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Old 11-14-2005, 12:19 PM   #1
Itsme
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A-Rod captures AL MVP

A-Rod captures AL MVP
New York, NY (Sports Network) - New York Yankees third baseman Alex Rodriguez was named the American League Most Valuable Player for the second time in his career.

Rodriguez first captured the award as a shortstop with the Texas Rangers in 2003 and became the first Yankee honored as MVP since the 1985 triumph by Don Mattingly, who now serves as New York's hitting coach.

Finishing a close second in the voting was Boston Red Sox slugger David Ortiz, who would have become the first designated hitter to win the award.

Rodriguez received 16 first-place votes from members of the Baseball Writers' Association of America, 11 second-place tallies and one third-place vote for a total of 331 points.

Ortiz garnered 11 first-place votes and 17 second-place votes for 307 points.

Last year's winner, Vladimir Guerrero of the Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim, finished third. He received one first-place vote and 196 points.

Rodriguez, Ortiz and Guerrero were the only players named on all 28 ballots.

Boston's Manny Ramirez finished fourth in the voting and Cleveland's Travis Hafner was fifth. Paul Konerko of the World Series champion Chicago White Sox was next, followed by Texas' Mark Teixeira and three more Yankees -- Gary Sheffield, Mariano Rivera and Derek Jeter.

In his second season with the Yankees, Rodriguez set a club record for home runs by a right-handed hitter with 48, topping the old mark of 46 set in 1937 by the legendary Joe DiMaggio. Rodriguez's home run total led the American League and was the most by a third baseman in league history, eclipsing the 46 hit by Troy Glaus of the Angels in 2000.

Rodriguez is only the fourth third baseman to win the AL MVP, joining Cleveland's Al Rosen in 1953, Baltimore's Brooks Robinson in 1964 and Kansas City's George Brett in 1980.

It marked the 19th time a Yankee has been honored as league MVP -- most of any team in baseball history. DiMaggio, Yogi Berra and Mickey Mantle each won three MVP awards, while Roger Maris captured two while with New York. Lou Gehrig, Joe Gordon, Spud Chandler, Phil Rizzuto, Elston Howard, Thurman Munson and Mattingly each won it once.

Rodriguez also became the fourth player to win the MVP at two positions, joining Detroit's Hank Greenberg, who won in 1935 as a first baseman and in 1940 as an outfielder; Milwaukee's Robin Yount, who first won as a shortstop in 1982 and then as an outfielder in 1989; and St. Louis Cardinals Hall of Famer Stan Musial, who won as an outfielder in 1943 and '48 and as a first baseman in 1946.

The 30-year-old Rodriguez joined Barry Bonds, Jimmie Foxx and Frank Robinson as the only players to win an MVP award with different teams.

In addition to his home run numbers, Rodriguez also drove in 130 runs, finished second in the league with a .321 batting average and led the AL in runs scored with 124 and slugging percentage at .610. He also played a very solid third base, which may have been the difference in the balloting.

Ortiz was an unbelievably clutch performer for the Red Sox, but may have been hurt in the voting because of his status as a designated hitter. He led the majors with 148 runs batted in while batting .300 with 47 home runs.

Guerrero finished his second season in Anaheim with 32 homers, 107 runs batted in and a .317 batting average.

A total of 28 players received votes.

The National League MVP will be announced Tuesday.
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Old 11-14-2005, 12:31 PM   #2
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Boo. Should have been Papi...

:
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Old 11-14-2005, 12:55 PM   #3
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While I'm a bit biased since I'm a Yanks fan . . . I really would find it difficult to name a DH as the MVP . . . especially if there was a position player who had nearly - if not better - offensive stats . . . especially if the position player is one of the better fielders at his position in the league.

Ortiz is a badass hitter . . . without a doubt . . . but he's absent for half the game.
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Old 11-14-2005, 01:05 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Butch
While I'm a bit biased since I'm a Yanks fan . . . I really would find it difficult to name a DH as the MVP . . . especially if there was a position player who had nearly - if not better - offensive stats . . . especially if the position player is one of the better fielders at his position in the league.

