Why do They Die?

zippyjuan · 07-26-2003, 09:50 AM

My Western Digital SE harddrive has passed on. That seems to have been why I was slowly losing data and programs. It was only about six months old. Why does this happen, generally speaking? It was in my small size bay just below the floppy drive. Is it too close to that? Could heat be a problem and if so would a hdd fan help? I have three fans on my Antec full tower - two rear, one side with Athlon XP. I just want to minimize the chances of it happening again (although there are never any guarantees).

Bires · 07-26-2003, 11:24 AM

I've never lost a harddrive, and many of my comps (HTPC) run hot. I figure if they are running within their specs (often upwards of 50C) then they should be fine.

Frequently, impact or manufacturing defects are the root of all harddrive evils. I still have two old WD Caviar drives that get tossed into backpacks and boxes, and they still work like a charm..back when harddrives cost big $$ and were made to last.

Joshua · 07-26-2003, 11:53 AM

Heat can DEFINITELY be a factor. We have thousands of monster servers at work where data is critical. If you pop open a full size rack server you'll prolly see between 8 and 12 large fans. Those servers sound like jet engines while running.

We also spend hundred of thousands of dollars on additional A/C in the Data Centers to keep the temp a cool 65 degrees...

Why is this you ask? Because heat is the single factor that will kill computer components faster than anything (short of dropping it on the ground).

djradam · 07-26-2003, 12:48 PM

not everything is perfect also, you could be the unluck 1 in 500,000 (or whatever number it is) people who have a faulty/defect drive

sorry to hear that though

djradam · 07-26-2003, 04:27 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DarkFury

Faster than STATIC?

i had my harddrive hanging outside of my case a few years ago .... after i touched it i saw a spark... yeah, it didn't work

i had two harddrives, but i moved all my data from the previous 2-3 years (pretty much everything i've saved on computers) to the drive i fried

i told maxtor it just stopped working

spigidygak · 07-26-2003, 04:43 PM

this really just supports my hessitance in supporting western digital still. I personally have had 4 western digital drives fail on me, 2 of them being SE flavor. I've had more bad luck with western digital than with ibm with the deathstars. And among people I know, more wd failures of all. My trust is in seagate still only one failure out of 8 drives and counting. Let me stress though I abuse the heck out of my drives with audio and video work and always having large file transfers going on.

Bires · 07-26-2003, 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by spigidygak
this really just supports my hessitance in supporting western digital

I tended to agree. WD used to be all I bought (back in the day...). Now, I use Maxtors. I own 5 40GB maxtors (4 in RAID 0 arrays) and one 80GB, all Maxtors. Not a single problem, ever.
Maybe I'm just lucky though, and the shoe is ready to drop

bachviet · 07-26-2003, 08:05 PM

My WD 120GB (SE) is fine after more than a year in service. A newer Maxtor 60GB had died on my and I RMAed to get a 80GB. It's still running I think in my friend's computer. I still like the WD better because of the longer warranty.

kimchicowboy · 07-26-2003, 08:26 PM

i had a seagate fail on me before after a few months. the RMA-ed drive is been working fine for 3 years. yay. i just got a new WD SE drive two months ago. i'll see how well it runs.

~~Cantacuzene~~ · 07-26-2003, 08:45 PM

I've never had a WD or Maxtor fail, but I've lost 3 seagates.

coleslaw · 07-26-2003, 09:14 PM

There are a number of issues that contribute to hard-drive failures. Heat is definitely an issue, but not as severe as some people might think. Manufacturing defects are probably the most common. Hard drive companies actually expect these failures; otherwise, their operating costs and the costs of parts that they buy from suppliers would be so high that no profit would be yielded. It's cheaper for them to replace 5% of all hard drives sold than to spend extra money on measures necessary to reduce those failures. However, I feel that one of the main reasons for failure is that the end user is not taking the necessary precautions to protect the drive from electro-static discharge during installation, etc. Hard drives are the most sensitive piece of computer hardware to ESD. Also, ESD failures do not necessarily appear immediately; an ESD event can cause a hard drive to become a "walking wounded" piece of hardware that will fail after hours, weeks or even years of use. So remember to properly ground yourself when you handle hard drives or any other piece of hardware. Buy a wrist strap if you want to be extra safe!

zippyjuan · 07-26-2003, 09:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DarkFury

1) how big was your power supply and does it work properly.

