Blu Ray, HD DVD Players Cost Over $400 To Build

[zippyjuan]

http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/multime...404193503.html

Blu-Ray, HD DVD Players Cost Over $400 to Build – Research Firm.
DVD Market Set to Grow till 2010, Claims Research Firm

Category: Multimedia

by Anton Shilov

[ 04/04/2006 | 07:35 PM ]


Even though the high definition video discs are just around the corner, due to the high manufacturing costs of Blu-ray and HD DVD players and broad availability of conventional DVD devices and content, the market of traditional DVD will continue growing, according to research firm In-Stat.

DVD player and recorder units will have a combined market of 176.6 million units sold worldwide in 2010, up from 140.8 million units in 2005. The forecast for 2006 predicts that Europe will be the strongest region for DVD players and recorders with a combined total of 38.4 million units sold.

The significant growth of the traditional DVD market is predicted as a result of very high manufacturing costs of blue-laser players: with the servo chipset, optical pick-up, H.264 decoder and royalties making up the majority of the cost, the initial estimates for the bill of materials for blue-laser disc players is over $400, according to In-Stat. Most of the costs are forecasted to decline considerably by 2010, except for royalties. The promise of the guaranteed premium royalty bounty is obviously at the heart the high definition DVD format wars.

“The future of this market though is all about high definition DVD players based on ‘blue laser’ technology; however, the future may be farther off than we would like. These players will enter the market at premium prices, and as there has been no compromise between the HD-DVD camp and the companies that sponsor Blu ray technology, a format battle seems inevitable. There will be some casualties, companies and consumers alike,” said Chris Kissel, In-Stat analyst.

It is generally believed that the HD DVD devices are less expensive to build than Blu-ray players, which seems to be correct, as the most affordable HD DVD announced so far is a $499 product from Toshiba, while the least expensive Blu-ray rival from Samsung costs $999. Nevertheless, as a result of cost-efficiency and availability, the market of DVD players and content will still have significant share.

“The DVD player market benefits from versatility in form factors. DVD players can be seen in portable renditions, or integrated with VCRs, or in the back panel seats of SUVs. While DVD recorders have come down in price, there is still delineation in the pricing of DVD players and DVD recorders- each represents a different value proposition,” said Mr. Kassel.

Traditional single-layer DVDs allow consumers to watch movies in 720x480 (NTSC) or 720x576 (PAL) resolution with Dolby Digital audio. The blue-laser discs will provide consumers 1920x1080 resolution as well as Dolby Digital Plus audio along with some additional interactive features.

Blu-ray and HD DVD formats compete for replacing the DVD standard. HD DVD discs can store up to 15GB on a single layer and up to 30GB on two layers. Its competitor, Blu-ray, can store up to 27GB per single layer and up to 50GB on two layers, but Blu-ray discs are more expensive to produce. The HD DVD is pushed aggressively by Toshiba and NEC as well as being standardized at the DVD Forum, which represents over 230 consumer electronics, information technology, and content companies worldwide. Blu-ray is backed by Sony and Panasonic, which are among the world’s largest makers of electronics. Among Hollywood studios HD is supported by Warner Bros. Studios, New Line Cinema, Paramount Pictures and Universal Pictures, whereas Sony Pictures, Walt Disney, Warner Bros. and Twentieth Century Fox endorse Blu-ray.

[InfiniteNothing]

I wonder what the dual format player will cost?

[johnnymk]

Of all the new high tech devices wich have come out in the last decade, I believe this will be the least to gain acceptance. Unless the players and the media becomes affordable...say $150-$200 for the player and 50 cents a pop for the media.

[Bires]

Of all the new high tech devices wich have come out in the last decade, I believe this will be the least to gain acceptance...

Yup. Most ppl (non-geek) think standard DVDs look great and won't want to pop for a $500 player and $30 discs.

[clutchy]

I'd say it'll be 5 to 10 years before we see any kind of moderate acceptance. Wasn't it the same for DVD?