Ortiz is a badass hitter . . . without a doubt . . . but he's absent for half the game.
Which, if you've ever seen him play 1st base, should be considered extra contribution .

But really, you gotta look at it like this. Who would be hurting worse, the Yanks without A-Rod, or the Sox without the Chocolate Babe Ruth? That one should be easy to anyone who watched the two teams all year. Big Papi in a landslide.
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Old 11-14-2005, 01:20 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeD
Boo. Should have been Papi...

:
Nah, Alex put up better numbers across the board while playing half his games in a pitchers park. Fenway Park is a pretty extreme hitters park. Layer the defense on top of that and it is pretty clear which player was more deserving.

Looking at the votes I can't believe that Vlad came in 3rd and got one first place vote. Now I love Vlad but he did miss over 20 games due to injury. You've got to play pretty much all the games to deserve that many votes.
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Old 11-14-2005, 08:51 PM   #6
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Way to Go AROD!!
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Old 11-14-2005, 09:49 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeD
Boo. Should have been Papi...

:
boo you

you gotta read Alex's life story. it makes it even more awesome that he got it.
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Old 11-14-2005, 11:02 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Merlin
Nah, Alex put up better numbers across the board while playing half his games in a pitchers park. Fenway Park is a pretty extreme hitters park. Layer the defense on top of that and it is pretty clear which player was more deserving.

Looking at the votes I can't believe that Vlad came in 3rd and got one first place vote. Now I love Vlad but he did miss over 20 games due to injury. You've got to play pretty much all the games to deserve that many votes.
The award is most VALUABLE player, not Best Stats Player. The way I always think of it is "If you removed this player from his team, what impact would it have?" If a guy hits 70 home runs, but strikes out in every clutch situation, he's not as valuable as a guy who hits 30 homeruns but always gets his team the runs they need to win the game.
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Old 11-14-2005, 11:18 PM   #9
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papi should have won... arod as donald trump says... scores when it doesn't matter...
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Old 11-15-2005, 05:47 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ialsohaveadream
.....The way I always think of it is "If you removed this player from his team, what impact would it have?"...
I really don't like that logic as it tends to evaluate the overall team (is it a deep team with a lot of people contributing vs. contributions from only a few) rather than the player.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ialsohaveadream
The award is most VALUABLE player, not Best Stats Player.
If you don't want to use stats then what do we use? Tea Leaves? You can go by anecdotal evidence if you want but I prefer methods that stand up to scrutiny.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ialsohaveadream
....clutch situation...
There has been a lot of stastical analysis done in this area and the results are fairly conclusive...there is really no such thing as a player who can, over time, hit better in "clutch" situations. A player is who he is regardless of inning or score. Yes, over small samples you can see things but that is a stastical abberation. It is not a popular notion because we as people like the romantic notion of players being able to be better when it matters but the reality is different.

Last edited by Merlin : 11-15-2005 at 05:53 AM.
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Old 11-15-2005, 07:22 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Merlin
I really don't like that logic as it tends to evaluate the overall team (is it a deep team with a lot of people contributing vs. contributions from only a few) rather than the player.

Well, the logic does make sense though. No doubt that the Yankees lineup was deeper from top to bottom, so the following could be concluded:

A-Rod had more protection, so was pitched around less.
A-Rod had more RBI opportunities due to the previously mentioned deep lineup.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Merlin
If you don't want to use stats then what do we use? Tea Leaves? You can go by anecdotal evidence if you want but I prefer methods that stand up to scrutiny.

Sure, you have to go by stats. This is the thinking though: which is more impressive, A-Rod going .310/45/120 with the Yankees, or Mike Sweeney going .290/40/105 with the Royals? A-Rod's numbers look better, but I would think Sweeney's season was more impressive.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Merlin
There has been a lot of stastical analysis done in this area and the results are fairly conclusive...there is really no such thing as a player who can, over time, hit better in "clutch" situations. A player is who he is regardless of inning or score. Yes, over small samples you can see things but that is a stastical abberation. It is not a popular notion because we as people like the romantic notion of players being able to be better when it matters but the reality is different.

