Interesting auto toy- ScanGauge

pd123 · 10-02-2005, 10:43 PM

I found this at a Honda forum, though it is a Ford device, it works well on the Honda. Shows all kinds of things like MPG, trouble codes, trans fluid temp etc, it's also a trip computer. It takes a moment to install if your car is a 1996 or higher, works on a few 1994 and 1995. The cost is $129 shipped. Anyone ever hear of it? http://www.scanguage.com/ If you want to see forum discussions, go to www.odyclub.com and search for either scangauge or scan gauge. Most everyone loves it but they are critical of the cheap look of it.

mechmike0034 · 10-03-2005, 07:52 PM

'96 and up is OBD-II, for which there are generic trouble codes and data available on most any vehicle. This probably will not get you manufacturer-specific data, but that's not a bad thing unless you're a hardcore working tech.

The trip computer stuff is from that device itself - that information is not part of OBD-II data.

There are several applications of this sort or similar available that run on a PDA as well. There's also laptop software available.

tupacboy · 10-04-2005, 11:13 AM

i think u can rent one of these for free at autozone...

ski · 10-05-2005, 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tupacboy

i think u can rent one of these for free at autozone...

My buddy has a Nissan Pathfinder, and the "Service Engine" light or whatever it was came on, so he went to AutoZone and I think they just hooked one of these up really fast. He got the error code, and consulted whatever big Pathfinder book he has (Hughes maybe? I can't remember the name, they make books on how to fix certain cars). I think they did it for free or cheap.

mechmike0034 · 10-05-2005, 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ski

My buddy has a Nissan Pathfinder, and the "Service Engine" light or whatever it was came on, so he went to AutoZone and I think they just hooked one of these up really fast. He got the error code, and consulted whatever big Pathfinder book he has (Hughes maybe? I can't remember the name, they make books on how to fix certain cars). I think they did it for free or cheap.

I wish it were that easy in every case. As an example, a DTC (diagnostic trouble code) for an oxygen sensor problem does not necessarily mean a faulty sensor itself.

People don't understand that looking at DTCs and onboard data and interpreting that data are, in many instances, two completely different things. The tool doesn't fix the car, the person holding the tool does.

To draw a medical parallel, a tech takes an x-ray, but the Doctor analyzes and interprets it and charts an appropriate course of action based upon those results.

There is no "machine" that fixes the car or tells exactly what the problem or anomaly is. Codes and data are the start of the diagnostic process, not the end.

mechmike0034 · 10-05-2005, 04:55 PM

Here's an example - plus I need to clarify some points made by the author, which I'll do below:

Quote:

October 5, 2005

YOUR WHEELS

By Ralph Vartabedian, Times Staff Writer

If your new car warranty has expired, a common belief is that you can save money on repairs and maintenance by finding a good independent mechanic, avoiding the dealership service department.

Though often true, that common belief sometimes has its faults. A simple example involves special extended warranty programs offered by car manufacturers to cover defective parts.

Dealerships know all about these goodwill programs, but independent shops sometimes do not. As a result, you can end up paying for a repair that would be fully covered by the manufacturer.

Among the very largest of these extended warranty programs is one currently offered by Ford Motor Co. on an emission control device used on millions of vehicles produced between 2000 and 2002, including its big selling F-100 pickup truck and its Taurus passenger car. It is a good case study of the issue.

The part is known by the unwieldy name "tube mounted exhaust gas recirculation pressure sensor." It is part of the emission control system that sends a small percentage of exhaust gas back into the engine's combustion chamber to help improve the burning of fuel and reduce emissions.

He's doing OK so far. EGR, or Exhaust Gas Recirculation, actually reduces NOx emissions by reducing combustion chamber temperatures below the threshold where NOx forms. NOx is photochemical, meaning it reacts with sunlight to form smog. This is a simplified explanation, so please no flames from the chemical engineers in the audience.

Fords use a couple of different types of sensors (depending upon model/year/engine) to determine whether exhaust gas actually flows into the cylinders whenever the engine control computer commands the EGR valve to open. The one mentioned here measures pressure drop across a calibrated orifice in the EGR plumbing to determine EGR flow.

