgive me, CNO DF? Good!

After a good night's sleep, let's try this again, from the top...

Let me preface my comments by stating that I am not a lawyer and don't even play one on TV...

My understanding of Magnuson Moss is that a vehicle manufacturer cannot specify that their own replacement parts be used to keep said manufacturer's warranty valid unless those replacement parts are provided for free...

With emissions compliance, it's a whole different deal. The law requires that vehicles sold here meet emissions standards not only at the time of manufacture, but (in theory) for the expected life of the vehicle. That being said, the vehicle manufacturer therefore has some liability for maintaining that emissions compliance, even though the manufacturer has no physical control of that vehicle after it is sold.

Again, from SEMA: http://www.sema.org/content/?ID=22238

(Quote)

Federal Warranty Laws

1.) The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act (15 U.S.C. 2302(C))

This federal law regulates warranties for the protection of consumers. The essence of this law concerning aftermarket auto parts is that a vehicle manufacturer may not condition a written or implied warranty on the consumers using parts or services which are identified by brand, trade, or corporate name (such as the vehicle makers brand) unless the parts or service are provided free of charge. The law means that the use of an aftermarket part alone is not cause for denying the warranty. However, the law's protection does not extend to aftermarket parts in situations where such parts actually caused the damage being claimed under the warranty. Further, consumers are advised to be aware of any specific terms or conditions stated in the warranty which may result in its being voided. The law states in relevant part:

“No warrantor of a consumer product may condition his written or implied warranty of such product on the consumers using, in connection with such product, any article or service (other than article or service provided without charge under the terms of the warranty) which is identified by brand, trade or corporate name....” (15 U.S.C. 2302(C)).

2.) Clean Air Act Warranty Provisions (42 U.S.C. S 7541 (C) (3) (B))

The federal Clean Air Act requires vehicle makers to provide two emissions-related warranties -- a production warranty and a performance warranty. The production warranty requires the vehicle maker to warrant that the vehicle is designed, built and equipped so that it conforms with emissions requirements at the time of sale. The performance warranty requires the vehicle maker to warrant that the vehicle will comply with applicable emissions requirements as tested under state vehicle emissions inspection programs for the warranty periods specified in the law (for model year 1995 and later vehicles, the warranty is 2 years/24,000 miles for all emissions-related parts and 8 years/80,000 miles for the catalytic converter, electronic emissions control unit and on-board diagnostic device). The performance warranty is conditioned on the vehicle being properly maintained and operated.

Like the Magnuson-Moss Act, vehicle manufacturers may not refuse warranty repairs under the Clean Air Acts performance and defect warranties merely because aftermarket parts have been installed on the vehicle. The only circumstance under which the vehicle manufacturer can void the emissions warranties is if an aftermarket part is responsible for (causes) the warranty claim.”

(End Quote)

That last sentence ties it together (in my feeble mind, anyway). If the vehicle manufacturer is charged (in the eyes of the law) with maintaining emissions compliance for a specific time and mileage , that manufacturer should not and would not be held responsible if an aftermarket part not installed by said manufacturer caused emissions non-compliance. My opinion, for whatever it may or may not be worth, is that the “tampering” definition that you question was “given some teeth” by the EPA by making it illegal, and that this was done to appease the vehicle manufacturers.

If you desire more information than I have provided, Google “Magnuson Moss” or “Clean Air Act”. I also have a contact at the EPA that I can provide to you in a PM if you’d like.

mechmike0034

Also, here's a .pdf from your own home state (You are in Indy, correct?) that talks about the "tampering" issue...

http://www.state.in.us/idem/ctap/veh...anual/cats.pdf

Though this just states that installation of an aftermarket converter is illegal while the 8/80 warranty is in effect - it doesn't elaborate as to why...

mechmike0034

More info here: http://www.off-road.com/dodge/tech/Emissions_Legal.htm

This page includes links and Q & A notes from real live EPA folks...

EOT?

GilbertsGrape

Wow... and you would thing after going to 3 shops they would have voluntary told me it was under warranty..... But i guess not..... 3 ppl you cant trust lawyers, republicans, and Mechanics..... j/k

mechmike0034

Hey, Gary...

What's the difference between ignorance and apathy?

I don't know, and I don't care...

That's not aimed at you, but at the three shops that failed, for whatever the reason...

The older I get, the less I take what I am told at face value - better to research it myself and draw my own conclusions...

mechmike0034

Props from DF! Day-yum - does it get any better than this? I think not!

GilbertsGrape

ok ok ,,,, i took my truck to the deal and they Fu@k@d it up real bad... messed up the up stream airo2 sencor. my truck will not do better than 30 mph now and it backfires, and has no poter will not pull up hills i didnt think i was going to make it home. then the dealer tried to charge me for the sensor that was messed up by them .... i told them i dont think so... i saked them you are going ot fix this at no charge correct .. .they where like no blah blah ... i was like yes you are it was working b4 i took it to you and now it is broke it is your responsibabilty to repair it.


now another questoin does this sensor have the same 8/80k warranty?

GilbertsGrape

for model year 1995 and later vehicles, the warranty is 2 years/24,000 miles for all emissions-related parts and 8 years/80,000 miles for the catalytic converter, electronic emissions control unit and on-board diagnostic device). The performance warranty is conditioned on the vehicle being properly maintained and operated.

"electronic emissions control unit and on-board diagnostic device"
is that the up stream sensor?

mechmike0034

No, that would be the PCM, which is the main engine control computer.

Ask the dealership service manager for contact information for the DaimlerChrysler District Service Rep.

GilbertsGrape

woot the exhaust and sensor problems are fixed. my truck sounds like a new one. (that one dealership hopes to never see me again and i will NEVER go back so they have no worries)

anyways now my AC is not as cold as it use to be. it takes the new R whaterver stuff. is there something i can put in it to make it better .. .it still works just not as good or as cold. . it is a 1998. how hard it it to recharge. i have done the R12 stuff years ago with the hose and 3 or 4 cans of that stuff. (cant do tht any more got to have a paper or soemthing) anyways is the new stuff regulated like that or can i buy it. and is it as easy to install as the old?

thx.
grape

mechmike0034

PM me with your location (city) and I'll find a shop that can check it out for you.

I would discourage an attempt at DIY A/C repair on an r134a system. I'm probably gonna get roasted for this, but this is one area where if you don't know what you're doing you really need to leave it to a professional.

Modern r134a A/C systems are very sensitive to under or overcharge. Plus, the problem may not be refrigerant level at all.

If it is a refrigerant level issue, then you have a leak. Adding refrigerant may temporarily improve cooling but it won't repair the leak. Topping up a leaking system is like replacing a broken window with plastic and duct tape...

Running a system that is low on refrigerant can damage it because the lubricating oil inside is carried by the refrigerant; meaning that a system that "short-cycles" due to low refrigerant levels is also starving the compressor for oil.

As the refrigerant leaks out, it is replaced by air and moisture which react chemically with the refrigerant and oil remaining in the system. Hydroflouric (sp?) acid forms, which can damage system components.

In short, fix it right, or turn it off and roll the window down...

GilbertsGrape

no worries i fixed it my self. i got one of those kits from walmart with the gauge freon/leak stop/ oil/ conditioner and hose

it worked great i was just a little low about 10 oz. now it cools like a new one. fixed it for likr 23 bux the shop wanted 40 just to hook it up to their machine.

GilbertsGrape

while i was at it. i converded mom's non working R12 system on her 93
ford explorer over to R134a and it works great.