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Old 11-15-2005, 08:21 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Merlin
I really don't like that logic as it tends to evaluate the overall team (is it a deep team with a lot of people contributing vs. contributions from only a few) rather than the player.

If you don't want to use stats then what do we use? Tea Leaves? You can go by anecdotal evidence if you want but I prefer methods that stand up to scrutiny.
You can use stats in the equation, but it can't be solely about stats. And I can see why you'd want the results to stand up to scrutiny, because when people pass judgment on our society in the future, they'll evaluate us based on whether or not we chose an MVP with the best stats.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Merlin
There has been a lot of stastical analysis done in this area and the results are fairly conclusive...there is really no such thing as a player who can, over time, hit better in "clutch" situations. A player is who he is regardless of inning or score. Yes, over small samples you can see things but that is a stastical abberation. It is not a popular notion because we as people like the romantic notion of players being able to be better when it matters but the reality is different.
Obviously, no player succeeds in every pressure situation. Michael Jordan missed a ton of game-winning shots. But again, it's a choice by voters about which player is most valuable to his team.
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Old 11-15-2005, 08:39 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeD
A-Rod had more protection, so was pitched around less.
A-Rod had more RBI opportunities due to the previously mentioned deep lineup.
Yes, RBIs are more of a team stat than a player stat. If the guys in front of you can't get on base you can't drive them in. But overall Alex and David had about the same quality of players around them. Ortiz was protected by Man-Ram and Alex had Shef. Roughly a push. Ortiz had Damon setting the table and Alex had Jeter. Again, roughly a push.

As far as I can tell the biggest differences are due to park effects. Yankee Staduim being a real tough place for a right handed hitter to succeed.
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Old 11-15-2005, 08:42 AM   #14
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Now the real fun thing to throw into the mix is price. If you want to talk "value" then don't you need to consider what you had to pay for the performance? So if you want to look at who gave their team the most bang for the buck (the best value) I think you'd have to go with Hafner.

But I don't think anyone wants to think in those terms. And that's good because thay not as much fun.
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Old 11-15-2005, 09:20 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Merlin
Yes, RBIs are more of a team stat than a player stat. If the guys in front of you can't get on base you can't drive them in. But overall Alex and David had about the same quality of players around them. Ortiz was protected by Man-Ram and Alex had Shef. Roughly a push. Ortiz had Damon setting the table and Alex had Jeter. Again, roughly a push.

As far as I can tell the biggest differences are due to park effects. Yankee Staduim being a real tough place for a right handed hitter to succeed.

Ehh, I can't argue with you too much on your points. I still think the Yankees lineup was deeper (thereby helping A-Rod).

Both are good players and either would have been deserving. I'd rather have seen Papi get it, but hey A-Rod had a great year.
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Old 11-15-2005, 05:34 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Merlin
Now the real fun thing to throw into the mix is price. If you want to talk "value" then don't you need to consider what you had to pay for the performance? So if you want to look at who gave their team the most bang for the buck (the best value) I think you'd have to go with Hafner.

But I don't think anyone wants to think in those terms. And that's good because thay not as much fun.


its all about hee-sop-choi! lol i'm korean what do you expect ... kinda sad though... he the leagues lowest paid first-baseman ... makes league min...
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Old 11-15-2005, 07:15 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by zenbooty

But really, you gotta look at it like this. Who would be hurting worse, the Yanks without A-Rod, or the Sox without the Chocolate Babe Ruth? That one should be easy to anyone who watched the two teams all year. Big Papi in a landslide.

Then I am guessing you wanted Lee to win the NL mvp as wel huh?