Quote:

Under Ford's original warranty program for cars sold in California, the part was covered for three years or 50,000 miles. Under the extended warranty program, it is covered for five years or 74,000 miles. So, the extended warranty is covering cars at an age when most owners aren't thinking they have warranty coverage.

When Ford discovered a problem, it sent out letters notifying dealers. Ford mechanics know all about the program. Almost every dealership has replaced hundreds of these sensors.

Ford also sent out letters to owners, though such notifications often fail to reach individuals who move or who are second owners — or they can simply get tossed aside.

If the part is tricky to understand, diagnosing the problem can also have its pitfalls. In a few vehicles, the defect can cause hesitation, engine surging or stalling on start-up, according to a Ford letter to dealers in June 2004, which was republished by Alldata, a car-repair information service.

Not to worry, says Ford. "None of these conditions will cause engine damage or failure, but they may decrease the customer's satisfaction with their vehicle," the letter says. It's so nice of Ford to think about customer satisfaction.

DF will jump in here, I am sure...

Quote:

In most cases, the only warning of the problem and the only way to diagnose it comes from the check-engine light on the dashboard. The check-engine light is part of a diagnostic system on every car. With a code reader, a mechanic can extract various engine problem codes.

In this case, the system would report one of four codes, such as a P1400, indicating the sensor is reporting a low voltage.

The other error codes would warn of other problems, such as excessive or insufficient exhaust flow past the sensor.

So, if the dealership mechanic gets one of the four engine trouble codes indicated in Ford's extended warranty program, you get a free sensor. End of story? Not really.

In some cases, a car's diagnostic system will not report one of the four error codes, but some other problem. In some cases, it will report that there is an oxygen sensor malfunction. Why? Because the diagnostic system finds excessive emissions and wrongly thinks the problem is being created by oxygen sensors.

These oxygen sensors can cost hundreds of dollars to replace. This is not a theoretical issue, but a common problem with diagnostic systems.

In the worst of all worlds, an independent mechanic would replace the oxygen sensors and the owner would still have a defective exhaust gas recirculation sensor, which would probably later cause a new error code.

What are the lessons here? Independent shops can be fine, but if you use one make sure it subscribes to a service that publishes all the recall notices, technical service bulletins and other information commonly available to dealership mechanics. Alldata and Mitchell Repair Online are two major publishers of such information.

This is assuming that the technician working on the vehicle goes to the trouble of searching their repair information for technical service bulletins related to the problem. This also assumes that the technician working on the vehicle understands how the system is supposed to work to start with.

I fought these two issues for years as a technical trainer - gather and search information BEFORE attacking the problem, and you might wind up with an easy answer. Even if a shop HAS this repair information (it is DVD or internet-based) some do not go to the trouble of doing a bulletin search. Service information tends to be like MS Word in the real world - 90% of those that use it only use 10% of what the program is capable of.

The next section is where my opinion differs greatly:

Quote:

Second, with a little hands-on effort, a smart car owner can save lots of money. If you are capable of taking care of a home computer, you are probably technically adept enough to pay attention to your car's diagnostic system.

For about $100, you can buy a trouble code reader and extract codes — just as the mechanic did with the check-engine light. The code readers plug into the car's computer through a socket under the steering wheel. You don't even have to get your hands greasy.

Third, for a small fee, you can buy the technical service bulletins for your car. These bulletins are available online for an annual fee from Alldata (www.alldata.com). I don't know of any other service that provides them.

Here's the gotcha - even if there's a bulletin on the problem, and even if the vehicle owner reads and comprehends that bulletin, there's still no real-world guarantee that the fix stated in the bulletin will actually repair the problem.

This is also the problem, IMHO, with the free AutoZone diagnosis. They'd see the codes, probably not search the bulletins (even though AutoZone OWNS Alldata...) and sell you oxygen sensors. Oxygen sensors that they won't take back once you've installed them only to discover that they won't fix the problem...

Quote:

Free summaries of technical service bulletins are also available from the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration at http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/problems . But its search engine leaves a lot to be desired. For example, it failed to list the Ford technical service bulletin on the defective sensor.