2) is the drive under warranty? Can you get a new one?

3) did you back up your data? Norton Ghost can be your BEST FRIEND in situations like this.

4) Sorry to hear about your pain... personally, I have 10 fans (low speed and silent) in my full tower case to keep cool air coming in and pushing hot air out.

1) Antec 430w- lots of good power. ASUS Probe shows very little variance in power
2)Should still be under warranty- still need to contact WD
3) No backup, but I really didn't lose anything important. I don't store important personal information on my comp
4)Thanks for the sympathy. sometimes things just die sooner than expected.

I didn't want to wait to RMA it so I now have an 80gb Maxtor- picked it because it was the best the local store had. Couldn't shop online without my machine. They are both 7200 rpm 8mb so maybe I'll raid them- although I will never need that much space. Maybe just keep for emergency.

Bires · 07-26-2003, 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by zippyjuan
They are both 7200 rpm 8mb so maybe I'll raid them

Bad Idea. RAID 0 is a risky venture as it is, as you only need one drive to go bad, and you lose the whole array, but trying to use two different drives (with two different platter sizes and seek times) is just asking for trouble. Best bet is to only use identical drives in RAID 0 arrays.

zippyjuan · 07-26-2003, 10:11 PM

Thanks Bires- as I said I really don't need that much storage anyways.

Devhux · 07-27-2003, 11:39 AM

All hard drives have the potential to fail...... I personally had my very first hard drive started dying a few months ago (a Maxtor 80GB fluid-bearing drive). Luckily the drive was still under warranty (back when they were three-year warranties), so Maxtor sent me a replacement drive promptly, and I was able to backup everything from the old drive before sending it back.

07-26-2003, 09:50 AM	#1
zippyjuan Picture of the Day Guru Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Sunny San Diego Posts: 8,756	Why do They Die? My Western Digital SE harddrive has passed on. That seems to have been why I was slowly losing data and programs. It was only about six months old. Why does this happen, generally speaking? It was in my small size bay just below the floppy drive. Is it too close to that? Could heat be a problem and if so would a hdd fan help? I have three fans on my Antec full tower - two rear, one side with Athlon XP. I just want to minimize the chances of it happening again (although there are never any guarantees). __________________ I add new pictures to my photo gallery pretty regularly. You can see them here if you are interested: http://www.pbase.com/jeffryz

07-26-2003, 11:24 AM	#2
Bires Admiral Join Date: May 2000 Posts: 5,064	I've never lost a harddrive, and many of my comps (HTPC) run hot. I figure if they are running within their specs (often upwards of 50C) then they should be fine. Frequently, impact or manufacturing defects are the root of all harddrive evils. I still have two old WD Caviar drives that get tossed into backpacks and boxes, and they still work like a charm..back when harddrives cost big $$ and were made to last. __________________ Five years...

07-26-2003, 11:53 AM	#3
Joshua Rear Admiral Upper Half Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Long Island, NY Posts: 3,390	Heat can DEFINITELY be a factor. We have thousands of monster servers at work where data is critical. If you pop open a full size rack server you'll prolly see between 8 and 12 large fans. Those servers sound like jet engines while running. We also spend hundred of thousands of dollars on additional A/C in the Data Centers to keep the temp a cool 65 degrees... Why is this you ask? Because heat is the single factor that will kill computer components faster than anything (short of dropping it on the ground). __________________ The Apexer formerly known as SnotRocket. "Like I **ing said, "Ok, so I hear it may be a repost. Blah But I had never seen it, so..." ** you Canta." -Jenny 12/4/2003