The voters got it right with the NL and AL as much as I think Lee should of won it. If ortiz would of won it, then Edgar should of won atleast won one for the m's.
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Old 11-15-2005, 07:30 PM   #18
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Some interesting history on where the most valuable player award started:
Quote:
25 MARCH 1910 The Chalmers Auto Company decided to present a spanking new car to each league’s batting champion beginning at the end of the 1910 season. The first such American League award amounted to two: Ty Cobb and Nap Lajoie’s infamous neck-and-neck batting race, which ended in Cobb sitting out the final game to save his average and the St. Louis Browns’ third baseman playing back as far as he could get away with to help feed Lajoie the title by letting drop as many bunts for hits as he could lay down. Chalmers awarded both men a car, even though the American League ruled Cobb the champion upon learning of the Browns’ subterfuge. Chalmers decided to change in 1911: they now awarded a new car to each league’s most valuable player.
http://catbird.mostvaluablenetwork.com/index.php?p=347
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Old 11-15-2005, 07:43 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grubbie
Then I am guessing you wanted Lee to win the NL mvp as wel huh?
Who is Lee? And what is this "NL" you speak of?
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Old 11-16-2005, 12:02 AM   #20
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It will always be old school & the DH will never get the MVP.
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Old 11-16-2005, 12:13 AM   #21
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In related Yankee news:
~~ YANKEES, MATSUI REACH AGREEMENT ~~

The Yankees announced Tuesday that they have reached an agreement
with Hideki Matsui on a four-year contract extension through 2009.
In 2005, Matsui established single-season career highs in batting
average (.305), hits (192), doubles (45) and RBIs (116).

COMPLETE STORY >>
http://click.mlb.com/ct/click?q=61-x...q40kezFD73W9RR
MATSUI'S BIO >>
http://click.mlb.com/ct/click?q=a0-1...cUZiGO2eI2sRRR
MATSUI'S CAREER STATS >>
http://click.mlb.com/ct/click?q=b5-5...i1EN3l5uqLEdRR
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Old 11-16-2005, 05:49 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zenbooty
Who is Lee? And what is this "NL" you speak of?
I've always believed that the best ball was played on the junior curcuit.
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Old 11-16-2005, 06:23 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpikeDig
In related Yankee news:
~~ YANKEES, MATSUI REACH AGREEMENT ~~

The Yankees announced Tuesday that they have reached an agreement
with Hideki Matsui on a four-year contract extension through 2009.
In 2005, Matsui established single-season career highs in batting
average (.305), hits (192), doubles (45) and RBIs (116).

COMPLETE STORY >>
http://click.mlb.com/ct/click?q=61-x...q40kezFD73W9RR
MATSUI'S BIO >>
http://click.mlb.com/ct/click?q=a0-1...cUZiGO2eI2sRRR
MATSUI'S CAREER STATS >>
http://click.mlb.com/ct/click?q=b5-5...i1EN3l5uqLEdRR
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Old 11-16-2005, 07:33 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpikeDig
In related Yankee news:
~~ YANKEES, MATSUI REACH AGREEMENT ~~

The Yankees announced Tuesday that they have reached an agreement
with Hideki Matsui on a four-year contract extension through 2009.
In 2005, Matsui established single-season career highs in batting
average (.305), hits (192), doubles (45) and RBIs (116).

$52 million for Matsui?

Am I the only one who doesn't think he's worth it? Then again, we're talking the Yankees so throwing money away shouldn't be a surprise.

I just don't see it. By '09 that $13 million is gonna be a waste.
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Old 11-16-2005, 08:15 AM   #25
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Yeah, they are overpaying a bit (okay, more than a bit.) But I think it was important to him to make more money than Ichiro.

Also, the Yankees have several important things to accomplish this offseason....
1. A new centerfielder
2. Add some reliable middle relief
3. If Gordon goes to become a closer somewhere then they also need a new set up man
4. The bench needs more depth. Ruben Sierra just won't cut it any more
5. Backup/Next generation catcher. Gotta love Posada but catchers do have a limited life span and the future must be thought of.

So yeah, they could overpay to get this out of the way in order to move on to other things. Having the deadline built into his contract didn't hurt either.

Besides, with Kevin Brown and Bernie Williams contracts rolling off the books they have quite a bit of money being freed up.
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