I've never had any luck with NHTSA, either - don't get me started on their bureaucratic uselessness...

Quote:

Finally, there are many good independent mechanics and good dealerships. It makes perfect sense to shop around and figure out what kind of service works best for you.

Ralph Vartabedian can be reached at ralph.vatabedian@latimes.com.

Anyway, there's more to diagnostics at times than meets the eye. I am not anti-Do It Yourself, but it really isn't as easy as some make it out to be. Service information (factory or aftermarket) can be misread, misinterpreted, or, sometimes just plain wrong. Also, all the training and information in the world won't give you hands-on, real world experience in applying that information to solving the problem.

Thanks for reading my rant, assuming you made it this far.

Arch113 · 10-06-2005, 06:03 AM

I have one.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pd123

I found this at a Honda forum, though it is a Ford device, it works well on the Honda. Shows all kinds of things like MPG, trouble codes, trans fluid temp etc, it's also a trip computer. It takes a moment to install if your car is a 1996 or higher, works on a few 1994 and 1995. The cost is $129 shipped. Anyone ever hear of it? http://www.scanguage.com/ If you want to see forum discussions, go to www.odyclub.com and search for either scangauge or scan gauge. Most everyone loves it but they are critical of the cheap look of it.

MikeD · 10-06-2005, 07:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tupacboy

rent one of these for free

pd123 · 10-06-2005, 08:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arch113

I have one.

How do you like it and which version do you have? The 1st version was v.1.08 and the newer ones are v.2.0. If you have an older version, you can send your unit in with $45 for the upgrade. They talk about it here... http://www.odyclub.com/forums/showth...threadid=26628

Arch113 · 10-06-2005, 05:50 PM

I don't know what version I have. I do like it, I have a '02 chevy, and it works great.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pd123

How do you like it and which version do you have? The 1st version was v.1.08 and the newer ones are v.2.0. If you have an older version, you can send your unit in with $45 for the upgrade. They talk about it here... http://www.odyclub.com/forums/showth...threadid=26628

PrObLy · 10-06-2005, 06:43 PM

mechmike, I agree that a lot of the time it's not a simple 1-2-3 read the error code, go buy a part, and presto, problem solved....but it does happen.

I really don't see any problem with getting the free autozone OBDII scan and taking a look at what error code you get, because, it very well could be something simple.

Example: my sister recently purchased a new car so my dad gave her a couple thousand dollars in exchange for her LeBaron to sell privately.

The problem? Well, the check engine light was stuck on. Not long ago we took to the garage for a weekend and replaced the O2 sensor, fuel pump, fuel filter, and spark plugs (all of these needed replacing anyway, particularly the dead fuel pump). We were hoping the light wasn't the indication of a more serious problem. So, my dad gave me the tasks of figuring out what the error code was and how to fix it.

What I did was used the manual diagnostic system which was activated by something like pulling the e-brake and cycling on-off-on-off-on-off-on. It read off a couple error codes and I looked them up in the big ugly Chilton manual. EGR valve. Ok, I said. Popped open the hood, checked the EGR valve/solenoid connection and sure enough one of the prongs in the electrical connection had come loose and then fell off when I took it apart.

I went to rockauto.com, ordered up a new EGR valve and two days later had the light shut off and only spent a total of ~50 dollars.

I do realize that a lot of the time the error codes can be misleading and point you to only the beginning of a problem, but sometimes it can be a quick and simple fix that may have been overlooked.

mechmike0034 · 10-06-2005, 09:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PrObLy

What I did was used the manual diagnostic system which was activated by something like pulling the e-brake and cycling on-off-on-off-on-off-on. It read off a couple error codes and I looked them up in the big ugly Chilton manual. EGR valve. Ok, I said. Popped open the hood, checked the EGR valve/solenoid connection and sure enough one of the prongs in the electrical connection had come loose and then fell off when I took it apart.

I went to rockauto.com, ordered up a new EGR valve and two days later had the light shut off and only spent a total of ~50 dollars.

I do realize that a lot of the time the error codes can be misleading and point you to only the beginning of a problem, but sometimes it can be a quick and simple fix that may have been overlooked.