[InfiniteNothing]

Well, I think DVD isn't good enough. Here's a neat comparison page between DVD and 1080i broadcast (10mbps mpeg2 and 24mbps mpeg2) To get to bluray quality extrapolate to 36mbps who knows what codec.

http://digg.com/movies/Fellowship_of...ity_comparison

[DarkFury]

Glad that I won't be a "first adopter" of this technology.

I'll just wait it out...

[bachviet]

Dual format player has to be in the $150 range before I buy.

[ArkiStan]

There are many upscaling DVD players that display regular DVDs at 720p and 1080i. Of course there not HD, but they significantly improve the image quality if you have a HD capable monitor. If you spend time on AV forums, you'll notice that many enthusiasts are using these as an interim solution until the HD-DVD format becomes more mainstream.

[InfiniteNothing]

As seen in the link I posted above. DVD doesn't even look that good in it's native (EDTV) format due to compression. If you click the picture, it certainly doesn't look good upscaled (though I admit it's just bicubic upscaling).

[Grubbie]

Of all the new high tech devices wich have come out in the last decade, I believe this will be the least to gain acceptance. Unless the players and the media becomes affordable...say $150-$200 for the player and 50 cents a pop for the media.

It will be slow to gain acceptance, but one will win. For people with HDTV's blueray and HDDVD will look great.

Personally I am waiting for the 360 HD-DVD player to come out. I'm figuring it will cost less then 200$ since it will use the 360.

[cheapchinese]

Personally I am waiting for the 360 HD-DVD player to come out. I'm figuring it will cost less then 200$ since it will use the 360.

xbox?

[Grubbie]

xbox?

Yes, the Xbox 360 HD-DVD player whenver it comes out. It should cost a lot less then a standalone HD-DVD player since the 360 would be used to handle the cpu and other stuff a normal HD-DVD player need.

[ArkiStan]

As seen in the link I posted above. DVD doesn't even look that good in it's native (EDTV) format due to compression. If you click the picture, it certainly doesn't look good upscaled (though I admit it's just bicubic upscaling).

Yes you can't compare it to bicubig upscaling. You have to see it to appreciate it. It's VERY different than watching DVDs at their native res. But as I said, it's obviously much worse than high-res.

[InfiniteNothing]

I have an upscaling DVD player and some computer upscalers. It doesn't do a great job. The mpeg2 codec just takes out a bit too much detail that can't be replaced. After all, it's doing, what? 50:1 compression?

[Houdini]

Yup. Most ppl (non-geek) think standard DVDs look great and won't want to pop for a $500 player and $30 discs.

And most non-audiovideophiles aren't rushing out to by widescreen HD tvs right now anyway. With a large tube TV and RGB connections, DVDs look pretty good to most people.

Of course, being an audiovideophile, I'd like to jump on the widescreen and hddvd bandwagon as soon as it becomes more affordable.

[ArkiStan]

I have an upscaling DVD player and some computer upscalers. It doesn't do a great job. The mpeg2 codec just takes out a bit too much detail that can't be replaced. After all, it's doing, what? 50:1 compression?

With upscaling players, you really get what you pay for. I don't know what player you're using, but most players (especially the ones under $100) don't do a good job of upscaling, in which case using a good progressive-scan player will look much better. With a little research, you'll find certain gems that do an amazing job of improving the image of regular DVDs at an affordable price, are raved about by enthusiasts, and get top-ranked in professional benchmarkings. But once again, if nothing less than HD quality pleases your refined eyes, no upscaling player in the world will tickle your fancy.

[Wizard]

Well, I think DVD isn't good enough. Here's a neat comparison page between DVD and 1080i broadcast (10mbps mpeg2 and 24mbps mpeg2) To get to bluray quality extrapolate to 36mbps who knows what codec.

http://digg.com/movies/Fellowship_of...ity_comparison

wow if hddvd/bluray will offer such a drastic difference, i could very well see myself making the investment

personally though i think this may have a negative impact on overall movie sales, it is getting so realistic visually that people will feel uncomfortable

[irwin]

it is getting so realistic visually that people will feel uncomfortable

Um...WHAT???

