johnnymk

http://www.techzonez.com/comments.php?shownews=21865



A federal judge has ruled that two consumers can proceed with a lawsuit that claims Microsoft's "Windows Vista Capable" campaign was misleading.

Seattle District Court Judge Marsha Pechman on Tuesday rejected Microsoft's request for a dismissal of the case. Microsoft had argued that the plaintiffs, Dianne Kelley and Kenneth Hansen, lacked standing to bring the action.

A trial has been scheduled for October.

Kelley and Hansen claim they were the victims of "bait and switch" sales tactics by Microsoft and filed a class action suit against the software maker in March, alleging that it used deceptive marketing tactics to promote its new Windows Vista operating system.

Kelley and Hansen claim that many personal computers labeled as "Windows Vista Capable" before the operating system hit stores in January were hardly that. Microsoft assured consumers "that they were purchasing Vista capable machines when, in fact, they could obtain only a stripped down operating system," according to the initial complaint.

In contention is the very definition of Windows Vista itself. Kelley and Hansen argue that some computers sold as Vista-capable were capable of only running a basic version of the operating system that lacks Vista's defining features -- such as the space-age Aero interface, Flip 3-D navigation tools, and Media PC functions.

Napoleon54

I'm not sure I'm following the complaint. They're suing because the hardware can't make use of all of Vista's features?

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Jeffbx

Even worse, I think they're suing because AS SHIPPED, the hardware can't take advantage of the full suite of Vista features. However, if they only use basic features or upgrade the hardware, they would be OK. Sounds pretty frivilous to me.

Maarchk

I think.... that the hardware said vista capable. But they bought a little emachine that can't do anything and can't handle Aero and all that. And they say thats the "essence" of vista and hence they aren't getting what they paid for. If anything you'd think they'd sue the computer company because aren't they the people who deem their machine powerful enough to handle vista?

I bet MS doesn't check every config of every computer company... Vista, yep, yep, yep.. Wait a minute.. you were trying to slide by with only 512 mb of ram? Thats win 2k for you sucker!

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Napoleon54

That's kinda like saying that if Vista supports webcams, every computer that is "Vista compatible" must ship with a webcam. Heh.

LPMiller

To say Vista Capable, it does have to fit specs approved by Microsoft. The problem is Vista Capable really has no relationship with the level of Vista that machine can run. Their complaint is that all it means is you can run at a minimum, Home Basic (which btw will be extremely slow and limited). There is nothing in Vista Capable that says this, hence the lawsuit. The big selling features on vista, such as Aero, aren't in Basic. So I suspect they might actually win this suit.

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Thesifer

Even if they win, at most I can see a small "monetary settlement" and a requirement to specify each level of specs required on a "vista capable" machine. But really it's too late for that since Vista has been released.

But in reality they didn't lie, as it was "Vista Capable" just not "Vista with all the bells and whistles Capable"

These really all seem to be cases that should be brought against the company selling the PC's though and not Microsoft, but maybe I'm missing something.

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gear02

I think a lot of lawyers sue large corps (especially MSFT) because they have tons of money and think their lawyers just want to settle to avoid high costs.

I think though that more companies are now damning the cost and going after these kinds of cases just so they don't keep paying out money.

In this case, I can see it both ways. If it's Vista capable then you wonder if it's Home Basic or Ultimate capable. I think it's shortsighted marketing, but then again I think a lot of what MSFT marketing does is a little shortsighted.

Guess where I work.

gwilks98

I kind of agree with the lawsuit, though I would probably be suing the computer maker, not Microsoft.

I agree the sticker is misleading. If a car salesman told me my purchase was highway capable but I found out it only did 40 mph, I'd be pretty pissed.

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Paymaster

MS actually has two levels- "Vista Capable", and "Vista Premium Ready". They are described here.

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Thesifer

Then I think THAT should get them out of the lawsuit. If I were the judge, I think I would look at that.

Devhux

Here's a good one:

Does this mean I can sue a game manufacturer for telling me their game will run on a Geforce 6600, even though I'd have to turn down all the graphics sliders to minimum and live with 15-20 frames per second in order to play it?

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Thesifer

According to that Judge, yes!

I specifically tried that once, bought the cheapest "compatible" graphics card I could find to play a game. Man was that ever a pain. And the next game that came out was of course not able to be played.

gwilks98

Now wait a minute. Every game I've bought in the past 10 years has stated a required and a recommended hardware setup.

I really do feel the lawsuit is valid, but is pointing at the wrong company. Sure Microsoft has two levels, but what average joe is going to know that going into buying a setup? The hardware needs to do a better job stating it's capabilities if it's going to say it's capable of handling Microsoft's product. Otherwise, it's just flat out dishonest caveat emptor behavior. If the computer comes with Windows Vista and says it's capable of running it, I think the computer should be able to handle every portion of vista it claims it's capable of. (including flakey driver issues). But I place the responsibility on the manufacturer, not Microsoft.


But I guess it's up to the judge to decide to what degree "capable" means.

Thesifer

When it comes with the lowest version, and DOES run it.. then it's following through with what it said. It doesn't say .. "Also upgradeable to Vista Ultimate!"

But I've heard from more then one person, on just about any Vista machine, you're going to need more RAM then the computer ships with, unless you want a slow POS.

johnnymk

Computers today are appliances. There are numbskulls who use them and there are knowledgeable geeks who use them.

Since Microsoft is the OS of choice in America, they should go out of their way to inform the consumer of their different products and system requirements.

They have tried to persuade the consumer that Vista is the answer to everyone's dream, and it is proving itself not to be that way.

I feel that this is a valid lawsuit.

gwilks98

But to be fair, it doesn't say which version of vista it's capable with. Their complaint is that the computer was stating it was compatible before the OS was released, so did they have any reasonable way to check the requirements for all the versions Microsoft was going to release? (I dunno) and should the customer have to? (I dunno)

Thesifer

The question is, if these people truly need to run Ultimate Vista, why are they buying low-end PC's?! Boggles the mind.

Jeffbx

They don't need it. They probably don't even want it, but this is a good chance to sue Microsoft.

gwilks98

There are a lot of naive people out there, and a lot of dishonest or ignorant salesmen.

Markel

As well as a certain class of individuals who depend upon the legal system as their source of revenue and are always looking for a boost to their income stream....

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