Here's the difference - it is also what makes you a little smarter than the "average bear" - you read the code (Chrysler products pre-'96 require NO tools to read codes using just the method you describe) and then LOOKED AT the EGR valve to see if you could see an obvious problem. I applaud your "horse sense"!

So many others (even so-called "professionals") see the light, pull the code, look the code up, and replace any and all parts related to it.

You actually diagnosed the problem. Even if you didn't know how to actually test the valve, you at least verified the obvious, which found your problem.

pd123 · 04-05-2007, 08:41 PM

I'm resurrecting this old thread, I just ordered the newer version of Scangauge II http://www.scangage.com/products/ There are a few group buys, I paid $140.

10-02-2005, 10:43 PM	#1
pd123 Commander Join Date: Apr 2000 Posts: 1,465	Interesting auto toy- ScanGauge I found this at a Honda forum, though it is a Ford device, it works well on the Honda. Shows all kinds of things like MPG, trouble codes, trans fluid temp etc, it's also a trip computer. It takes a moment to install if your car is a 1996 or higher, works on a few 1994 and 1995. The cost is $129 shipped. Anyone ever hear of it? http://www.scanguage.com/ If you want to see forum discussions, go to www.odyclub.com and search for either scangauge or scan gauge. Most everyone loves it but they are critical of the cheap look of it.

10-03-2005, 07:52 PM	#2
mechmike0034 aka the keg killer Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Ala-effin'-bama! Posts: 2,738	'96 and up is OBD-II, for which there are generic trouble codes and data available on most any vehicle. This probably will not get you manufacturer-specific data, but that's not a bad thing unless you're a hardcore working tech. The trip computer stuff is from that device itself - that information is not part of OBD-II data. There are several applications of this sort or similar available that run on a PDA as well. There's also laptop software available. __________________ "The price of progress is trouble." (C. F. "Boss" Kettering) "50% of the American public has below-average intelligence. 70% of the American public now has regular access to the Internet. Do the math." (unknown)

10-06-2005, 06:43 PM	#11
PrObLy Commander Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Orland Park Posts: 1,083	mechmike, I agree that a lot of the time it's not a simple 1-2-3 read the error code, go buy a part, and presto, problem solved....but it does happen. I really don't see any problem with getting the free autozone OBDII scan and taking a look at what error code you get, because, it very well could be something simple. Example: my sister recently purchased a new car so my dad gave her a couple thousand dollars in exchange for her LeBaron to sell privately. The problem? Well, the check engine light was stuck on. Not long ago we took to the garage for a weekend and replaced the O2 sensor, fuel pump, fuel filter, and spark plugs (all of these needed replacing anyway, particularly the dead fuel pump). We were hoping the light wasn't the indication of a more serious problem. So, my dad gave me the tasks of figuring out what the error code was and how to fix it. What I did was used the manual diagnostic system which was activated by something like pulling the e-brake and cycling on-off-on-off-on-off-on. It read off a couple error codes and I looked them up in the big ugly Chilton manual. EGR valve. Ok, I said. Popped open the hood, checked the EGR valve/solenoid connection and sure enough one of the prongs in the electrical connection had come loose and then fell off when I took it apart. I went to rockauto.com, ordered up a new EGR valve and two days later had the light shut off and only spent a total of ~50 dollars. I do realize that a lot of the time the error codes can be misleading and point you to only the beginning of a problem, but sometimes it can be a quick and simple fix that may have been overlooked. __________________ Facebook me if you so desire. Guns don't kill people. Chad Greenway kills people. Last edited by PrObLy : 10-06-2005 at 06:45 PM.

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10-04-2005, 11:13 AM	#3
tupacboy Rear Admiral Lower Half Join Date: May 2000 Location: border of oc and la Posts: 2,382	i think u can rent one of these for free at autozone...

04-05-2007, 08:41 PM	#13
pd123 Commander Join Date: Apr 2000 Posts: 1,465	I'm resurrecting this old thread, I just ordered the newer version of Scangauge II http://www.scangage.com/products/ There are a few group buys, I paid $140.

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