07-26-2003, 04:43 PM	#6
spigidygak Admiral Join Date: May 2000 Location: Redlands & San Diego, CA. Posts: 5,882	this really just supports my hessitance in supporting western digital still. I personally have had 4 western digital drives fail on me, 2 of them being SE flavor. I've had more bad luck with western digital than with ibm with the deathstars. And among people I know, more wd failures of all. My trust is in seagate still only one failure out of 8 drives and counting. Let me stress though I abuse the heck out of my drives with audio and video work and always having large file transfers going on. __________________

07-26-2003, 08:05 PM	#8
bachviet What's Da Pho*? Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: SoCal (714) Posts: 13,296	My WD 120GB (SE) is fine after more than a year in service. A newer Maxtor 60GB had died on my and I RMAed to get a 80GB. It's still running I think in my friend's computer. I still like the WD better because of the longer warranty. __________________ Dell Dimension 9200 \| Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600 (2.4GHz) \| 4x1GB DDR2 \| 256MB nVidia GeForce 8800GT Dell Studio 17 \| Intel Core i7-720QM (1.6GHz) \| 2x2GB DDR3 1066MHz \| 1GHz ATI Mobility Radeon HD 4650 Intel P4-C 3.0GHz \| ECS 865PE-A \| 3x512MB PC3200 \| 128MB PNY GeForce 6600GT

07-26-2003, 12:48 PM	#4
djradam Lieutenant Commander Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: metro detroit, mi Posts: 930	not everything is perfect also, you could be the unluck 1 in 500,000 (or whatever number it is) people who have a faulty/defect drive sorry to hear that though

07-26-2003, 08:26 PM	#9
kimchicowboy Admiral Join Date: May 2000 Location: in the middle of the pacific ocean Posts: 5,344	i had a seagate fail on me before after a few months. the RMA-ed drive is been working fine for 3 years. yay. i just got a new WD SE drive two months ago. i'll see how well it runs.

07-26-2003, 08:45 PM	#10
~~Cantacuzene~~ Banned Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Atlanta, Georgia, USA Posts: 8,700	I've never had a WD or Maxtor fail, but I've lost 3 seagates.

07-26-2003, 09:14 PM	#11
coleslaw Arrrhh! Join Date: May 2000 Location: LI NY Posts: 6,807	There are a number of issues that contribute to hard-drive failures. Heat is definitely an issue, but not as severe as some people might think. Manufacturing defects are probably the most common. Hard drive companies actually expect these failures; otherwise, their operating costs and the costs of parts that they buy from suppliers would be so high that no profit would be yielded. It's cheaper for them to replace 5% of all hard drives sold than to spend extra money on measures necessary to reduce those failures. However, I feel that one of the main reasons for failure is that the end user is not taking the necessary precautions to protect the drive from electro-static discharge during installation, etc. Hard drives are the most sensitive piece of computer hardware to ESD. Also, ESD failures do not necessarily appear immediately; an ESD event can cause a hard drive to become a "walking wounded" piece of hardware that will fail after hours, weeks or even years of use. So remember to properly ground yourself when you handle hard drives or any other piece of hardware. Buy a wrist strap if you want to be extra safe! __________________ A priest, a paladin and Varimathras walk into a bar...

07-26-2003, 10:11 PM	#14
zippyjuan Picture of the Day Guru Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Sunny San Diego Posts: 8,756	Thanks Bires- as I said I really don't need that much storage anyways.

07-27-2003, 11:39 AM	#15
Devhux Rear Admiral Lower Half Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Calgary Alberta Canada Posts: 2,511	All hard drives have the potential to fail...... I personally had my very first hard drive started dying a few months ago (a Maxtor 80GB fluid-bearing drive). Luckily the drive was still under warranty (back when they were three-year warranties), so Maxtor sent me a replacement drive promptly, and I was able to backup everything from the old drive before sending it back.

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