[Wizard]

Um...WHAT???

remember how people didn't like digital projection in theaters because the "feel" of the movie was gone. artifacting and cig burns on the reel was something people appreciated. the psychology behind it was that it helped people remember that they were seeing a movie and not real life. higher quality cinema, in particular the rather large difference illustrated by the link i refered to, will once again cause discomfort for a wide variety of people.

[johnnymk]

So if a movie is too real, people won't be able to tell the difference between reality and fiction?

[Wizard]

So if a movie is too real, people won't be able to tell the difference between reality and fiction?

well that's where it gets weird, because people recognize it is not a real occurance but the sheer reality of the vividness is enough to cause discomfort.

remember when movies first started, one of the first films was that of a train heading towards the camera. when it was shown for the first time everyone ducked and many people screamed. now we would see that and laugh at how obviously it is not actually occurring, but as technology advances discerning real from fake gets harder.

[Houdini]

remember how people didn't like digital projection in theaters because the "feel" of the movie was gone. artifacting and cig burns on the reel was something people appreciated. the psychology behind it was that it helped people remember that they were seeing a movie and not real life. higher quality cinema, in particular the rather large difference illustrated by the link i refered to, will once again cause discomfort for a wide variety of people.

I had not thought of it from that angle. As a film purist I did miss the cig burns/reel changes on the only diq. proj. movie I've seen in a theater.

[InfiniteNothing]

With upscaling players, you really get what you pay for. I don't know what player you're using, but most players (especially the ones under $100) don't do a good job of upscaling, in which case using a good progressive-scan player will look much better. With a little research, you'll find certain gems that do an amazing job of improving the image of regular DVDs at an affordable price, are raved about by enthusiasts, and get top-ranked in professional benchmarkings. But once again, if nothing less than HD quality pleases your refined eyes, no upscaling player in the world will tickle your fancy.

Yes, there are good upscaling DVD players but they are good compared to what? You can't add detail that isn't there, you can only guess at it.

[ArkiStan]

I just realized that I could have saved a lot of time trying to convince you if I hadn't overlooked something you said before.

As seen in the link I posted above. DVD doesn't even look that good in it's native (EDTV) format due to compression.

You're so purist that you can't even watch DVDs to begin with. I've spent plenty of time on AV forums and have seen my share of snobby videophiles, but I have never seen somebody with senses so refined that DVDs are just not good enough. Just curious. Do you still watch DVDs? And if you do, is it always using a 480p TV?

[InfiniteNothing]

I guess I didn't make it clear. DVD doesn't look good at 480P compared to HDTV at 480P. I imagine that HDTV doesn't look good at 720P compared to the HDDVD/BD formats. On the other and DVD does look good at 480P compared to VHS at 480P.

In terms of being a purist I don't believe that any media is perfect. Photographic media and display media simply don't have the contrast ratio for perfection. A perfect display would need to be able to light my living room like the sun. Also, we're still stuck in 2D

[shocky123]

I guess I didn't make it clear. DVD doesn't look good at 480P compared to HDTV at 480P. I imagine that HDTV doesn't look good at 720P compared to the HDDVD/BD formats. On the other and DVD does look good at 480P compared to VHS at 480P.

In terms of being a purist I don't believe that any media is perfect. Photographic media and display media simply don't have the contrast ratio for perfection. A perfect display would need to be able to light my living room like the sun. Also, we're still stuck in 2D

LOL, heck, by all means, please do invent the medium to transmit 3+Dimensional media

We need people like you in the industry, at least we can set our goals high rather than something like... "I'll just add jiggahertz to make it faster", we definitely need : "2D.. WTF!?!?! I want 7-D TV's in every household by yesterday!"

[Markel]

For an amusing read on the HD/Blu Ray situation: link.